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Bergantino B/Amp at NAMM

#2,022
Tech question here. I have been using my B/AMP DI output to FOH at a variety of worship services without any stage amp and using IEMs. A couple of FOH guys have been startled at the high level of the output and it turns into a bit of a "what the heck are you using" conversation. One guy had me trim down the input gain on the B/Amp to get the DI signal to a level he could use. Of course that affects the gain structure in the B/Amp, effects, etc. Any thoughts on reducing the DI output or how to handle the FOH guys? I always initially respond with suggesting they toggle their input's mic/line switch if they have one.

On the other hand, another FOH guy loved by B/Amp DI tone so much they had a group huddle around the amp with a "hey we have to get one of these" conversation.
 
#2,023
projectapollo said:
Tech question here. I have been using my B/AMP DI output to FOH at a variety of worship services without any stage amp and using IEMs. A couple of FOH guys have been startled at the high level of the output and it turns into a bit of a "what the heck are you using" conversation. One guy had me trim down the input gain on the B/Amp to get the DI signal to a level he could use. Of course that affects the gain structure in the B/Amp, effects, etc. Any thoughts on reducing the DI output or how to handle the FOH guys? I always initially respond with suggesting they toggle their input's mic/line switch if they have one.

On the other hand, another FOH guy loved by B/Amp DI tone so much they had a group huddle around the amp with a "hey we have to get one of these" conversation.
Click to expand...
If it continues to be an issue (which I don't understand to be honest) reach out to me and I can send you a new firmware with a padded down DI. I would just need to know how much you would like to pad it down.
 
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#2,024
projectapollo said:
Tech question here. I have been using my B/AMP DI output to FOH at a variety of worship services without any stage amp and using IEMs. A couple of FOH guys have been startled at the high level of the output and it turns into a bit of a "what the heck are you using" conversation. One guy had me trim down the input gain on the B/Amp to get the DI signal to a level he could use. Of course that affects the gain structure in the B/Amp, effects, etc. Any thoughts on reducing the DI output or how to handle the FOH guys? I always initially respond with suggesting they toggle their input's mic/line switch if they have one.

On the other hand, another FOH guy loved by B/Amp DI tone so much they had a group huddle around the amp with a "hey we have to get one of these" conversation.
Click to expand...

I've gigged the B|Amp hundreds of times and have used it to track in the studio for the last couple of years and I've never heard a peep about this issue. Very strange.
 
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#2,025
projectapollo said:
Tech question here. I have been using my B/AMP DI output to FOH at a variety of worship services without any stage amp and using IEMs. A couple of FOH guys have been startled at the high level of the output and it turns into a bit of a "what the heck are you using" conversation. One guy had me trim down the input gain on the B/Amp to get the DI signal to a level he could use. Of course that affects the gain structure in the B/Amp, effects, etc. Any thoughts on reducing the DI output or how to handle the FOH guys? I always initially respond with suggesting they toggle their input's mic/line switch if they have one.

On the other hand, another FOH guy loved by B/Amp DI tone so much they had a group huddle around the amp with a "hey we have to get one of these" conversation.
Click to expand...
That's interesting. I got the same reaction regarding DI output from my church FOH guy with a B|Amp and (separately) with a Mesa Subway Plus Bass DI-Preamp. I pointed out that he can adjust gain at the board, but he seems to have it in his head that the "unity gain" knob positions must be ridgidly adhered to. Jim -- it could be useful to have a firmware version with a padded down DI if that's not too time-consuming. I'm thinking maybe 6dB -- does that sound about right?
 
#2,026
Is there a DI Output spec on the B/Amp, like a voltage range or dB out? I looked in the manual and none was specified. I assume its set to an industry standard for line level instruments.

My assumption to this point has been the FOH guys not understanding the principles for trimming their console inputs. (I was taught to set the input fader to 0, then trim the input knob until the instrument average shows 0 dB on the VU meter.).

One console was a Beringer digital thing. (My studio engineer experience is from the late 70s/early 80s so I am dated.). I personally went to the console looking for the mic/line input sensitivity switch and was confused when there was none. All input trimming is done on the digital side using a single knob. So, I don't know how these modern consoles get their input sensitivity to match the device coming in. Perhaps its all automatic these days.
 
#2,027
gregbackstrom said:
That's interesting. I got the same reaction regarding DI output from my church FOH guy with a B|Amp and (separately) with a Mesa Subway Plus Bass DI-Preamp. I pointed out that he can adjust gain at the board, but he seems to have it in his head that the "unity gain" knob positions must be ridgidly adhered to. Jim -- it could be useful to have a firmware version with a padded down DI if that's not too time-consuming. I'm thinking maybe 6dB -- does that sound about right?
Click to expand...
I wish I could do a firmware update which gives these sound guys a " dope slap upside the head"!;-} But since technology does not allow, if you need a toned down DI let me know. I'm thinking more like 10db but 6db would be a good start. Personally, it's not worth making it official given I've only heard from 2 or 3 people about this, and it's not an issue with the B|AMP, but an issue with incompetent sound men
.
 
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#2,028
projectapollo said:
Is there a DI Output spec on the B/Amp, like a voltage range or dB out? I looked in the manual and none was specified. I assume its set to an industry standard for line level instruments.

My assumption to this point has been the FOH guys not understanding the principles for trimming their console inputs. (I was taught to set the input fader to 0, then trim the input knob until the instrument average shows 0 dB on the VU meter.).

One console was a Beringer digital thing. (My studio engineer experience is from the late 70s/early 80s so I am dated.). I personally went to the console looking for the mic/line input sensitivity switch and was confused when there was none. All input trimming is done on the digital side using a single knob. So, I don't know how these modern consoles get their input sensitivity to match the device coming in. Perhaps its all automatic these days.
Click to expand...
Usually amp DI's are mic-level--not line level. Line level (about a volt, +/-) is what you output from an unbalanced preamp output.
 
#2,030
Jim Bergantino said:
I wish I could do a firmware update which gives these sound guys a " dope slap upside the head"!;-} But since technology does not allow, if you need a toned down DI let me know. I'm thinking more like 10db but 6db would be a good start. Personally, it's not worth making it official given I've only heard from 2 or 3 people about this, and it's not an issue with the B|AMP, but an issue with incompetent sound men
.
Click to expand...
Jim, this is definitely not a "need," so only do this if you feel like playing with it. But I'd love the "dope slap upside the head" effect! I think a few of us would pitch on on this one. (Maybe use the Aux attenuator to adjust the force of the slap?)
 
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#2,031
gregbackstrom said:
Usually amp DI's are mic-level--not line level. Line level (about a volt, +/-) is what you output from an unbalanced preamp output.
Click to expand...
Understood, but as I see it, an amp is not a mic. Now if you were to plug a passive bass straight into a passive DI and then into the board you would get something closer to a mic than a line output (roughly 0.1-0.25V). But if you're using an active bass with eq, you could easily swing +/- 1-2 Volts or more at the bass's output. These sound guys just need to learn how to use their gear. Most decent boards have a pad button and/or trim pot and any competent sound guy should be able to get a +/-1V input signal to easily work with a board whose internal circuitry is typically running betweem +/- 15Volt rails (or even +/- 18V).
 
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#2,032
Jim Bergantino said:
Understood, but as I see it, an amp is not a mic. Now if you were to plug a passive bass straight into a passive DI and then into the board you would get something closer to a mic than a line output (roughly 0.1-0.25V). But if you're using an active bass with eq, you could easily swing +/- 1-2 Volts or more at the bass's output. These sound guys just need to learn how to use their gear. Most decent boards have a pad button and/or trim pot and any competent sound guy should be able to get a +/-1V input signal to easily work with a board whose internal circuitry is typically running betweem +/- 15Volt rails (or even +/- 18V).
Click to expand...
We could probably train 'em up real good with your new Dope Slap Upside The Head effect. Maybe build it in to the Pre/Post switch? (That would give new meaning to the term "Post.")
 
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#2,034
bikeplate said:
Never had a DI issue in the 2 years ive gigged my B Amp and i gig alot and its always DI'd to FOH
Click to expand...
Same. I'm usually at festivals and corporate functions and professional audio visual teams are running sound and have had not a one complaint using the DI.
Usually they supply their own DI, but I'll say Im using the BAmp etc... and they've all been impressed with the sound.
Many compliments, no complaints. - that's my experience.
 
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#2,036
20191026_221734.jpg

The new footswitch is SWEET! Looking forward to gigs this weekend using it.
 
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#2,039
Rocksolid said:
Feel like doing straight trades on the original footswitch @Jim Bergantino? This new one looks heaps better!
Click to expand...
It is. But you won't need to purchase our programmed dongle since it will work fine with the new pedal. This would save you $50 and your older pedal can be used or sold as a page turner.
 
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