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Bergantino

#161
No time to go into an in-depth report, but suffice to say the EBS TD660 and HT112ER combination played very well together last night, if seemingly a bit underpowered into the 8-ohm cab with EB.

I used a Jazz fretless and the '42 Kay M1 upright (Fishman Full Circle pickup and Platinum Pro pre). The upright especially sounded very natural with full lows and full, tight low mids. The rig simply reproduced exactly the tone of the upright at a suprising volume, without feedback issues, in a four-piece ensemble at a mid-sized dinner club. The TD660 and HT112ER combo is certainly a keeper for the upright.

The tone with the fretless was no less pleasing, but volume could possibly be a concern in some situations using just the 8-ohm cab and EB. Will try it with the 4-ohm 410XLT and HT322 cabs and see how that goes.

I sure hope the TD660 doesn't leave me hungry for more power in the long run. I have grown quite accustomed to the CA9's output over the years and am hoping this can be a lighter weight alternative.

The HT112ER is everything it is reported to be and then some.
 
#162
JOME77 said:
You fellows really have me Gassing for a Berg 112 now!

That was my original intent but the good deal came up on the used TC RS112 and I had to give it a try.

To make matters worse, a local player is willing to trade me his Thunderfunk 550B and Berg HT112 for my TC RH450 & RS112 cabinet. And of course I have a soft spot for Tfunk & Berg's!

And you guys are not helping me any posting these killer sound clips! :rollno:
Click to expand...

I weakened! :eek:

The Thunderfunk 550B and Berg HT-112 is now in my music room! :bassist:

....hard to teach an old dog new tricks!:D
 
#164
Tone Meister said:
No time to go into an in-depth report, but suffice to say the EBS TD660 and HT112ER combination played very well together last night, if seemingly a bit underpowered into the 8-ohm cab with EB.

I used a Jazz fretless and the '42 Kay M1 upright (Fishman Full Circle pickup and Platinum Pro pre). The upright especially sounded very natural with full lows and full, tight low mids. The rig simply reproduced exactly the tone of the upright at a suprising volume, without feedback issues, in a four-piece ensemble at a mid-sized dinner club. The TD660 and HT112ER combo is certainly a keeper for the upright.

The tone with the fretless was no less pleasing, but volume could possibly be a concern in some situations using just the 8-ohm cab and EB. Will try it with the 4-ohm 410XLT and HT322 cabs and see how that goes.

I sure hope the TD660 doesn't leave me hungry for more power in the long run. I have grown quite accustomed to the CA9's output over the years and am hoping this can be a lighter weight alternative.

The HT112ER is everything it is reported to be and then some.
Click to expand...

Don't get me started on the CA9! In terms of tone and sheer power, that is THE most perfect power amp that exists for a bass rig. IMHO, of course. In terms of portability... not so much :help:

I cried a little on the inside when I sold my CA9 and went with my current CA6. They weigh pretty much the same, the 6 just has less juice to give. I never got above 2 on my CA9, so I just didn't need all that power. Heck, I still never get above 4 or 5 on my CA6 (although that might change with the NV610).

On the TD660, that should have plenty of power to give. You might have it turned up to 6-7 instead of 2-3, but it should stay clean for you. And at 6 or 7, that head should be REALLY loud if you've got your preamp gain dialed in right.

I'm sure you already know this, but I'll mention it in case it will benefit someone else. To maximize the gain on the front end of the amp, turn the "GAIN" knob up until the "peak" light flickers when you play pretty hard. Once it starts flickering, turn GAIN back down just a hair. That will give you more range on the master volume end of things, and it'll feel like you have more power to spare.

There's no active/passive switch on the TD-660, so you just have to dial in that gain knob whenever you switch instruments. Or you can use an outboard mixer or pedal (like the BassBone) to bring all your instruments to the same signal level.

You sound like an old hand at this bass thing, so I doubt I've told you anything new. But maybe it triggered an ah-ha for somebody else!
 
#165
I bought a Roscoe Century Standard from you guys last December (the red one). It's the finest bass I've ever owned and I've had a few. My first was a 1965 Gibson EB-0, bought new.

Glad you got the Bergantino line. I'm using 2 AE-112's with a Carvin BX500 and I think it sounds great. I don't play as loud as a lot of you younger guys so it suits me just fine. Plus, 2 trips from car to stage and I'm done, not even breaking a sweat.
 
#166
RocketMusic said:
Don't get me started on the CA9! In terms of tone and sheer power, that is THE most perfect power amp that exists for a bass rig ...

.... On the TD660, that should have plenty of power to give. You might have it turned up to 6-7 instead of 2-3, but it should stay clean for you. And at 6 or 7, that head should be REALLY loud if you've got your preamp gain dialed in right ...

... To maximize the gain on the front end of the amp, turn the "GAIN" knob up until the "peak" light flickers when you play pretty hard. Once it starts flickering, turn GAIN back down just a hair. That will give you more range on the master volume end of things, and it'll feel like you have more power to spare ...
Click to expand...

Thanks for your comments Greg. You'll remember me telling you I wouldn't be replacing my main big stage rig with the TD660. This setup will keep me from having to lug the rack places it's not needed.

I agree, nothing pumps like the CA9 into a couple of 410XLT's or a pair of HT322's, NOTHING. Maybe that is the reason I perceive the EBS being down on power. I'll report back after I've done a gig with the TD660 into one or two of the bigger cabs.

I did set the gain structure according the the manual and it certainly makes a big difference. The drive section has a profound influence on output as well. At any rate, this particular setup is very natural sounding and puts out serious grunt with both fretless basses. I am loving the ER cab, just loving it.

I will continue to be in the hunt for one of the bantam weight heads though. I'm really liking the Shuttle based on the clips I've heard. I just have to be sure it will work as well with upright as it does with EB.

Thanks again Greg!
 
#167
Tone Meister said:
Thanks for your comments Greg. You'll remember me telling you I wouldn't be replacing my main big stage rig with the TD660. This setup will keep me from having to lug the rack places it's not needed.

I agree, nothing pumps like the CA9 into a couple of 410XLT's or a pair of HT322's, NOTHING. Maybe that is the reason I perceive the EBS being down on power. I'll report back after I've done a gig with the TD660 into one or two of the bigger cabs.

I did set the gain structure according the the manual and it certainly makes a big difference. The drive section has a profound influence on output as well. At any rate, this particular setup is very natural sounding and puts out serious grunt with both fretless basses. I am loving the ER cab, just loving it.

I will continue to be in the hunt for one of the bantam weight heads though. I'm really liking the Shuttle based on the clips I've heard. I just have to be sure it will work as well with upright as it does with EB. Of course the best rig is my CA( with the Demeter.

Thanks again Greg!
Click to expand...

I'm finding that the Eden WT400 works extremely well with the ER cabs for EB and upright. The tone is more solid IMO than the Shuttle. Of course my best rig is the CA9 with the Demeter.:hyper:
 
#168
Thanks for your comments BJ.

What I am looking to do is power the single Berg 1x12 or one of my bigger cabs with a light weight alternative for electric and double bass. Was looking at the Shuttle and the EA Doubler, but I would have to travel in order to audition either one.

What does the WT400 weigh?
 
#172
so, i finally had the chance to listen to the clips, albeit with iphone headphones--first off, great playing Greg and Jerry! Jerry, i envy your gigs, you guys play some great stuff, lots of fun!

Greg--awesome comparison here, and all 3 sounded good!

the rh450 definitely has some lower mid content going for sure, and it sounds pretty good in the mix, but there is something about it when soloed that i can't pinpoint that i'm not digging as much, moreso the high notes sound thinner and not as wide a low end as the 9.0

the 9.0 sounds very similar to the 6.0, but with a fuller low end, and is a great matchup with the roscoe you were using...it sat in the mix great and sounded good soloed, but the solo sound does have some of that upper mid content that the 6.0 has that seems to be kind of inherent in these amps--it's not bad, but definitely present

now for the troubling part, to my back at least...i think i like the CA6/Alembic the best:eek:...the 9.0 is a close second, and in reality, seems to hit really really hard for a micro head, and the rh450 is not lagging too far behind either

...but the crest/pre sound just has a 'heft' to each note that really fills out the sound and is audible without being harsh at all--those muted notes you do towards the end really show how hard this combo hits in terms of feeling the notes
 
#179
()smoke() said:
so, i finally had the chance to listen to the clips, albeit with iphone headphones--first off, great playing Greg and Jerry! Jerry, i envy your gigs, you guys play some great stuff, lots of fun!

Greg--awesome comparison here, and all 3 sounded good!

the rh450 definitely has some lower mid content going for sure, and it sounds pretty good in the mix, but there is something about it when soloed that i can't pinpoint that i'm not digging as much, moreso the high notes sound thinner and not as wide a low end as the 9.0

the 9.0 sounds very similar to the 6.0, but with a fuller low end, and is a great matchup with the roscoe you were using...it sat in the mix great and sounded good soloed, but the solo sound does have some of that upper mid content that the 6.0 has that seems to be kind of inherent in these amps--it's not bad, but definitely present

now for the troubling part, to my back at least...i think i like the CA6/Alembic the best:eek:...the 9.0 is a close second, and in reality, seems to hit really really hard for a micro head, and the rh450 is not lagging too far behind either

...but the crest/pre sound just has a 'heft' to each note that really fills out the sound and is audible without being harsh at all--those muted notes you do towards the end really show how hard this combo hits in terms of feeling the notes
Click to expand...

By the way - you are doing an awesome job of converting what you hear into words. Your assessment is spot on with my own.

All I'll add is that I intentionally set all of the amps flat. Lots of guys put heavy stock into that kind of comparison, so I give them what they want. If it were me, I'd rather hear all of the amps set as well as the demonstrator could set them. So then you'd be comparing the "best" sound of Amp A against the "best" sound of Amp B. Of course, "best" is highly subjective, so setting all of the amps flat is just the easiest thing to do.

Unfortunately for the RH-450, it's flat setting is just not as bright as the other amps. A big part of me feels like I didn't give it a fair shake by sticking to the "flat" criteria.

And just so everyone knows, "flat" on the F1X preamp is 2/10/2 on TMB. 5/5/5 on the F1X would be overly bassy and mid scooped. I imagine the RH-450 has something similar going on where 5/5/5 is not really flat.
 
#180
I saved these clips to the hard drive and have been listening to both for about the last half hour. My favorite being the Genz. Outside of the Alembic/Crest combo which does indeed sound great but also costs as much as two of either of the other heads.

I liked the Genz because

A It cuts like a hot knife through butta.

B Great clarity through the entire range without being harsh or muddled.

I'd like to like the TC for it's "all in one" feature set but the "low mid" in the clip seemed too much to the point that it lost it's clarity (at least with the Roscoe).

I know it's all subjective and relative to preference but the Genz was indeed my favorite under 50lbs :D

God Bless, Ray
 

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