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Club Alleva-Coppolo (Part 13)

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#521
peterpalmieri said:
My reaction and posts were very similar when the LM5 arrived, no shame in it!
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Thanks man

Am I ever glad to hear that cuz I was feeling a bit emotional over my first rant. Then the bass ( LM 5 ) took me to the side ( recorded with it and had a little "walk thru" with me and I was just FINE ).:D

For the record, I believe it was another TBer mentioning feeling bad for ones who make purchases based on hype and the internet-I AM NOT ONE OF THEM.

I talked to Jimmy back in 2006 when I had seen Ethan Farmer perform in a town I was living in at the time, with Toni Braxton and I couldn`t figure out what bass he was playing ( I have ran my own high end and vintage bass shop for some time and know a few of the top players and luthiers in the bass world and thus was familiar with most basses)..but the headstock baffled me. Did my research and the following year played a 4 string LPB that an ALLEVA artist in LA owns. I too have been on the phone with Jason L in the last year ( NICE CAT ) and he had great things to say about AC basses and encouraged me along with the above artist to get one--these are the $*?"

Too, significant local pro players/ collectors (4) who I respect in the biz, SWEAR by ALLEVA COPPOLA instruments.

Along with these great comments here on TB ( I only started reading these threads 2 months ago ).....and PM`s to many AC owners ( you know who you are guys- THANX !)

I was confident in taking the PLUNGE !

GLAD I did.:bassist:
 
#522
YCBass said:
How is my statement absurd or almost absurd?
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Becuase hearing what a stickler Jimmy is, I find it hard to believe that depending on the stash of ash he has at the moment, you may get a 13 lb bass or you may get a 10 lb bass. I would assume that he has a weight range in mind for specific models, and he chooses his lumber accordingly. It's not rocket science, and I would fully expect such effort for a bass in this price range. You made it sound like the weight of a batch of basses depend only of the wood he has at that time. I don't think Jimmy himself would say this is true, and I thought he did say the LMs would be heavier from some point on...(?)

As a said, wood selection, and it's effect on tone, is specifically one of the things you pay a high end builder/luthier for. You and Kirk keep talking about how you chose the wood for your bass to get the weight you wanted...that should be something that Jimmy should do for anyone coughing up 4k+ for a bass, and I'm sure he would (?). It happens all the time with others (and no one is talking about an exact weight down to the gram).

I think Jimmy may be getting slightly mis-represented by his own representatives/endorsers here and I'm somehow defending him. It doesn't sound like he needs any more such problems right now.

Oh, and I have ordered basses with a specific target wieght... actually have one coming in a few weeks. There was no hesitation on the part of the builder....He's nailed it in the past and I expect he will again.
 
#523
bassarama said:
Thanks man

Am I ever glad to hear that cuz I was feeling a bit emotional over my first rant. Then the bass ( LM 5 ) took me to the side ( recorded with it and had a little "walk thru" with me and I was just FINE ).:D
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I currently have 3 basses: LM5, LG5 & Valenti. On occasion I love all these basses for what they do, sometimes I really feel like one is significantly BETTER then the others and then again sometimes I think I should just get rid of all of them and start over.
 
#524
YCBass said:
When I chose the Ash for mine, the lightest half I could find was 7.xx lbs. and I chose the 2 lightest pieces as the rest were 8 lbs. and above...
...
That's what he had at the time. So as I referred to earlier, if the wood is not available at the moment then you gotta wait til he gets more.
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Jason, why does it have to be limited to what he has in the shop at the time? As far as I know, ash is typically readily available, so it shouldn't be that big of a deal, or take very long, to get more and specifically pick out the lighter stuff for that purchase... just to have on-hand, so he does have it available when a customer asks for it.

I just HAVE to believe he's gotten more requests for lighter ash basses than the few I know of, so if I were him, I would have done this months ago, and just eliminated the "issue". I simply don't understand why this is even a problem at all.

If you have builders out there that are willing to commit to an exact weight then you should order with them.
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I would also strongly advise you to resist the urge to make comments that have the tone of "if you don't like it, go elsewhere". You have to remember you're fronting Jimmy more officially now, so your comments carry more weight, and directly affect his business.
 
#527
I know he does this for everyone as does Roger..So you are Correct... He always trys to find the piece of wood asked for by a person.. withing reason... He, like Roger ...and Roger to more of an extent has an hourly rate as in all bizz.. I think a person and master like sadowsky has a fairly high hourly rate if that is what you broke it down to... But I think you know what i am trying to say here...

The Allevas are full size ( not dinky bodies and they are not chambered).. when i spoke with Roger a few years ago , he said the one reason that he went with clambering is because the weight of Alder had been going up in recent years. So that is one reason he decided to chamber the bodies. I think you can find that on his website too..And it works out very well too.. as far as the weight issue and tone issues.... I love my sadowsky basses.

Now, Jimmy's basses are not Chambered and they are also "full size Bodies." To ergonomically feel like a vintage bass... That alone is going to add weight (full size , non-chamber ) to the bass since it is full size.. So an Alleva 5 string at 9 to 10+oz is not really that out of line.. They balance well, and as far as people say here and other places, they play and sound pretty good too...
Of course you get a few folks that want it HEAVY like Tom Barney, and others that like it light, such as me or hugh mcdonald.
I have played many ACs and most fall within that 9+ to 10 pound range for a 5 string.. Then my NYC sadowsky is the heaviest sadowsky that i have ever played and it is a dinky size....Then the 4 string ACs seem to be less.... I feel that is all a reasonable weight considering they are a full size and non- chambered body..
If you happen to be in the neighbor hood, do as i said before, stop by and pick your body wood as i did... If not, specify what you want on the phone... As with many other satisfied customers, they get what they asked for...

They only way around the weight it is for him to also chamber his bodies.. but I know people would not like that since it is getting from the Alleva un-written mission statement and that would open another can of worms here..IMPO






Dave Hill said:
You and Kirk keep talking about how you chose the wood for your bass to get the weight you wanted...that should be something that Jimmy should do for anyone coughing up 4k+ for a bass, and I'm sure he would (?). It happens all the time with others (and no one is talking about an exact weight down to the gram).



.
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#528
Vic said:
Yohann, why does it have to be limited to what he has in the shop at the time? As far as I know, ash is typically readily available, so it shouldn't be that big of a deal, or take very long, to get more and specifically pick out the lighter stuff for that purchase... just to have on-hand, so he does have it available when a customer asks for it.

I just HAVE to believe he's gotten more requests for lighter ash basses than the few I know of, so if I were him, I would have done this months ago, and just eliminated the "issue". I simply don't understand why this is even a problem at all.

I would also strongly advise you to resist the urge to make comments that have the tone of "if you don't like it, go elsewhere". You have to remember you're fronting Jimmy more officially now, so your comments carry more weight, and directly affect his business.
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Fixed it for you (well, me really)...

Point well taken Vic, on both counts... And also Dave Hill's point as well. I only directly quote or speak for Jimmy when I know I've had the particular conversation with him, otherwise they're my personal presumptions on things.

As I've mentioned he's out of Ash at the moment so hopefully the next batch is better in terms of the mixture of both heavy and light pieces to accommodate the most number of players as possible... Unless he's really decided that the LM's will be on the heavy side going forward, I really gotta ask him.

And to Dave Hill... He does hand pick the woods for each order and always tries to accommodate, but the point I tried to make earlier is if the pieces that would hit your target weight aren't on hand at the moment then it might cause a delay to get those pieces, that's all. I don't know how often builders in general take trips to the lumber yard, unless they have their own, so time frame is the point I was trying to make... My point, not Jimmy's.

And just know that the concerns here are being heard and passed on, what Jimmy does with them is of course his call.
 
#530
svtb15 said:
I know he does this for everyone as does Roger...
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You seem to be pretty fixated on Roger as a comparison, but at least in my case, I'm not at all just thinking about his products. I'm also talking about many others who offer J style basses. Just FYI.

The Allevas are full size
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Yes, but the simple fact is, Jimmy's done it before, he should be able to do it again.

When i spoke with Roger a few years ago , he said the one reason that he went with clambering is because the weight of Alder had been going up in recent years. So that is one reason he decided to chamber the bodies.
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True, but Roger's chambered basses typically TOP OUT at 9 pounds or so. The average is closer to 8, so I still think we're in the ball park. And the Metro PJ5 I just got this spring is not chambered and is just under 9 pounds. Another J style bass I just got very recently was right at 9 pounds, non-chambered, ash. Bottom line is, I simply don't believe lighter ash isn't out there and available.

They only way around the weight it is for him to also chamber his bodies...
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Again, I don't believe that. Again, he's done it before, he should be able to repeat it. True that chambering would allow him to make lighter basses without relying as much on wood selection, but I simply don't believe, as you seem to indicate, that lighter ash doesn't exist anymore.

I do agree with one thing you said, however. I do think Jimmy should stick with his solid bodies.
 
#531
narud said:
dude its hype. its the internet, it happens. :D remember when matt power (jacochops) started posting about carey and everyone started ordering fodera inspired customs? then the nordy came out, orders ensue. ken gets an a/c, proclaims its the next coming of jesus and t/b gets all a twitter.

my personal view is that there is no real magic. its a guitar....its up to you to make it happen. some just get us there in a way we prefer more. at 5k, if its absolutely perfect, than its just doing what its supposed to (which it better for that price).
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Nope, my two A-C's are among the finest instruments I've ever owned or played (and at the time I bought them, they were VERY reasonably priced). Perfect fit and finish, light weight, fabulous sound, ridiculously stable neck, wonderful 'old wood', etc., etc., etc., and that unique 'vintage + A-C' tone and vibe. Unique IMO and IME.

I'm only commenting on what seems like 'issues' that have emerged since the move of the shop within the last 18 months or so. Disappointing, but I would hope that things get back to perfect eventually.

I look forward to being able to recommend these instruments again down the road.
 
#532
I dont recall ever saying anything that lighter ash is no longer available. Where do you see me saying anything like that.:rollno:


Vic said:
You seem to be pretty fixated on Roger as a comparison, but at least in my case, I'm not at all just thinking about his products. I'm also talking about many others who offer J style basses. Just FYI.

Yes, but the simple fact is, Jimmy's done it before, he should be able to do it again.

True, but Roger's chambered basses typically TOP OUT at 9 pounds or so. The average is closer to 8, so I still think we're in the ball park. And the Metro PJ5 I just got this spring is not chambered and is just under 9 pounds. Another J style bass I just got very recently was right at 9 pounds, non-chambered, ash. Bottom line is, I simply don't believe lighter ash isn't out there and available.

Again, I don't believe that. Again, he's done it before, he should be able to repeat it. True that chambering would allow him to make lighter basses without relying as much on wood selection, but I simply don't believe, as you seem to indicate, that lighter ash doesn't exist anymore.

I do agree with one thing you said, however. I do think Jimmy should stick with his solid bodies.
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#533
KJung said:
Nope, my two A-C's are among the finest instruments I've ever owned or played (and at the time I bought them, they were VERY reasonably priced). Perfect fit and finish, light weight, fabulous sound, ridiculously stable neck, wonderful 'old wood', etc., etc., etc., and that unique 'vintage + A-C' tone and vibe. Unique IMO and IME.

I'm only commenting on what seems like 'issues' that have emerged since the move of the shop within the last 18 months or so. Disappointing, but I would hope that things get back to perfect eventually.

I look forward to being able to recommend these instruments again down the road.
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yeah, but theyre the finest to you. i could play your lm5 and be completely underwhelmed. posters here look at the posts of some of the more vocal posters and base purchases off of them. hype doesnt have to be deceptive or misleading. enthusiastic posts leading to orders is hype.

the same 34.5 scale nordys that we really dislike are loved by others. all this stuff is very personal aside from quality issues.
 
#534
the one thing that i find about talkbass is not matter what you write.. someone will try to find something and pull it apart in one manner or the other to fit their mindset at that moment... . so no matter what, its always a cluster to one person or another... but hey, what fun would it be if everyone thought the same as the guy next door.. I love the bitchfest.. i just hate to type.


YCBass said:
Fixed it for you (well, me really)...

Point well taken Vic, on both counts... And also Dave Hill's point as well. I only directly quote or speak for Jimmy when I know I've had the particular conversation with him, otherwise they're my personal presumptions on things.

As I've mentioned he's out of Ash at the moment so hopefully the next batch is better in terms of the mixture of both heavy and light pieces to accommodate the most number of players as possible... Unless he's really decided that the LM's will be on the heavy side going forward, I really gotta ask him.

And to Dave Hill... He does hand pick the woods for each order and always tries to accommodate, but the point I tried to make earlier is if the pieces that would hit your target weight aren't on hand at the moment then it might cause a delay to get those pieces, that's all. I don't know how often builders in general take trips to the lumber yard, unless they have their own, so time frame is the point I was trying to make... My point, not Jimmy's.

And just know that the concerns here are being heard and passed on, what Jimmy does with them is of course his call.
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#535
svtb15 said:
I dont recall ever saying anything that lighter ash is no longer available. Where do you see me saying anything like that.:rollno:
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Your comments about wood getting heavier, and that chambering would be the only way to get the weight down. At least to me, your entire post seemed to have the drift that you can't get light enough ash to get an AC LM down to 9 pounds unless you chamber it.
 
#536
narud said:
yeah, but theyre the finest to you. i could play your lm5 and be completely underwhelmed. posters here look at the posts of some of the more vocal posters and base purchases off of them. hype doesnt have to be deceptive or misleading. enthusiastic posts leading to orders is hype.

the same 34.5 scale nordys that we really dislike are loved by others. all this stuff is very personal aside from quality issues.
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+1 That's why it is so important to describe things in as technical a way as you can (fit and finish, specs, etc.), and then put up clips to 'back up' and 'clarify' what you are saying. TB is a great source of input, since virtually none of us can try a bass before buying (I haven't had that luxury for at least 15 years). As long as one articulates WHY they like and dislike basses and amps, I find TB probably the best source around, and have made many successful purchases based on TB info.

I also agree that enthusiasm should be based on carefully considered reasoning, and should always include the positives and the negatives of any piece of gear.

+1 though, I find 'brand lovers' and 'brand haters' equally useless. It's all about trying to be as 'unbiased' as possible, and providing detailed reasons WHY you love or dislike something.

Some will support a brand blindly, even when it is having some issues. Some will hammer on a brand with 100% of the time. I find each of these approaches 'less than useful':p:smug:
 
#537
narud said:
yeah, but theyre the finest to you. i could play your lm5 and be completely underwhelmed. posters here look at the posts of some of the more vocal posters and base purchases off of them.
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I blame the reader, not the writer, for this.

If we love something, why shouldn't we be free to prop the heck out of it? If it's a great product, it deserves praise.

If you were to start gushing all over the place about your new 18mm custom, it wouldn't bug me one tiny bit. In fact, it would be completely understandable.

You know, it's not just the "more vocal" posters that are subject to this. Anyone who's heard your recordings will also pay a LOT of attention to your posts, as well.

hype doesnt have to be deceptive or misleading. enthusiastic posts leading to orders is hype.
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True, the first dictionary definition of hype doesn't include deceptive or misleading (tho subsequent definitions do!). Problem is, most people infer that hype does mean deceptive and misleading. Connotations are important, and that word carries a lot of bad baggage.
 
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