Genz Streamliner 900 and TC RH450 Comparison

[svtb15]

Not with the main act.. I wish though!
There are alot of events going on in town. Everyone is here from all.. over Adam sandler you name it.. But the ice on all the roads is real bad.. Im from NYC, and these roads are far worse than anything I have seen in NY... Black Ice everywhere! Its a mess

Wow SVT ..dude who are you playing the Super Bowl with? Man that would look nice on the Bio.

cheers Kirk

 

[KJung]

KJ,

I tried Vic's RH450 for about 2 seconds and to be honest couldn't stand it. I tried several different settings, but it just did not do it for me (kinda like the classic roscoe sound is too wooly for me). I have had both the shuttle 6.0 and 9.0 and dug the 9.0 except to my ears sounded more digital or processed compared to some other micros and my reference the M6. Not sure I am making sense, but by more processed and less organic if you will. This is kinda how I describe the audere preamp to some other preamps. I actually dug the tone and features of the 9.0 but let it go for some reason. Now this streamliner has got me all gassy. It looks good and from the clips it sounds really good. More organic sounding sweet present highs and hopefully a lot more "open" sounding then the RH450 for my tone goals. Even though it seems a pretty big departure from my beloved M6, I bet it would just kill in the mix.

Let me know how it sounds with the AE212 and a J woulda?

The RH450 and M6 are kind of from two ends of the universe, and your Roscoe example is a good one. The RH450 can widen out quite nicely (check out my somewhat recent clip of the RH450/RS210 with my Alleva). I demonstrate three different settings, one of which is a widened, more modern, deeper, brighter tone. However, you are correct that the RH450 is about warm mid punch, and again is voiced to bring playing out of a 'fridge' to mind, regardless of the cab. I again have had very good luck with it on many gigs with various J basses, but I again have moved from the deep boom and sizzly highs of the M6/M9 or GK type voicing.

So, as always, different strokes. Per the other comments above, yes the Streamliner has a wider, deeper, brighter voice than the RH450 (which always stays within a more narrow frequency range emphasizing the mids). That wider voice along with the pretty nice tube 'flavor' is IMO unique at this point among micro's.

I'll fire up a couple of clips later today with my 60's style J with nickels, and my very aggressive ash/maple Sadowsky

 

[KJung]

Thanks for posting the clips and your impressions, Ken. I liked the sound of the Streamliner with the treble opened up a bit. The Genz also seemed to have more authority on the low end. Not sure if the RH450 is capable of sounding like that or if you had the treble rolled down on it.

Volume capabilities aside, how do you feel these amps compare tonally to the Mesa Walkabout?

It has been quite a long while since I owned my Walkabout. That is a unique sounding amp, and again, from my memory only, neither of these heads have quite the complexity and warmth of the Walkabout. However, the Streamliner would be the closer of the two, given its true tube preamp, and its wider voicing down low and up top. I would think that anyone who digs the Walkabout would also at least 'like' the streamliner. Those who LOVE the Walkabout (that head really has almost a cult following at this point, similar to the Walter Woods) will probably not consider this a 'no brainer, higher power' replacement.

This head has a lot of what makes the Walkabout great. Just like the passive tone control on a P Bass, there is a MASSIVE amount of tonal color that exists in this head by just varying the gain setting. I never found myself wanting to move the bass, mid or treble controls more than a touch off of center with the Streamliner. Similar with the Walkabout, I don't think I ever touched that semiparametric EQ section.... a subtle shift in the ratio of lows to mids, and different gain structure always got me to where I needed to go. So far, that is what I'm finding with the Streamliner.

Of course, the RH450 is a totally different thing, and the beauty of that head is the ability to apply massive EQ power and still always sound musical and 'good'. So, again, similar design goals (tubey, vintage, whatever), but a totally different way of approaching it, and a different final 'flavor' to that sort of tone.

 

[markorbit]

I've just ordered a Streamliner 9. The thing looks really promising for what I'm looking for. I've previously owned an F1/500 and RH450 but I think having real tubes in there may just swing it.

Both the F1 and RH450 are good amps though both just fell short soundwise, the RH450 surprisingly more than the F1.

I'm hoping the SL9 can be the one. Small, lightweight, powerful and a serious preamp with 3 tubes. Could be a winner. Time will tell...

 

[KJung]

I've just ordered a Streamliner 9. The thing looks really promising for what I'm looking for. I've previously owned an F1/500 and RH450 but I think having real tubes in there may just swing it.

Both the F1 and RH450 are good amps though both just fell short soundwise, the RH450 surprisingly more than the F1.

I'm hoping the SL9 can be the one. Small, lightweight, powerful and a serious preamp with 3 tubes. Could be a winner. Time will tell...

Post up when you get it. I think you will dig it. The F1 was my primary gigging head for a long time, and the F500 (the F1 with expanded feature set) fills that role now. I don't see that changing for many of my pop/funk type gigs with my J Basses. However, the F1/F500 is just a bit too clean to IMO really make a P Bass sing (although a touch of VLE goes quite a long way... not bad), which is why I purchased the Streamliner. So far, it is fitting and filling that need very well. It sounds fat and smooth as heck with my J's also, but for some contexts, I totally dig that immediacy and snap of the F500 (which is in the same tone universe and the Shuttle amps). Nice combination to own

 

[David A. Davis]

Hey Ken, do you have any problem pushing that Berg with the RH450?

 

[Saluki]

If someone doesn't like the RH, I can't see them loving the SL. From what I've seen so far, they are more alike then different. Take this with a grain of salt because I haven't heard it in person yet. Me like wooly.

Not so sure about this. I just didn't find the RH450 very useable for my tone goals, but the wider and brighter streamliner just might be the ticket. I really liked my walkabout so I do dig some tubiness. I probably gravitate towards the more modern, agressive tone with pretty fast attack, but there is something real musical about some tube amps. I really love some older recordings that were recorded with tube amps. When Ed said it reminds him of playing through a high end studio preamp, I was all ears and GAS.

 

[Freddels]

Not with the main act.. I wish though!
There are alot of events going on in town. Everyone is here from all.. over Adam sandler you name it.. But the ice on all the roads is real bad.. Im from NYC, and these roads are far worse than anything I have seen in NY... Black Ice everywhere! Its a mess

Texas roads are the worst when it comes to ice and snow. I don't know if it's the concrete mix that they use or what but they're just extra slick. It doesn't help that they build them like bowling alleys (with the huge gutter on the sides to catch all the cars) but it doesn't help. I still do miss Texas though.

 

[Smallequestrian]

I say this as someone who used and generally liked the RH450 for awhile, but in that video the Streamliner sounds so much better to me it's a little shocking.

 

[KsPiNeSh]

Based on my absolute love for the M6, I just may not be a 'tube' kinda guy. Now all I need to do is find one to try.

I considered myself a straight SS (though that line has been effectively blurred) type of guy for a long time. My GBE 1200 has been my main amp for going on 5 years now, but once I gigged my M6 and now M9 I find myself drawn more and more towards the bigger, fatter low end. I tried an RH450 a few times to see if it could fill that role for me, but I just couldn't get what I wanted out of it.

To my ear, the Carbine heads (with Pull Deep engaged) have plenty in common with the low end of a tube-type head. I'm struggling to describe it, but the smoothness of the Carbines and the way they can slink a little further back into a mix (esp. using Voice 5, my new personal favorite) makes me think that I'll really enjoy a Streamliner. Not sure how you use yours, but thought I'd offer my opinion as a fellow Carbine user

 

[KJung]

Hey Ken, do you have any problem pushing that Berg with the RH450?

No, it cranks. The 450 watt spec of the RH450 is very, very conservative, and the AE Bergs are high sensitivity... doesn't take a ton of wattage to get them cranking. I feel my Markbass and RH450 pretty much drive the 4ohm AE410 to full volume. I have a clip of the RH450/AE410 with the tweeter at noon with my Sadowsky (ash/maple/singles J), and you can hear the more 'modern' tone of the RH450.

Another thing to point out (regarding some of the comments above) with the RH450 is that I would tend to run the tweeter a bit hotter than on my clip, even with the P. That brings out a touch more top end presence, but wanted to do a true A/B comparison. That being said, the comparison clip is reasonably accurate as to what the RH450 sounds like... warm, a bit chewy, relatively smooth, and that organic top end... again, voiced to make virtually any cab sound like a sealed one way design, like the old fridge.

Interesting that BassIda (TC endorser now playing for Prince) is a slap funk style player who playes a jazz bass and uses the RH450 rig. However, in older video clips, she is using an SVT and fridge, so that makes much sense to me... a nice punchy, relatively bright slap tone but not the uber sizzle or super 'fast' attack of some of the more aggressive slap tone. Nice kind of 'Larry Graham' type thing.

 

[chris lykins]

Any ideas how the streamliner would compare to the original Ashdown ABM line? The descriptions sound similair especially with the Ashdown shape button disengaged.

 

[svtb15]

Oh you are so right... You could have a pile up on a perfectly clear day here...

They also don't use salts on the roads as in the north east.... so the ice build up here .. and builds up.. then its black ice... and very dangerous to drive.. Add the formula of multi-car-pile-ups on a perfectly clear sunny day ... and its a mess... I'm form NY and I know how to drive in bad weather..

But to get back on topic... the clean tone of the Streamliner is very full girthy and i agree.. umpphy too...

It has way mucho umphiness ! And the Uber1288T cabs bring out the voice of this amp in a very good way...

It doesn't help that they build them like bowling alleys (with the huge gutter on the sides to catch all the cars) but it doesn't help. I still do miss Texas though.

 

[mophead]

Great as always sir!!!! GAS building to epic-proportions now.

Not sure these amps are allowed in Oklahoma yet. You fire one of these babies up and all those OKC weather geeks will be at your house to investigate the thunder.

Might even get the great one to show up!

 

[lookiel]

I say this as someone who used and generally liked the RH450 for awhile, but in that video the Streamliner sounds so much better to me it's a little shocking.

I really enjoy my RH450, it's the amp I've kept the longest in recent years and have sold off pretty much everything else, but I agree the Streamliner sounds a little better in the clip.
I think however it would have been a fairer comparison to EQ in a wider sound on the TC with a more present top end and authoritative bottom.
All in all these two amps sounds more similar than different to me and I have a hard time understanding a person could abhor one and love the other.

 

[ElMon]

Not sure these amps are allowed in Oklahoma yet. You fire one of these babies up and all those OKC weather geeks will be at your house to investigate the thunder.

Might even get the great one to show up!

Well I DO still have a permit for 'Devices for Drastic Structural ReAlignment via Extremely Low Frequency', which I had to register for when procuring my DB750. Sucks that I have to make club owners sign waivers in case of drywall damage and can't go NEAR those with heart conditions.

I"m guessing that I can simply switch over the permit to the Streamliner, IF it's warranted, and from what I've heard so far it IS. If this head has the 'OOMPHINESS' of my DB750 AND I can literally play a game of toss with it after the gig, I'll be a happy boy.

 

[Saluki]

I tried an RH450 a few times to see if it could fill that role for me, but I just couldn't get what I wanted out of it.

+1 for me.

To my ear, the Carbine heads (with Pull Deep engaged) have plenty in common with the low end of a tube-type head. I'm struggling to describe it, but the smoothness of the Carbines and the way they can slink a little further back into a mix (esp. using Voice 5, my new personal favorite) makes me think that I'll really enjoy a Streamliner. Not sure how you use yours, but thought I'd offer my opinion as a fellow Carbine user

I am a happy M6 user, and I agree that I think I could enjoy the streamliner, but the fast attack and the presence of the M6 are kinda away from what I consider typical tube quality. Just IMO. Just seems like the streamliner has the best qualities of both SS and Tube. The perfect lightweight hybrid?

 

[Gab124]

Not sure these amps are allowed in Oklahoma yet.

I guess not, mine left Memphis at 7:48 a.m on Wed the 2nd, and there has not been one shipping update since. I bet it is one of those jack knifed trucks on an offramp somewhere

 

[KJung]

Well, I hate to post this, but the replacement amp arrived and is having problems (lots of noise and hiss). I was probably just unlucky, and hopefully everyone else will have a good experience (the amp sounds WONDERFUL), but I have a pretty strict '2 strikes and you are out' rule, and just would be a bit too paranoid after this when I'm doing all these road gigs.

So, unfortunately, out of the club and returned for refund

 

[wateroftyne]

Well, I hate to post this, but the replacement amp arrived and is having problems (lots of noise and hiss). I was probably just unlucky, and hopefully everyone else will have a good experience (the amp sounds WONDERFUL), but I have a pretty strict '2 strikes and you are out' rule, and just would be a bit too paranoid after this when I'm doing all these road gigs.

So, unfortunately, out of the club and returned for refund

Oh, wow... sorry to hear it.