How To Fire a Band Member

[wmhill]

each case is different, I been through it all from, texts, e-mails, group and/or one on one sit-downs, to even just giving the guitarist a well deserved beatdown at a gig! (I don't recommend that one....usually). I even joined a band, to find out later that the former bassist never was fired- they just didn't call him for gigs anymore. Take the high road first and be honest, if it get's ugly -just say see ya, and walk away.

 

[fretter]

You could act like corporate management and put increasingly unreasonable demands on the member, until they quit on their own (just kidding). This method is well illustrated in Dilbert cartoons.

 

[Winterglo]

Thanks. And you are right, I should have left that out. Sorry, I need to follow the rules as well, I know.

[my comment redacted]

Sorry, I should not be Captain Obvious.

 

[Stealth Fighter]

You set him off on a beat or groove and that's what the beat will be to the end of the song, no dynamic changes, no variation or new textures.

I fail to see a problem here. We should all be so lucky.

 

[DwaynieAD]

I fired @marko138 but then he fired me back

 

[Duke Damn]

I would imagine (and I could be wrong) OP isn't the only one who feels this way in the orgnization. If three out of four people in an organization feel one way about musical direction, and the other can't/won't get on board, the "I got here first" rule doesn't apply.

So are you guys saying that everyone in the band should put his/her feelings aside and cater to the drummer because he has been around a while? (I'm sure you arent.) There's playground rules and then there's practicality.

Did you read my post? I literally stated exactly what you're saying;

"If the others feel he's fine as he is then you have no right to force your standards upon the band."

Not trying to be rude, it just seems like a pretty big thing to miss. Otherwise, I completely agree. If the entire band agrees, it's a no-brainer, but if not then the bassist of said band has no right to tell the others that the drummer isn't up-to-snuff.

 

[TripleDouble]

What gives you the authority to fire the guy who was part of the process of hiring you?

 

[devnulljp]

What gives you the authority to fire the guy who was part of the process of hiring you?

I bet Steve Jobs said the same thing to John Sculley.

 

[bass.slinger]

Tough situation. I agree with people's comment that it is the B/L job to fire people. Unless the band is one of those extremely rare true democracies. You should always be honest (but tactful) in these types of situations because: 1) it is the right thing to do, and 2) you never know where someone will end up in the future.

I have a friend's band back in California that wants to take it to the next level and the bassist is not on the same page. They have played with him for years and he also gets very defensive when they have asked him to up his game. I think they are doing the right thing by giving him some time to understand what they want and the consequences of not providing it, even though this is keeping them from getting a bassist that is a better fit. What is an extra month or two to be a decent human being? That said, the bassist is pretty bad and I am amazed he lasted this long with the band. The downside to taking too long is that people can get pretty resentful (the singer barely talks to the bassist anymore).

 

[carsbybigd]

As someone who was fired recently from a band [search title "Fired from a band because....] Just tell them the truth ,don't make up a bunch of excuses about weight,hair[or lack thereof ] ,stamina,lack of energy etc etc.I would have rather heard " you just can't cut it" instead of all the BS I heard...but that's just me. TRUTH !!

 

[Mystic Michael]

Ultimately I'd be doing her and the music a disservice if I didn't raise my drummer concerns right?

If you're truly serious about the music, then by definition the music must come first. Because if it doesn't, then sooner or later something will come along - such as a lagging drummer - that will pull the music seriously off-course, perhaps fatally so.

If you compromise on the music in order to do a favor for someone, or for sentimental reasons, or because you can't summon the will to say "you're out", that's perfectly valid. But just don't kid yourself that it's still "all about the music", when you had the opportunity to put the music at top priority...and you backed away.

A certain amount of ruthlessness is required in order to keep the musical standards as high as they can be. If someone gets in the way of that, he/she must be dealt with. That's the discipline, that's the price you must pay.

MM

 

[MegaSwing]

This is a no-win. Walk away clean and start over with someone else. Let them come looking for you, and maybe then express your concerns. OP, the situation you describe in Post 1 is just not something you're going to come out of looking like anything but a jackhole. Get yourself some distance ASAP.

 

[MegaSwing]

Mrokern said to remember "this is show business, not show friends."

But they're also my friends!

Also remember that if you treat it strictly like show business, not 'show friends', you also must prepare to not have a single friend in the 'show business' world. There are serious drawbacks to that approach. If that doesn't matter to you, then what the hell.

 

[pbassjbass]

Been through this, and six months later the bands over, and all of the bull poopie didn't make literally a dimes difference. If you can book trio gigs, book 'em. It's a trio gig, that's what the buy wanted. For the full band outfit, play on, unless you know for sure a change works. You're the bass player, set the groove (if he plays straight forward and keeps time, you should be able to play almost anything, he'll get the idea) and make sure the PA works, until your in management

 

[Nagrom]

I think you need to book & rehearse for a few snare-n-hat-with-brushes gigs and see how it goes.

 

[BazzTard]

stick to playing without drums,it is so much better,easier,QUIETER.

Our acoustic trio is drumless,we were going to get one but I'm enjoying the peace and quiet too much atm.

 

[OOD]

Why not try asking the drummer how he feels about a Cajon? Or really light brushes. I'm having a hard time understanding why you want him fired. You want to go in a different direction, but you haven't even talked to him about it yet. It seems like you want him fired so you don't have to give him a cut. (That's actually a good reason) I just see no Benefit to the music by having zero percussion unless he can't keep time.

 

[delta7fred]

Getting back to the Thread title "How To Fire a Band Member", this is how not to do it.

Back story - I joined a startup band a few years ago that a guitarist I know had joined and recommended me. I went to a couple of rehearsals and did a lot of work learning the songs and was up to speed pretty quick.

Then the band leader had a change of circumstances and decided to go out as a duo with his wife, they had done this previously, so he fired the guitarist by email and asked if he would phone me and tell me I was no longer required. He knew my email address and didn't even have the decency to fire by email but left it to the guitarist to fire me "by proxy". What a douchbag!

 

[Capt.Obvious]

UPDATE: Backfired! Blew up in my face sort of!

I'll try to be brief but I'd like to acknowledge every ones bit of advice, all very useful to me, some I wish I had paid better heed to. Doh!

So I sent off the email, being as diplomatic as possible and approaching it as clinically as possible, claimed it's my opinion as a musician only and that I like him a lot on a personal level. I asked her if it's show business or show friends?

Anyway, in her eyes I must have seemed like a real jackass. Her first message back to me on the phone after getting the email was simply, "Ouch! That's harsh!" Then launches into a few pages of, paraphrasing here, "YOUR replaceable too! Everyone is. I could record my whole sound with just Tyler (her husband and guitar man) in the basement with a keyboard and drum machine and Ableton. You know how hard it is to put together a band!?! We should be lucky to have Jim!

I'm a SOLO artist! That's why I had you sign that agreement when you joined the band Yadda yadda yadda I got you by the balls with both hands you jackhole bass player!"




She's right really, I have very little to complain about. It ended a bit more chill than that actually, but that's about how it felt like. Basically I didn't get much accomplished at all other than to create cognitive dissonance for her. She did finally agree however that he's too loud and too busy sometimes and we will work on it together.

I feel like I really put the 'ass' in bass today.



Here's a side by side comparison of our studio sound vs. our typical live sound. To be fair, the sound guy was a bit of a bonehead that night and there was a lot bad, not just overly loud drums. For one thing, the monitors were never loud enough and it's extremely apparent the first time Tyler tries to sing harmony and can't hear a damn thing and totally miffs the line. I Could barely here guitar on stage, mostly just snare. Bad sound guy aside, this is typical of his hard hitting, busy kick drum style. She's always getting on me for being "too jazzy" and too busy, but I tell her I'm just tying to lock in with the kick drum. She also says I play too quiet and I think I sometimes back off BECAUSE the drums are so loud, feel like the rhythm section is often burying the lead vocals most times.

Keep in mind, other people have given me the "drummers too loud" feedback before, so I don't feel like I'm alone in this. She sings like a Disney princess and he plays like he's backing Ozzy Osborne. Like most drummers, he sees a gig as an opportunity to play loud, he seems simply uninterested in sensitivity. He even said as much at one rehearsal.

Studio sound


Typical live sound with loud drums.


Thank you again for you indulgence and all of your good advice. Next time STOP ME!

 

[btmpancake]

As a TB reg and someone that has routinely recommended firing X band member, often for transgressions no greater than bad hair, I'm ashamed to admit I don't actually know how to go about firing anyone.

I'm struggling with the idea of just how to fire the drummer in an originals band I play in. It gets more tricky because he was in the band before me and enthusiastically voted for me after they had auditions. That meant a lot to the BL/vocalist and he certainly helped me get on board. It was a very sweet deal too. I got networked with this original BL's mom, and get quite a lot of jazz work with her.

So I feel I owe a great deal to our drummer for helping me get the opportunity, but the fact is, he's holding the sound back musically. He's a self admitted cover band specialist, mostly 70's to 90's era. He's great at playing loud bar rock and that's about it. My blunt and clinical assessment is that he's basically a living drum machine. You set him off on a beat or groove and that's what the beat will be to the end of the song, no dynamic changes, no variation or new textures. He doesn't even have a workable Latin anything. I ask him to play a samba or bossa with me and he just stares back blankly.

So Friday night, we play our first show without the drummer because he's out of town on business. And it was the first time I believe we created something musical. Was just me on string bass, her and guitar harmony vocals man, a trio. When she got big and loud, so did we. When she took it intimate and soft, so did we. There was actual communication between musicians on stage and the crowd raved about it. I gushed hearing how much they loved the more intimate sound particularly my bass work. Everyone loves the double bass anyway, so that helped of course, but I want more of that. She got requests for her to do more of these trio things and is gushing about the feedback so I thought this was a good time to voice my concerns about the drummer.

Ultimately I'd be doing her and the music a disservice if I didn't raise my drummer concerns right?

Thank you for your indulgence.

I think you should keep him.You said he stays put as in ''in the pocket''?You said he's on time, dependable,nice guy,voted for you?I'd show him or tell him what we need,then go from there.I remember a time when guys like him were hard to replace.