Jule Amps Monique part 5

[Baird6869]

Another cool gig and crappy pic with my Monique/Mini/Berg workhouse rig.

I'm honestly unsure if I will bother with other amps from now on. This just sounds killer and has for years....

 

[peterpalmieri]

My M700 is on its way back to Jule and will return as a M2500.

 

[interp]

My M700 is on its way back to Jule and will return as a M2500.

You will not regret it. I did this a few months ago; the M700 is a great amp, the M2500 is approximately 3.57 times better.
Enjoy!

 

[BuffaloBob4343]

Another cool gig and crappy pic with my Monique/Mini/Berg workhouse rig.

I'm honestly unsure if I will bother with other amps from now on. This just sounds killer and has for years....

Love the Dove Cage! I love functional art. Other than wishing I had a DC sometimes just for the aesthetics, I feel the same way about my 700 Tardis into my Genzler BA12-3's.

My brother was over the other day. He plays bass as well. He heard my rig for the first time, and it was on very low volume due to my downstairs neighbors being home. He was sooooo jealous! He couldn't get over the tone. Of course, the Dingwall didn't exactly hurt the signal chain any either!

 

[BuffaloBob4343]

You will not regret it. I did this a few months ago; the M700 is a great amp, the M2500 is approximately 3.57 times better.
Enjoy!

What is it that makes it worth the extra power, if one is playing into maybe 1200 watts worth of cabs? Is it added quickness, punch? Just curious. Not that I really need to be (or really WANT to be) disturbed from my rather GASless bliss!

 

[peterpalmieri]

What is it that makes it worth the extra power, if one is playing into maybe 1200 watts worth of cabs? Is it added quickness, punch? Just curious. Not that I really need to be (or really WANT to be) disturbed from my rather GASless bliss!

I am not running any sort of insane cabinets that eat up power or play at crazy volumes. I do find that I can be running the M700 full out. Since Monique is so dynamic I could have settings where I am looking for more headroom but don't want to drive the line input any further. If you have both line and sensitivity knobs pulled (or desire not too), or a more counterclockwise sensitivity setting and the master on the M700 at max, leaves you with no other option but to drive the line level further.

I can get plenty of headroom with line level past 3 o'clock and using the master on the M700 to control output but that is a very different sound then maxing the M700 and having the line level at noon.

 

[BuffaloBob4343]

I am not running any sort of insane cabinets that eat up power or play at crazy volumes. I do find that I can be running the M700 full out. Since Monique is so dynamic I could have settings where I am looking for more headroom but don't want to drive the line input any further. If you have both line and sensitivity knobs pulled (or desire not too), or a more counterclockwise sensitivity setting and the master on the M700 at max, leaves you with no other option but to drive the line level further.

I can get plenty of headroom with line level past 3 o'clock and using the master on the M700 to control output but that is a very different sound then maxing the M700 and having the line level at noon.

Interesting. I of course don't have the option of messing with the output level of the 700, as I have a Tardis. I only have the line level as a volume control. So I probably don't know any better (and we all know ignorance is bliss! ) about what I'm missing being able to keep the line level lower and increasing the power output. That is certainly one of the benefits of having the separate components.

 

[peterpalmieri]

Interesting. I of course don't have the option of messing with the output level of the 700, as I have a Tardis. I only have the line level as a volume control. So I probably don't know any better (and we all know ignorance is bliss! ) about what I'm missing being able to keep the line level lower and increasing the power output. That is certainly one of the benefits of having the separate components.

You are getting maximum output for the power side so you can keep the line level at moderate levels, what you are missing is the ability to drive that line level past 3 o'clock but attenuate the power output side to keep volumes reasonable. I guess what I'm saying is your line level is dictated by the volume you need and you lose the flexibility to use it for tone shaping. I'm not sure it's a problem but just another option I want to have..

 

[juledude]

Have you considered something less then 300 watts? My reissue Ampeg V4b is 100 watts and it is knock down walls loud. I'd envision 150 watts in the format of a Macintosh MC275 to sit under Monique...Just sayin

That might work. I have had it beaten into me by (I think) well meaning players that 100 watts isn't enough do do a gig. I recall that the old Praxis 100 watt guitar amp used to do 125db without any problem. So maybe there is hope.

 

[peterpalmieri]

That might work. I have had it beaten into me by (I think) well meaning players that 100 watts isn't enough do do a gig. I recall that the old Praxis 100 watt guitar amp used to do 125db without any problem. So maybe there is hope.

They couldn't be more wrong. My reissue Ampeg V4b is 100 watts, it can bury the M700 without breaking a sweat and stay clean..

 

[interp]

What is it that makes it worth the extra power, if one is playing into maybe 1200 watts worth of cabs? Is it added quickness, punch? Just curious. Not that I really need to be (or really WANT to be) disturbed from my rather GASless bliss!

I can't explain it as well as peterpalmieri but essentially what you say is correct. With the Monique line level at noon and the M2500 volume at 10 o'clock the notes just seem to leap off my fingers. Not massive volume, just quickness and the ability to project subtleties of tone to the back of a large room without knocking anybody over. There is never a feeling of the amplifier working hard. With the M700, under the same conditions, i sometimes felt that the M700 didn't have much more to give me.

But that's just me. I play with a light touch, like to incorporate a lot of dynamics in my playing and want to feel that the amplification system gives me the same responsiveness regardless of what volume I'm playing at and always has a lot more to give if needed. The M2500 coupled with the Monique gives me that.

That said, I am VERY careful with the M2500 volume knob. I have no illusions that speaker damage is not a possibility. But thus far, no problems with my two GB F112s.

Regarding "punch," that is a concept that is defined differently by differently people. Last week I was playing this rig when a bass player friend of mine who had been standing at the back of the medium-sized room came up to me and spoke at length of his impressions of the bass tone. He said he could feel every note in his body, but not in a pounding way. It just had a presence without being overwhelming or too loud in the mix.

That's what I think of when I think of "punch."

 

[BuffaloBob4343]

You are getting maximum output for the power side so you can keep the line level at moderate levels, what you are missing is the ability to drive that line level past 3 o'clock but attenuate the power output side to keep volumes reasonable. I guess what I'm saying is your line level is dictated by the volume you need and you lose the flexibility to use it for tone shaping. I'm not sure it's a problem but just another option I want to have..

I totally misspoke (I mean, mis-typed)! I meant the other way around.

What does the tone sound like with the line level up and the output amp volume down vs other way around? Does it have more grit?

 

[BuffaloBob4343]

I can't explain it as well as peterpalmieri but essentially what you say is correct. With the Monique line level at noon and the M2500 volume at 10 o'clock the notes just seem to leap off my fingers. Not massive volume, just quickness and the ability to project subtleties of tone to the back of a large room without knocking anybody over. There is never a feeling of the amplifier working hard. With the M700, under the same conditions, i sometimes felt that the M700 didn't have much more to give me.

But that's just me. I play with a light touch, like to incorporate a lot of dynamics in my playing and want to feel that the amplification system gives me the same responsiveness regardless of what volume I'm playing at and always has a lot more to give if needed. The M2500 coupled with the Monique gives me that.

That said, I am VERY careful with the M2500 volume knob. I have no illusions that speaker damage is not a possibility. But thus far, no problems with my two GB F112s.

Regarding "punch," that is a concept that is defined differently by differently people. Last week I was playing this rig when a bass player friend of mine who had been standing at the back of the medium-sized room came up to me and spoke at length of his impressions of the bass tone. He said he could feel every note in his body, but not in a pounding way. It just had a presence without being overwhelming or too loud in the mix.

That's what I think of when I think of "punch."

Thanks for the info. Sounds like it's worth it. Not sure I could justify selling the Tardis and buying a D.C. and an m2500 though, even thought that sounds ideal in many ways. I might be more tempted to try adding a third Genzler BA12-3 and run at 2.67 ohms instead.

 

[Dave W]

I totally misspoke (I mean, mis-typed)! I meant the other way around.

What does the tone sound like with the line level up and the output amp volume down vs other way around? Does it have more grit?

I don't find that it has any real grit, just more nuance when I'm running the LL knob at 12:00 and higher.

 

[peterpalmieri]

I totally misspoke (I mean, mis-typed)! I meant the other way around.

What does the tone sound like with the line level up and the output amp volume down vs other way around? Does it have more grit?

I am terrible at explaining tone, there is a different complexity to the notes. It's maybe a bit overdriven with being distorted, I'm not sure that would be accurate but the best I could come up with.

 

[Dave W]

I am terrible at explaining tone, there is a different complexity to the notes. It's maybe a bit overdriven with being distorted, I'm not sure that would be accurate but the best I could come up with.

More complexity is a good way to put it IMO. I hear more harmonic content come out, but then again I run the LL and Sensitivity knobs both pulled out, and the Sensitivity is dimed.

 

[peterpalmieri]

I can't explain it as well as peterpalmieri but essentially what you say is correct. With the Monique line level at noon and the M2500 volume at 10 o'clock the notes just seem to leap off my fingers. Not massive volume, just quickness and the ability to project subtleties of tone to the back of a large room without knocking anybody over. There is never a feeling of the amplifier working hard. With the M700, under the same conditions, i sometimes felt that the M700 didn't have much more to give me.

But that's just me. I play with a light touch, like to incorporate a lot of dynamics in my playing and want to feel that the amplification system gives me the same responsiveness regardless of what volume I'm playing at and always has a lot more to give if needed. The M2500 coupled with the Monique gives me that.

That said, I am VERY careful with the M2500 volume knob. I have no illusions that speaker damage is not a possibility. But thus far, no problems with my two GB F112s.

Regarding "punch," that is a concept that is defined differently by differently people. Last week I was playing this rig when a bass player friend of mine who had been standing at the back of the medium-sized room came up to me and spoke at length of his impressions of the bass tone. He said he could feel every note in his body, but not in a pounding way. It just had a presence without being overwhelming or too loud in the mix.

That's what I think of when I think of "punch."

That is exactly what I am hoping for in moving up to the M2500. It seems to be an un-quantifiable attribute that many folks like on all tube amps, the feeling of unlimited headroom and dynamics without being loud.

 

[Lowendtech]

So if it's possible to increase the displacement in the M700, is it feasible to do this to Monique 700 Tardis?
Inquiring minds and all that.

 

[BuffaloBob4343]

So if it's possible to increase the displacement in the M700, is it feasible to do this to Monique 700 Tardis?
Inquiring minds and all that.

Oh, you just had to ask, didn't you?!

 

[Lowendtech]

Oh, you just had to ask, didn't you?!

Yep.
I suspect it's not that simple with an integrated amp, but I just can't help myself.
I gotsta get knowed.