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Looking for a 'tighter' sound live , especially low end

This is a strange comment. Bass cabinets are not different than most other kinds of cabs aside from the role they play.
Most modern cabs are essentially PA cabinets. Woofer+crossover+tweeter.
Starting at the bottom, bass frequencies are essentially omnidirectional. You are going to be getting the same amount of low end in every direction from that cabinet. This is good and bad. If your low end is cranked, you may be driving the drummer crazy so you can get heard out front.
Also, since bass is omnidirectional, your bass energy is dissipating in every direction, while the guitars, keys and such are midrange focussed and spend little energy, pointing in a narrow angle of say 45 degrees. And are heard fine by everyone.
In the midrange drivers tend to beam. Or shoot a narrow dispersion of 10-20 degrees. Oddly a 15" will beam narrower than a 12" or ten usually, since it's voice coil is set much farther back.
Then as you get into the tweeter's range the high mids and treble will often have very wide, almost 180 degree dispersion.
Now this is all presuming a single woofer and tweeter.
When you get into several speakers like a 4x10, with a tweeter in the middle, you actually get very consistent dispersion if the cab is high enough(and well engineered).
Also a pair of 2x10 or 2x12 on their side tend to carry quite well. With decent dispersion.
Still, whatever cab you use, the low end is going to be tricky. I've always sought out walls and corners of rooms when possible to help corner load or quarter-space load the room.
This wont work on festival stages or theater style stage with a scrim/curtain behind the band. But in clubs and similar venues it works wonders.

I've found that a lot of rooms are hellish when it comes to phase cancellation from bass standing waves. I am fortunate enough to have a wireless, and I have walked the rooms we gigged while doing sound check and it's kind of shocking how much bass can vary from one side of a room to the other. That might be what @testing1two is getting at.

I've actually used my speaker cabs as FOH subs and monitored on stage with a little fart wedge. This is similar to what 1two is talking about EQing to a certain spot. Basically EQing for the audience perspective, and just using my stage mix as a point of reference. Not the most inspiring mix on stage, but the crowd was feeling it...
 
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When I was first coming up in reggae bands in the early 2000s, I would always end up with an SVT + Fridge as a backline and I hated it. I hated that baked in Ampeg mid-hump voice. It was directly opposed to the tones I was trying to hit for reggae. Not only could I not seem to tame that mid hump, I couldn't get the low end where I wanted it for reggae. Of course whenever I'd complain about it, everyone (even non bassists) would have to chime in about how stoked most people would be to play on an SVT and that there's a reason they are the industry standard, blah blah blah. That just made me hate Ampegs more. Now I wish I had one for my own studio work, as Ampeg + P Bass + Pick is a tone I keep seeming to reach for on certain songs.
Fugazi bomb if you want ampeg tone get a pedal that castrates your amp down to the one hump pony. Lool theres pedals out there that do it.
 
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Fugazi bomb if you want ampeg tone get a pedal that castrates your amp down to the one hump pony. Lool theres pedals out there that do it.

ibanez-lf7-lo-fi-19137.jpg
 
No, it's actually just a poorly executed joke... :D.
Lool! Im kinda thick some days, but yeah there are pedals out there voiced to give the one trick ampeg tone. I paid 1050$ for the ampeg svt3pro head i had. The most money i paid for a head at any time in my 45 years of playing, and i was so disapointed with its only ampeg sloppy tone. I would take it to a gig and the damned thing woyld crap out every time. It had a way overblown 5 tube preamp and with todays tubes unless youre buying mesa tubes just didnt last. I ended up putting it in a rack case with my Hartke 3500 head from my 1x15 combo so when the ampeg died id have a backup. Two heads weighing 11ty9,000 hundred pounds to do a 100$ gig. To hell with that. Lol so if you want ampeg sound get a pedal. I still cant believe how unreliable that massively expensive head was. Chunk of crap are the words that leap to mind. Lol i manged to sell it for 500$ and happy to get out from under it.
 
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Hi Everyone !
I have been playing some bigger clubs and stages lately, and have not been totally
happy with my sound. I have playing through backlines and some bigger cabinets and felt like my sound could use some focus and less mushiness on the low end.

I am trying to figure out if I need to learn to eq better, add a preamp, or a compressor! I play finger style on a jazz with rounds usually no effects, but, sometimes I use a sadwosky outboard preamp to add a touch of fatness.

Last night I used a ampeg 450 head and a 6x10 cab and found when I dialed in the tonethe was a lot of 'mush' that I could not dial out. The room acoustics were pretty friendly and made for live performances.

Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated!

Thankyou!
Pbass888
Cheap, easy fix. Speaker placement can cause and cure sound problems. If you don't have to fill the house from the stage, get those short cabinets (6x10, 4x10, 1x15, etc) off of the floor. Place them on a pedestal that is high enough to get the top speaker(s) at your shoulder blades. When you have to stand so close to your speaker on a small stage, your sound is blasting out below your waist and you're not hearing what you're playing until it bounces back off of everything else as so much mud. With a speaker right behind your head you will hear precisely what you are playing and can adjust your tone to perfection. No one will complain that you are too loud. If your bandmates can't hear they can request more you in their monitor. If you can't get that SVT 610 up, at least have them flip it over for you. Play it upside down so the ports are off the ground (bungee the wheels). Keep the 810 vertical. Try to stay at least 5' away from any side wall to avoid low frequency boundary cancelation (see Peavey Tech Notes in Sound Systems). A wedge cabinet would be sweet if they've got one that can handle the bass. A Peavey TNT solved my volume problem. Enjoy hearing yourself!
 
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Yeah Stingray with a HPF? I'd be surprised if true. When I got my first Musicman bass I was floored about how much low end it can push.
Heck, I'm going to go plug my Ray into my computer and see if I can make it talk below 60hz.
Okay I'm back.
Yeah plenty of stuff under 60hz. Though to be fair, FFT analyzers aren't terribly accurate under 200hz or so. Unless you spend about $10k.
 
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eah Stingray with a HPF? I'd be surprised if true. When I got my first Musicman bass I was floored about how much low end it can push.
Heck, I'm going to go plug my Ray into my computer and see if I can make it talk below 60hz.
The Stingray 3 band preamp has a HPF built in. It is set at about 70Hz IIRC and rolls off at 12db/oct (so not as steep as the Fdeck which is 24db/oct).

The 2 band preamp doesn't have a HPF and can have quite a bass hump if you crank the bass pot.
 
The Stingray 3 band preamp has a HPF built in. It is set at about 70Hz IIRC and rolls off at 12db/oct (so not as steep as the Fdeck which is 24db/oct).

The 2 band preamp doesn't have a HPF and can have quite a bass hump if you crank the bass pot.
crazy, I'm not seeing it on my BFR roasted Stingray with a 3 band.
But I dont have an Audio Precision to test with, so the low end metering on my analyzer looks like it always does, sloping away even when I line in from a Taurus 3 set at it's lowest setting.
 
I think johndough and fugazibombs answers are about as complete an advise as possible. All I can add is that IME with finding the right thump is that finding the right 80 hz sweetspot depends a lot on the tuning of the cab. Lots of cabs have resonant peaks close to that spot. Sometimes that works, sometimes not. I like cabs that are fairly flat in the low end or that roll off from a relative high freq. Because with a good eq and hpf it is easier to dial in the right hump.

I'm closing in on a HPF

Does the HPF go after the sadowsky?

my chain is
Bass---Pedal tuner----oc2-----boss cs3 bass smasher----sadowsky (HPF next?) --amp..
 
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I found the bigger the venue and stage sound I encountered, brought with it new challenges to playing live. Often the muddiness encountered came from, a) Larger PA's and the standing waves they produced behind the stacks, the closer I was to them the worse it was b) Playing louder and bass cabs coupling with the floor to produce unpredictable low frequencies. I would try my cab off the floor and the closer I was the better, which kind of defeated the purpose of hearing any low bottom end. IEM's perhaps might help and try the HPFpre, a Q cut below 40 tends to help reduce muddiness. But the big one is proximity to the back of the PA stacks. In most cases, the sound out front is usually very good, on stage? meh. Every stage is different, most venues, are not designed with acoustics in mind. @pbass888 yes put the HPF last in the chain before the amp. I find it a very subtle effect.
 
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