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My guitar Player is Drowning Me

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#161
During a long ago practice one night in the drummer's basement, drummer and guitarist apparently in a contest to see who could be the loudest:

Doing the best with my inadequate bass amp, I was told 'YOU are too loud!"
I turned my bass completely off and pretended to play the next song.
Neither guy noticed.

Thats not music, thats noise.
 
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#162
altarsofmadness said:
Hi!
Well, my band's guitarist used to play through a small Laney TF-200 combo with a single 12'' Speaker, everything was fine, with an old Peavey 115 and my PF-350, I had more than enough volume.

Today, he arrived to rehearsal with an ancient Sunn Concert Lead and a 4x12, the thing is just monstrous, I was blown away. I tried diming my Ampeg and, well, lets say that I don't need my distortion box anymore, the cabinet's got me covered.

I was wondering if a GK BLX 410 or a PF115LF would be enough to be heard again.
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Get a CARVIN MADE IN THE U.S.A. direct low price. BRX 4 10" CAB, has 4 300watt 10" woofers with a titanium tweeter 1,200watts at 4ohm's, if you want to get an amp that sounds good and is very strong get the Bugera BTX 36000 NUKE HEAD its almost 3,600watts for only $599.00. And ear plugs,also a good talk with the guitar Player!!
 
#163
mcrawfordmusic said:
- have a polite word to your guitarist and ask him to watch his volume or use an amp attenuator.
- boost your midrange and cut your lows a bit. This will help you cut trough in the mix.
MC
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This. ^^
And ask your guitar player to cut his lows as well.
The guitar player should not be in your frequency range.
Especially if he plays plays a Gibson Les Paul type guitar (wall of sound) this is a known phenomenon.
And buy earplugs.
 
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#165
Ender_rpm said:
Or you can always "drop" your guitards head into the bathtub full of water. :)
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When I first read this, I actually imagined grabbing my old guitar player by the hair and shoving his head under water until he agreed to turn his amp down. It seemed like a reasonable solution. ;)

If the dude just showed up with a new toy and cranked it up, that's not good but you should be able to have a talk with him. Maybe now that he's pushed it he'll be content to back off. If you are happy with your sound you shouldn't have to buy new gear just to practice.
 
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#166
Hoo-boy...
Robus said:
Your guitarist just shows up at rehearsal with a half stack and assumes he can crank it?
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BazzTard said:
find another guitarist. At rehearsal,you don't need volume. you want to be able to hear each other. Idiot guitards and drummers have ruined my hearing
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two fingers said:
This. You're dealing with a huge ego here. If he has to be that loud at practice, he has other issues that he is compensating for.
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gumtown said:
Stab your bass head stock through 3 of the 4 guitar quad cab speakers.
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interp said:
The guitar player bought the new amp with the express intention of dominating the band volume-wise.
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SteveHeissner said:
The answer is not new gear for you. If he can't manage his volume you're wasting your time playing with an idiot.
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danosix said:
+1 on the new guitar player.
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Cristofre said:
Arrived at REHEARSAL with this monster.
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Seems to me like there's a whole lot of projection going on here - unless of course the above contributors are the OP's band mates. The facts as he has stated them are:
  1. OP and guitarist are in a band playing a loud metal genre.
  2. Guitarist had been playing through a practice amp too small for rock work with a live drummer.
  3. Guitarist pulled off an amazing trade of practice amp for slightly broken (1 channel dead, possibly mismatched volume pot) Sunn. It's the only amp he now has.
  4. Guitarist brings new amp to practice the first time and is too damn loud.
This is utterly normal. I don't see any assholery or "express purpose to dominate" or huge ego in this. I see no reason to turn this into "guitard" bashing. I didn't didn't see the OP say that he and the rest of the band asked him to turn down and he refused, even once. It's human nature when you've been drowned out for weeks to crank it just to see what it feels like. It's also hard to get levels right on a half-stack in a small rehearsal space - they beam like crazy. Firing the guitarist after one rehearsal with an amp he hasn't mastered seems disproportionately harsh.
 
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#167
bassboysam said:
not everyone plays a gig every week. so for some, practice is the gig and we want to be able to use our gear and have fun. Unless the band is your only source of income then who cares? just have fun with it and use hearing protection.
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I am talking about rehearsals where the goal is to get better for live performance. If you are getting together to just play, that is not a rehearsal, that is a private gig.

The advice to buy a louder rig and wear ear plugs is funny to me. It's one of those ironies you have to step back and think about to appreciate.

Rolling over and running to GC instead of dealing with the source of the problem also costs you a lot of money, makes you slog more heavy equipment around, takes up space in your house, and then it gives you tinnitus that will take a small piece of living away from you and replace it with a constant annoyance that you can never escape. Wheeee.

The 'upside' to massive volume in a small space is white noise, lots and lots of white noise. Plus horrific standing waves and cancellations that ruin anything vaguely musical to be heard over the white noise, and there is no room for dynamics when you already at maximum volume. Sorry but it sounds like crap.

The guys I know that do this are just there to take the edge off and blow off steam and that is cool too, but that has to be everyone's goal and clearly it isn't or we wouldn't have this thread.
 
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#168
One strategy I use as a teacher is that when the class starts talking over me, I actually talk more quietly. This makes the class SHUSH the loud students in the class for me. We used this on a gig a couple times too when the audience stopped listening. The sudden change in volume to low actually makes people listen. Try turning down in the middle of a song to get everyone's attention.

in any case, I would TURN DOWN my bass amp when he goes nuts with the volume. Then, someone will indicate they can't hear the bass -- you say -- guitar needs to turn down. And then explain your reasons.
 
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#169
Seems to me like there's a whole lot of projection going on here - unless of course the above contributors are the OP's band mates. The facts as he has stated them are:
  1. OP and guitarist are in a band playing a loud metal genre.
  2. Guitarist had been playing through a practice amp too small for rock work with a live drummer.
  3. Guitarist pulled off an amazing trade of practice amp for slightly broken (1 channel dead, possibly mismatched volume pot) Sunn. It's the only amp he now has.
  4. Guitarist brings new amp to practice the first time and is too damn loud.
This is utterly normal. I don't see any assholery or "express purpose to dominate" or huge ego in this. I see no reason to turn this into "guitard" bashing. I didn't didn't see the OP say that he and the rest of the band asked him to turn down and he refused, even once. It's human nature when you've been drowned out for weeks to crank it just to see what it feels like. It's also hard to get levels right on a half-stack in a small rehearsal space - they beam like crazy. Firing the guitarist after one rehearsal with an amp he hasn't mastered seems disproportionately harsh.[/QUOTE]

To be fair - guitarist bashing (I would NEVER use the term guitard) is a bad habit we have her at TB. Having said that - lighten up and read the other posts - I did mention in mine that you can talk to him now he's had a practice to enjoy his new loud amp and THEN if he won't turn down he's a helpless douche and I stick by that.
There is no need in ANY genre to play at the top volume that one of those can produce at practice.
 
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#170
Sid Fang said:
Hoo-boy...

Seems to me like there's a whole lot of projection going on here - unless of course the above contributors are the OP's band mates. The facts as he has stated them are:
  1. OP and guitarist are in a band playing a loud metal genre.
  2. Guitarist had been playing through a practice amp too small for rock work with a live drummer.
  3. Guitarist pulled off an amazing trade of practice amp for slightly broken (1 channel dead, possibly mismatched volume pot) Sunn. It's the only amp he now has.
  4. Guitarist brings new amp to practice the first time and is too damn loud.
This is utterly normal. I don't see any assholery or "express purpose to dominate" or huge ego in this. I see no reason to turn this into "guitard" bashing. I didn't didn't see the OP say that he and the rest of the band asked him to turn down and he refused, even once. It's human nature when you've been drowned out for weeks to crank it just to see what it feels like. It's also hard to get levels right on a half-stack in a small rehearsal space - they beam like crazy. Firing the guitarist after one rehearsal with an amp he hasn't mastered seems disproportionately harsh.
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5. The new amp has a volume knob, and the guitarist doesn't understand that he is playing too loud for the others to enjoy their time too.

You are correct though. If the rest of the band feels the same way he should be politely asked, likely he doesn't understand the issue and just enjoyed having a capable amp for a change. No need for any drama unless he gives everyone the virtual finger.

If the rest of the band likes it that way, time for a new band.
 
#171
Sid Fang said:
Hoo-boy...

Seems to me like there's a whole lot of projection going on here - unless of course the above contributors are the OP's band mates.
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;)

I just assume any advice I give or receive on an internet forum comes with the caveat "to the extent that this applies to your situation..." We know only what the OP has told us, and often the details come over several posts in response to comments from other posters. Normal.

What I would like to get across to the OP is that decisions about overall volume need to be made by the band as a group, not dictated by the gear choices of any individual player. Especially with younger rock players, too often the thinking goes: My bandmate just got louder...how can I get louder too? That kind of thinking leads to poor practices, frustration, and long-term hearing damage.

If people on the forum get adamant about the dangers of excessive volume, it's because so many have been there, done that, and have the tinnitus to prove it.

There was a thread here a few months ago--anybody else remember it? The OP was a young bass player in a metal band. He was asking about options for MONITORING his bass rig at rehearsal, because the two guitarists in his metal band were both playing through half stacks in a small practice space. That is insane!
 
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#172
Cristofre said:
Well, I guess if you protect your ears, and all members have the equal volume capability, and the neighbors don't get pissed, and the cops don't show up, well, then ok...lol
I've just had the opposite experience too many times.
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Oh totally. i actually had to convince our guitarist to wear ear plugs as he was getting dizzy/sick from not wearing them. honestly i think we just turn up to whatever works with the drummer who happens to be a VERY hard hitter. i also think genre plays into this.
 
#173
Cristofre said:
During a long ago practice one night in the drummer's basement, drummer and guitarist apparently in a contest to see who could be the loudest:

Doing the best with my inadequate bass amp, I was told 'YOU are too loud!"
I turned my bass completely off and pretended to play the next song.
Neither guy noticed.

Thats not music, thats noise.
Click to expand...

Don't walk away. Run. You have learned everything you need to know about that world. And there clearly is no intelligent life on that planet.
 
#175
IME, I became a much better player (as well as a more welcome player) the day I realized that not only did I not have to dime my amp every time I played, but that I NEVER have to dime my amp...ever!

After awhile it just makes you look silly.
 
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#177
MegaSwing said:
IME, I became a much better player (as well as a more welcome player) the day I realized that not only did I not have to dime my amp every time I played, but that I NEVER have to dime my amp...ever!

After awhile it just makes you look silly.
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you'd also look silly showing up to a metal band's rehearsal with a 110 markbass combo.

Bottom line is to play at the volume that everyone agrees/compromises to.
 
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