Notes to play on extended chords

[Wasnex]

Another song that's probably relevant to this thread. Plenty of # and b 9s and plenty of opportunities to throw a b13 in your walking bass line, even though it's specified in the chord.

Of course these are jazz clown changes .

IMHO the #9 works in a solo, but I don't generally play it in a walking bass line. However, when I see a Dom7#9 chord, the b9 seems to always work in the bass line. This article provides an explanation; see the section on the "altered scale." How to Improvise on V7#9 Chords: Strategies for Alt Dominant • Jazzadvice

 

[Wasnex]

What would you say if you got this Email?

"The changes are in the Hal Leonard Real Book Vol. 1, 6th Edition. Regardless of whether an artist used these changes, the Sixth Edition is our standard, and we should stick with that."

It depends. I tend to stick fairly close to the changes myself, although I do throw in a few subs. But some changes are better than others. Haven't seen the Hal Leonard changes. If they are awful, I would advocate for modification. My Real Book has quite a few penciled in remarks and edits. It probably needs a lot more, as some of the progressions are pretty bad IMHO.

Personally I like the idea of always trying to stretch a little. So I like to play with people who are better than I, if possible. But there are limits to this idea. I tend to feel really anxious and subconscious whenever I am working with a truly authentic jazzer. I am perfectly comfortable with other jazz clowns as long as they can actually play and know the tunes. Many are totally clueless. They suck and don't even realize it. But oddly they are often good enough to get regular gigs. Back when I was still active, my attitude was the gig had to pay well or I had to enjoy it. The worse the gig sucked, the better it had to pay, and vice versa.

So you have to weigh the merits of the situation and decide what to do. My take is you really find this sort of limitation very distasteful, but there may be other reasons to stay in the group. For example, maybe no better players are available in your area. You can chose to stay and do nothing, choose to stay and try to bring your bandmates along, or you can decide to pursue some green grass in another location.

As far as whether you try to bring you bandmates along, or not. IMHO that depends largely on if they are receptive. If they are not receptive, then there is not really much you can or should do about it, except factor their attitude into the decision to stay or go. If your bandmates are open to growth, I think you probably are experienced enough to know that it can be a long and arduous process, so try to have realistic expectations.

Also legit players tend to have different aptitudes, priorities, and mental processes than jazzers. IMHO these two groups seem to comprehend and process music in unique ways. I think of myself as someone who did both competently, but I did not excel at either. If you are working with someone who is more of a legit player, there are usually pretty severe limits to how much the can grow towards being a jazzer.

 

[IamGroot]

It depends. I tend to stick fairly close to the changes myself, although I do throw in a few subs. But some changes are better than others. Haven't seen the Hal Leonard changes. If they are awful, I would advocate for modification. My Real Book has quite a few penciled in remarks and edits. It probably needs a lot more, as some of the progressions are pretty bad IMHO.

Personally I like the idea of always trying to stretch a little. So I like to play with people who are better than I, if possible. But there are limits to this idea. I tend to feel really anxious and subconscious whenever I am working with a truly authentic jazzer. I am perfectly comfortable with other jazz clowns as long as they can actually play and know the tunes. Many are totally clueless. They suck and don't even realize it. But oddly they are often good enough to get regular gigs. Back when I was still active, my attitude was the gig had to pay well or I had to enjoy it. The worse the gig sucked, the better it had to pay, and vice versa.

So you have to weigh the merits of the situation and decide what to do. My take is you really find this sort of limitation very distasteful, but there may be other reasons to stay in the group. For example, maybe no better players are available in your area. You can chose to stay and do nothing, choose to stay and try to bring your bandmates along, or you can decide to pursue some green grass in another location.

As far as whether you try to bring you bandmates along, or not. IMHO that depends largely on if they are receptive. If they are not receptive, then there is not really much you can or should do about it, except factor their attitude into the decision to stay or go. If your bandmates are open to growth, I think you probably are experienced enough to know that it can be a long and arduous process, so try to have realistic expectations.

Also legit players tend to have different aptitudes, priorities, and mental processes than jazzers. IMHO these two groups seem to comprehend and process music in unique ways. I think of myself as someone who did both competently, but I did not excel at either. If you are working with someone who is more of a legit player, there are usually pretty severe limits to how much the can grow towards being a jazzer.

Ditto for penciled-in changes.

Real Book Jazz Clowns are NOT people who are just learning jazz. My hats off to them and their struggle to improve.

My definition of a Real Book Jazz Clown is :

1) Someone who can play and sight read well;
2) Has never listened to the original artists;
3) Insists on playing the song as written without the standard intros, hooks and outros and all the wrong changes. Probably the wrong feel as well.
And bad time. "That piano dude with the horrible rubato".

4) And is totally oblivious to the problem.

These guys would get tossed off-stage if it was a blues or rock gig, but they get a pass for jazz. In jazz, we all get the call to play a less common tune directly of the real book once in a while, but someone who needs the book for Satin Doll...... I am loading out for a job right now. I will have a real book on the stand, but I hope not to use it.

PS.... For me Real Book jobs are a rotating crew of people, not a steady band. If I find a player a drag, I ask them to get someone else.

I heard the term "Jazz Clown" a few years back. The running joke was somebody saying "Do you hear a calliope"?