Poly vs. Nitro vs. something better?

[fhm555]

Poly can buff out just as clear as nitro.

But poly can't deliver a finish that looks like you could stick your arm in it up to your elbow.

Buffed poly looks like it's been dipped in clear plastic, enamel is pretty much the same but has a more diffuse appearance, more of a syrupy gloss. Acrylic lacquer comes close, but it still appears to have a clear topcoat.

Nitrocellulose lacquer is the only finish I know of that buffs out to look like color with no clear and has a 3 dimensional look of depth to it. The guy who taught me to paint called it a hard gloss and said nitro was the only finish capable of delivering that look.

Oddly enough, people will use nitro will then buff it out and throw a ton of clear on it. I understand the reasoning, protection and looks better longer, but it completely kills that special look that only nitro can deliver. You might as well use poly and save all the extra time and effort.

 

[Pilgrim]

Nitrocellulose lacquer is the only finish I know of that buffs out to look like color with no clear and has a 3 dimensional look of depth to it. The guy who taught me to paint called it a hard gloss and said nitro was the only finish capable of delivering that look.

Acrylic lacquer will do the same thing. BTDT.

 

[SirMjac28]

Yup

 

[Hopkins]

But poly can't deliver a finish that looks like you could stick your arm in it up to your elbow.

Buffed poly looks like it's been dipped in clear plastic, enamel is pretty much the same but has a more diffuse appearance, more of a syrupy gloss. Acrylic lacquer comes close, but it still appears to have a clear topcoat.

Nitrocellulose lacquer is the only finish I know of that buffs out to look like color with no clear and has a 3 dimensional look of depth to it. The guy who taught me to paint called it a hard gloss and said nitro was the only finish capable of delivering that look.

Oddly enough, people will use nitro will then buff it out and throw a ton of clear on it. I understand the reasoning, protection and looks better longer, but it completely kills that special look that only nitro can deliver. You might as well use poly and save all the extra time and effort.

Like I said before, poly doesnt have to be applied thick. I do all my solid color finishes in a single stage urethane and use no clear at all.

 

[Pilgrim]

This is an acrylic lacquer finish buffed - it does have clear coats, but it's deep looking. There are some reflections on the lower right area.

As I was doing research before choosing a finish on this bass, I found that nitro is rather nasty stuff, can cause lung damage, and is highly flammable. I chose to spray acrylic lacquer on this bass (and to wear breathing protection) for safety reasons, and because it's somewhat less flammable. I built a paint booth in my garage with plastic sheets taped to the ceiling, and created ventilation by taping two furnace filters over a window and putting a breeze box fan outside the window (on the far side of the furnace filters) pulling the vapors out of the "booth". I sprayed with an auto detail gun. Rattle cans add toluene and acetone to the equation, so even if you paint with rattle cans, wear breathing protection and be careful about fans or other devices that can cause sparks in the vapor path.

 

[fhm555]

Like I said before, poly doesnt have to be applied thick. I do all my solid color finishes in a single stage urethane and use no clear at all.

Where did I say anything about thickness of finish in the post you quoted? I was talking about the way nitro finishes have a look which can't be achieved with any other finish.

It is the only finish of those being discussed that can be brought to an ultra high gloss and not appear to have a clear top coat on it.

As Pilgrim mentioned, acrylic lacquer comes close but it still finishes with enough of that clear topcoat look that it's noticeable.

It is this totally unique aspect of a quality nitro paint job that makes it a must have for restoration fanatics of all stripes.

And yes nitro finishes are nasty and harmful if inhaled, but anyone working around any kind of paint spray equipment (including rattle cans) without at least a dust mask is asking for trouble.

I'm not advocating nitro finishes here. The material itself is becoming increasingly harder to come by and it is a real PITA to work with and requires a very narrow window of temp/humidity/mix ratio/air pressure/film thickness to get even a decent result, much less a spectacular result. It is most definitely not something a weekend warrior should take on unless they are willing to accept the fact there is a very steep learning curve associated with getting a world class result from nitrocellulose lacquer.

There is no doubt modern finishes are much more durable and easier to work with, but a well done nitro finish is truly a sight to behold.

 

[fretlessman71]

The question is..........Poly, nitro, something better?

Bare wood (no finish at all)

French Polish (the fore runner of nitro and used on violins etc from the 1700s on ward, has to be refinished about every 5 years.)

Linseed Oil

Danish Oil

A few coats of Birchwood Casey Gun Stock Oil.

If a finish makes a difference in sound, then go barewood.

I have half a mind to try this. (I've been accused of having half a mind regardless.) It's an ash body in clear poly.

Just how thick is a poly finish supposed to be anyway? .125"? More or less? It looks unbelievably dense...

Would you have to keep oiling the wood every year or so?

 

[Hopkins]

Where did I say anything about thickness of finish in the post you quoted? I was talking about the way nitro finishes have a look which can't be achieved with any other finish.

It is the only finish of those being discussed that can be brought to an ultra high gloss and not appear to have a clear top coat on it.

As Pilgrim mentioned, acrylic lacquer comes close but it still finishes with enough of that clear topcoat look that it's noticeable.

It is this totally unique aspect of a quality nitro paint job that makes it a must have for restoration fanatics of all stripes.

And yes nitro finishes are nasty and harmful if inhaled, but anyone working around any kind of paint spray equipment (including rattle cans) without at least a dust mask is asking for trouble.

I'm not advocating nitro finishes here. The material itself is becoming increasingly harder to come by and it is a real PITA to work with and requires a very narrow window of temp/humidity/mix ratio/air pressure/film thickness to get even a decent result, much less a spectacular result. It is most definitely not something a weekend warrior should take on unless they are willing to accept the fact there is a very steep learning curve associated with getting a world class result from nitrocellulose lacquer.

There is no doubt modern finishes are much more durable and easier to work with, but a well done nitro finish is truly a sight to behold.

One of these is two part urethane, the other is nitro. Can you tell?

 

[fretlessman71]

Nitro on the bottom?

 

[Hopkins]

Nitro on the bottom?

Winner

 

[GlennW]

You can turn a knob 1/4 turn and get far more variation in tone than from fooling around with different finishes.

 

[Hopkins]

Where did I say anything about thickness of finish in the post you quoted? I was talking about the way nitro finishes have a look which can't be achieved with any other finish.

It is the only finish of those being discussed that can be brought to an ultra high gloss and not appear to have a clear top coat on it.

As Pilgrim mentioned, acrylic lacquer comes close but it still finishes with enough of that clear topcoat look that it's noticeable.

It is this totally unique aspect of a quality nitro paint job that makes it a must have for restoration fanatics of all stripes.

And yes nitro finishes are nasty and harmful if inhaled, but anyone working around any kind of paint spray equipment (including rattle cans) without at least a dust mask is asking for trouble.

I'm not advocating nitro finishes here. The material itself is becoming increasingly harder to come by and it is a real PITA to work with and requires a very narrow window of temp/humidity/mix ratio/air pressure/film thickness to get even a decent result, much less a spectacular result. It is most definitely not something a weekend warrior should take on unless they are willing to accept the fact there is a very steep learning curve associated with getting a world class result from nitrocellulose lacquer.

There is no doubt modern finishes are much more durable and easier to work with, but a well done nitro finish is truly a sight to behold.

I reread your post and now I see what you are saying. The difference is more drastic on a natural finish or burst. A solid color is much less noticable, especially if using a single stage paint with no clear.