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Rhythm guit.....

#21
jeffbrown said:
Once he gets going, I think he tunes out a lot of what's going on around him. He gets carried away in the (his) moment. Like I said, he's enthusiastic. :) Since I've known him forever, I'm pretty sure I can get him to calm down and listen/pay attention. We are looking to play out again soon, and he knows we'll need to sound good.
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Was it Jascha Heifetz who said "Don't get excited, be exciting."

Not being a team player is IMO the number one problem in bands (or at least in the top three). Tuning out and not listening to the other musicians is not being a team player.
 
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#24
playing with others requires that everyone " listens " .. !!

write out the Chords and arrangement ... instruct all to follow , when it goes wrong = stop and refer to the notes ... = listen & pay attention

listening should not be confused with ' mind reading ' .. !!
 
#25
charlie monroe said:
Don't do this:
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Why not? How else is he supposed to get a set answer to what he is supposed to play? Sure it might be better to hit him before the practice for a chord chart (which he should be supplying anyways if these are his songs), but absent that I see no reason at all not to ask what the structure of the song is. It can't be a surprise to him that it will need to be consistent if he expects others to play with him.
 
#26
pwhalen said:
Why not? How else is he supposed to get a set answer to what he is supposed to play? Sure it might be better to hit him before the practice for a chord chart (which he should be supplying anyways if these are his songs), but absent that I see no reason at all not to ask what the structure of the song is. It can't be a surprise to him that it will need to be consistent if he expects others to play with him.
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Because this is a humiliating way to go about it. Must be that you missed the passive/aggressive undertones.
 
#27
He may never change. This will be an "issue" as long as you two are in a band together. Either be at peace with it and move on, or quit/fire him. If he has a good voice (somewhat hard to find) and can write a decent song, I say hang in there and stay/stick it out. I would tell him your concerns regardless. Just make it simple. Black and white. Or just accept it and move on. Now if he sounds like poopie sometimes, that is when you need to call him out. There is a difference between riffing and improv and just playing the wrong things and being out of key.

I know what you mean though. The guitarist in my band is like that. He's gotten better about it over the years but he still likes to play with things for FOREVER until he finds what he wants to play. But I think that happens a lot in original bands. I mean, he used to be obsessed with The Mars Volta (and I love that band too) but he would try to play in that style. Well, not everyone can do that. And do it well. I remember one day after I had been jamming with him and our drummer for a few months (me, the drummer and him met on MySpace years ago. We tried to get a project off the ground a couple times but it just didn't work out until about 5 years ago, which brought us to the band we are today) I realized that I just couldn't "find him" the way he was playing. I couldn't get with the style he WANTED to be. I could get down with HIS style though. Well, I walked away at that time, kept in touch. FF>> about 4 years and I came back, played with them again, and he totally changed his playing. He no longer wanted to be "Mr Mars Volta" and instead developed his own style. He said after playing with me and a few other bassists, he realized he needed to settle down and get back to some basics. Learned some Blues and dug into how awesome hard rock can be by keeping it simpler at times.

So I guess what I'm saying, he may change, he may not. But it will take time if he ever does. So you either gotta wait and bear down and do your best or you leave/fire him. It just depends. It's not always easy to just find replacements or find another band to play in. If you guys have a good thing, for the most part, talk it out with him. It's worth it IMO.
 
#28
charlie monroe said:
Because this is a humiliating way to go about it. Must be that you missed the passive/aggressive undertones.
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No, I caught the undertones. I also mentioned that it would be better to ask for/demand chord charts be written up and adhered to. But option number 2 is lock him into something at the time. Why are you suggesting using kid gloves with someone who is wasting everyone else's time because he either can't decide or can't remember how his songs should go?
 
#33
sean_on_bass said:
Explain to him that he can't change the harmonic progression of the song on the fly.
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This is where I am getting frustrated with this thread..... either you are a musician or you are not. If you are doing what this RG is doing---you are not a musician. Frankly---bluntness is needed or he needs to put the guitar down.

I am agreeing with you. It's like explaining to a car mechanic engines need oil. UGHHHHHHHH
 
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#35
Hoochie Coochie Man said:
I suggest that you record every practice and performance.

Have all involved listen indepenantly and then listen and discuss as a group.
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This ^

There is nothing like hearing your clams in the cold light of day to bring home just how unprepared for the rehearsal you were.

If he thinks there is nothing wrong than you really have a problem, either he honestly thinks it sounds fine or he cannot be bothered to listen to them.
 
#37
Thanks everyone for your replies. :)

This is the only band I'm in at the moment, and because of my WILDLY variable schedule (self-employed), probably the only one I'm going to be in for the foreseeable future. At least until I retire, which I'm projecting to be in about 5 more years (I'll be 70...). :woot: The others have families, jobs, commitments, as well. We play mostly for our own edification and fun, and do the occasional trip out of the "garage." I can't stress enough that these guys are my friends, *especially* the RG (we go back to the 4th grade, lol).We rehearse when everyone's schedule permits, which usually means @ 3 times a month. We enjoy the (original) music we make, and each others' company. Our 7 song CD, recorded a couple years ago, has received favorable comments from everybody who's heard it. :thumbsup:

All that said, getting harsh with the guy is not going to work. :rollno: This is not a business for us. Leaving is not something I'm willing to do for all the above reasons. I was looking for a solution which would help him pay attention and keep the tunes intact. Recording is one of the best options, IMHO.

I love the guy, and he just gets carried away, LOL. :smug: HE loves the music, and is enthusiastic, which is a good thing, again, IMHO. My plan is, when it happens again, to call a halt, and as someone above suggested, ask him what he's playing. I'll then say something to the effect that that wasn't how I understood it was supposed to go. We'll then break out the practice CD, listen, and take it from there. If he's in love with what he's doing, maybe make the changes if the others like it too. I am certainly not adverse to changing if it is going to sound better, especially if we're all on the same page. :bassist::bassist:

Again, thanks! I'll take it from here. :D:laugh:
 
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#38
I have just learned to grin and bear it when in a similar situation. For example, we "learned" a new song for the band... not that difficult technically, but has some tricky changes. But once you figure out the pattern, it's easy. I learned the song originally for a wedding and was slightly wrong... guitar player never learned it, so we were on our own for about an hour or so before the wedding party showed up, so I showed him what I had figured out to that point, and we pull it off well enough the wedding party loved it. Fast forward to the next gig, and he played it differently and thought he learned it...probably after about two passes on the song. So I go back to school on the song and it took about two gigs for me to get the ending right. I keep trying to tell him to go back and learn it, but instead, we play two different bridges throughout the whole song. I have it down solid, but he refuses to move off what he is doing. After a while, I quit trying to educate him, I just do my thing and wait for him to catch on...not going to happen anytime soon, lol ... BTW, the crowd never notices the weirdness of the notes, just me.
 
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#39
There are some very patient people on this site. I'd tell him he's killing the buzz. He needs to write up chord charts and / or memorize the tunes. If he's the driving force behind the band (frontman, lead vocals etc.) and you can't get rid of him, then you can decide if you want to continue or not. Personally, I'd quit because I would get pissed off each time we played and I play to enjoy myself.
 

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