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Source Audio Sorcerers Society (S.A.S.S) Part 3

#11,021
yberwaffe said:
This is an important point.

Actually, wifi would be better but it requires static IP in the devices to be stable.
An example is Soundcraft Ui series digital mixers, their badly implemented wifi hotspot is a major problem.
Use cat5 cable or a static IP address for the builtin wifi and they work great.
Click to expand...
Wifi run the same frequency as the cheaper wireless units if I remember correctly, right? A bunch of pedals, along with a bunch of wireless units, plus, wifi in the places running at the same time would worry me as far as reliability.

And I'll expand on my bluetooth thing. I appreciate Roger responding. To me the benefit to bluetooth comes when digging in to these pedals capabilities without having to mess with cables. Most of the time when I've built patches in pedals with bluetooth, it's just a more pleasant experience. But I'm not the target audience for any of these technologically advanced pedals. I prefer to twiddle physical knobs and unless the interface is exceptionally intuitive, I just don't have the patience for menu diving.

BUT when I said this wasn't an apples to apples comparison, I really meant it. Eventide stuff is significantly more expensive than the majority of SA pedals. They are also physically much larger when compared to the majority of the SA stuff, so there is always a compromise you have to make. And it's obvious many people do not have my issue. I'm sure I'm in the minority.
 
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#11,022
Wifi uses 5GHz and 2.4GHz freq bands. Bluetooth uses 2.4GHz, as does garage port remotes, RC car radios and what not.

A wifi network that's setup the right way with a decent router will work just fine, it's the hotspot stuff that messes things up.

Knob-twiddling on an Eventide pedal :roflmao:
Their flagship, H9, only has one button as far as I know.
 
#11,024
willsellout said:
Wifi run the same frequency as the cheaper wireless units if I remember correctly, right? A bunch of pedals, along with a bunch of wireless units, plus, wifi in the places running at the same time would worry me as far as reliability.

And I'll expand on my bluetooth thing. I appreciate Roger responding. To me the benefit to bluetooth comes when digging in to these pedals capabilities without having to mess with cables. Most of the time when I've built patches in pedals with bluetooth, it's just a more pleasant experience. But I'm not the target audience for any of these technologically advanced pedals. I prefer to twiddle physical knobs and unless the interface is exceptionally intuitive, I just don't have the patience for menu diving.

BUT when I said this wasn't an apples to apples comparison, I really meant it. Eventide stuff is significantly more expensive than the majority of SA pedals. They are also physically much larger when compared to the majority of the SA stuff, so there is always a compromise you have to make. And it's obvious many people do not have my issue. I'm sure I'm in the minority.
Click to expand...
A Neuro Hub with Bluetooth?? Now you're talking!! :) That does it all!!!
 
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#11,025
rsmith601 said:
A Neuro Hub with Bluetooth?? Now you're talking!! :) That does it all!!!
Click to expand...
Needs wifi to be interesting.
A wifi addon would be fine for those that have already bought the hub.

As I stated before, not a wifi hotspot but a proper wifi implementation with a manually entered IP address, login with password and WPS/WPA/WPA2 security.
This kind of wifi works even with a lot of phones around.
 
#11,026
rsmith601 said:
A Neuro Hub with Bluetooth?? Now you're talking!! :) That does it all!!!
Click to expand...
That's probably a brilliant way to go about accomplishing something like this. Your pedals are damn near bulletproof in their metal enclosures, and you wouldn't want to compromise their integrity for some feature that is, arguably, trivial. Do you think you could do that and be able to use the Neuro app to make changes to the pedals via a Hub with bluetooth?
 
#11,027
rsmith601 said:
You must all realize that Bluetooth is not a panacea. In many ways, its not great at all.
1) Must have an antenna. Where does that go on a pedal??? H9 puts it under that screen. All-metal pedals cannot have Bluetooth. Period.
2) With Neuro you can talk to lots of pedals at the same time. Try that with Bluetooth. One at a time.
We will do it one day somehow, but it must be done in a way that fits the look and feel of our pedals and how they are used.

Obviously, we have thought about these issues a long time.
Click to expand...

Just to add to this...I have both Strymon Mobius, a pair of Evenetide H9's and a Source Audio Aftershock and C4 / Neuro Hub.
Firstly the Strymon...it only connects to an editor via midi. Which is is a royal PITA because the Roland UM1 USB controller can't be connected to the Midi chain. That means I have to unplug this unit and perform a 1:1 midi connection with my laptop every time I want to deep dive or back up my patches.

Then comes my pair of Eventide H9's. The units are stunningly featured...but it's device UI is appalling. It's hard to belive that the big Alpha style Dial and 5 input buttons can be this bad for controlling this unit. There's no 3rd button either...kind of a massive feature drop there. If I need to connect this device to load a new update, edit a patch etc...then USB to my laptop IS THE WAY to go...I can connect to either device easily and perform quick edits. The software is slightly clunky but it works. There are some guys who use bluetooth / Ipad to edit all of the internal UI's knobs and buttons. This isn't going to work for me too easily as I use backups on my laptop. I perfer to configure the 5 buttons and the alpha dial to work out what I'll need to tweek in a live situation.

Next up...Source Audio. Generally (for me) a three way switch and four knobs and 128 patches accessed via midi. I can usually assign two knobs on each pedal to any parameter that I like. So i work out what I'm going to need in a live situation and edit that in. There's also control over what the expression pedal does and if you are cleaver...you can assign one function over a directly attached expression and another over a midi controlled expression. The Neuro editor is very simple to use and straightforwards. But it's not designed for all of the internal UI knobs to be accessible in a live situation (like the Eventide H9's). You tweek and pick the controls that you are most likely going to need.

I use a 4 port USB hub and each port can be on/off. So I can attach multiple or single devices to my laptop easily. This how I manage my larger pedals...it's by far the most reliable.

If you must have a live situation control every knob and button on the internal UI of your pedals, there are 3rd party midi control panels that have midi assignable knobs and buttons. I belive these can be mapped to both the H9's and One Series pedals...although I've not tried this myself. Personally, I like the simplicity or limitations of the device's physical controls. Life can get real complicated trying to remember what each midi assignment maps to what per patch on my boss ES-5. I don't need another layer of complexity.

As a caveat to all this...this is just my opinion...and my experiance. Your milage might vary.
 
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#11,031
yberwaffe said:
And your preferable solution is ?
Or are you just complaining.

Going to check out this faderfox stuff more.
Reading this forum has become rather expensive ;)
Click to expand...
There is no complaint here...just the way stuff is. I use a USB connection via a 4 port hub.
Out of the three marques that I listed, Strymon are easily the worst, Eventide are better and Source Audio is the best than the trio. I could add that EHX don't even bother with an external editor for the Hog 2.
 
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#11,033
Bassgeer said:
So in theory, I could set up one of these midi map-able controllers and basically expand the number of external controls that the C4 has??
Click to expand...
Precisely. FaderFox do a model where each of the knobs has a mini display showing exactly what is being controlled and what the value is. It is only 7-bit MIDI though so is only half the resolution of that capable by the SA knobs.

I’ve done something similar with my Morningstar MC8 where buttons cycle through the C4’s filter types and envelope shapes.

The next thing I plan to do is to use the C4’s two MIDI map functions which reassign the two control knobs so I can use the MC8 to set the knob and then tweak directly on the pedal surface. I can’t at present as there are a few bugs in the C4 MIDI implementation (the list order doesn’t correspond to the numerical CC value order as it should, which I raised with Jesse a few weeks ago). I might still go in and figure out what they are currently mapped to and which ones are missing but this will take some time.
 
#11,034
GMC said:
There is no complaint here...just the way stuff is. I use a USB connection via a 4 port hub.
Out of the three marques that I listed, Strymon are easily the worst, Eventide are better and Source Audio is the best than the trio. I could add that EHX don't even bother with an external editor for the Hog 2.
Click to expand...
If I was a gigging musician I wouldn't hesitate to buy a Headrush/Quad cortex/Helix or something similar.
They seem very convenient to lug around and setup different presets.
I use my stuff at home so size and cables doesn't matter much, and shifting cables doesn't bother me at all as long as I get the sound I want.
But you're out gigging I presume, so I understand your point of view.
 
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#11,035
Quatschmacher said:
Precisely. FaderFox do a model where each of the knobs has a mini display showing exactly what is being controlled and what the value is. It is only 7-bit MIDI though so is only half the resolution of that capable by the SA knobs.

I’ve done something similar with my Morningstar MC8 where buttons cycle through the C4’s filter types and envelope shapes.

The next thing I plan to do is to use the C4’s two MIDI map functions which reassign the two control knobs so I can use the MC8 to set the knob and then tweak directly on the pedal surface. I can’t at present as there are a few bugs in the C4 MIDI implementation (the list order doesn’t correspond to the numerical CC value order as it should, which I raised with Jesse a few weeks ago). I might still go in and figure out what they are currently mapped to and which ones are missing but this will take some time.
Click to expand...

Awesome, thanks for the reply! This is something I will have to look into.
 
#11,036
I'm having issues with my lunar phaser again. This time there is a swirly sounding white noise coming from it when it's not engaged.

I recently changed my power supply to a strymon ojai and gave it its own channel. That's when it started. I've tried different patch cables, the power supply that came with it, tried resetting it, and the white noise still persists. It's dead quiet if I only have it plugged in to my preamp.

I was using a one spot daisy chained to 11 pedals with no issues, so i tried daisy chaining it to another pedal and the white noise did get a little quieter.

Any ideas? Really frustrating. My only digital pedal and the pedal I've had the most issues with. About given up on digital.
 
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#11,037
phangtonpower said:
I'm having issues with my lunar phaser again. This time there is a swirly sounding white noise coming from it when it's not engaged.

I recently changed my power supply to a strymon ojai and gave it its own channel. That's when it started. I've tried different patch cables, the power supply that came with it, tried resetting it, and the white noise still persists. It's dead quiet if I only have it plugged in to my preamp.

I was using a one spot daisy chained to 11 pedals with no issues, so i tried daisy chaining it to another pedal and the white noise did get a little quieter.

Any ideas? Really frustrating. My only digital pedal and the pedal I've had the most issues with. About given up on digital.
Click to expand...
Does the peda still produce the noise when it’s by itself, and no other effects are between your guitar and amp? Have you tried enabling the buffered bypass?
 
#11,038
Gibs210 said:
Does the peda still produce the noise when it’s by itself, and no other effects are between your guitar and amp? Have you tried enabling the buffered bypass?
Click to expand...
After hours messing with it, I think it may be the power supply and another digital pedal that made the sound worse. unplugged that one pedal and used a seperate power supply and kinda fixed things, but now the strymon wont power that pedal, but works with all my other analog pedals. Both the digital pedals were on it's own power banks.
 
#11,039
Hey, Y'all. Can't tell if some other knucklehead asked the already.
Does anybody have experience stomping a C4 And and EQ2 with a DMC-Micro switch? I'm really solid with the DMC managing the C4 patches but I read where it can toggle 2 devices from SA or other so I'm gonna try to figure it out this week. Hints?
 
#11,040
Killing Floor said:
Hey, Y'all. Can't tell if some other knucklehead asked the already.
Does anybody have experience stomping a C4 And and EQ2 with a DMC-Micro switch? I'm really solid with the DMC managing the C4 patches but I read where it can toggle 2 devices from SA or other so I'm gonna try to figure it out this week. Hints?
Click to expand...
The Micro can control up to 3 MIDI pedals at once I believe. You just need to use the DMC’s “Preset Mode” and build preset(s) (presets within the DMC) that simultaneously recall presets from within both of your SA pedals. Check the Micro’s manual re: “Preset Mode” assuming you are currently using “Device Mode” to scroll through the C4’s internal presets. Also something that comes up on the reg on here is being able to change presets and choose whether each pedal is engaged or disengaged when the preset is selected.
 
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