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Between those 2 (I used to add The Art Ensemble of Chicago) you have a methodology to start, but once upon a time people were persuing what was called "Spontaneous Composition". It's like the legend of Shambala, seeming lost in the mist, but I've Been There and it's as real as the next snowstorm. It helps if you have a background in Classical music, (sonata form and beyond into the 20th century like Stravinsky Bartoc etc.) World music, like African and Indian or Balkan Gypsy brass bands, etc, and lots of Jazz improvisation, but wanting to make new music. At the best moments it's like you are really reading an invisible score. When I saw Miles Davis in 74 and 76, it was evident to me that he was hip to the latest in Western classical, and as I later found out, Stockhausen. He also tied the advance in music to the visual art world. If Kandinski can paint music, why can't musicians play pictures?
This kind of thinking can be found in many places these days, but in the U.S., less and less away from university cities that are being attacked for multiculturalism and collective solutions to problems. Like, where to put the snow?
ps, I've been to what is being marketed as a "jam" in the suburbs. it was just a promotion for a music school and it was a grandstand for blues guitarists. No reason for them to listen to anything cept the key. Only interesting thing the whole night was the vintage P bass one guy had, almost 1st year of production. Amazing tone.
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one man's "creative, free spirit" jamming away up there is another man's "self-indulgent wanker playing stuff that nobody wants to pay to hear, and not playing it very well." Jamming is great. creativity for those pursuing original music is great. I just don't see much of a market for it.
Jam in your basement or garage. the times I've been around "open jam"nights, it's been a strange collection of ego and and mostly mediocrity or outright incompetence; a boiling cauldron of incomprehensible, unlistenable junk. I agree with the above. Most people can't really improvise on the fly very well. The truly great musicians who can do this for the most part are busy and don't go to open jams, which usually are a way for bar owners to get free entertainment. They can be useful in meeting other musicians, yes, but rarely are they putting out a marketable product that the public wants to hear.
It works well with jazz, when you have truly gifted musicians. but for rock and such? I don't see it and I've never heard someone say, "hey, there's an Open Jam at the Bearded Pig! Let's go!!"
Jam in your basement or garage. the times I've been around "open jam"nights, it's been a strange collection of ego and and mostly mediocrity or outright incompetence; a boiling cauldron of incomprehensible, unlistenable junk. I agree with the above. Most people can't really improvise on the fly very well. The truly great musicians who can do this for the most part are busy and don't go to open jams, which usually are a way for bar owners to get free entertainment. They can be useful in meeting other musicians, yes, but rarely are they putting out a marketable product that the public wants to hear.
It works well with jazz, when you have truly gifted musicians. but for rock and such? I don't see it and I've never heard someone say, "hey, there's an Open Jam at the Bearded Pig! Let's go!!"
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I prefer spontaneous jamming a good majority of the time.
I would rather start on a 1,4,5 and branch out from there, instead of playing white room or paranoid again.
I would rather start on a 1,4,5 and branch out from there, instead of playing white room or paranoid again.
and TP did a lot of long long openings to iconic hit songs live....so....
I ran a jam for a few years also and found people want to play songs they know. It was literally ground hog day for the house band. 1) People do not want to make fools out of themselves 2)some people use these jams to try and get gigs so they certainly do not want to train wreck 3) the house band is so good it intimidates other folks into thinking they have to be perfect .
I totally agree. Jamming is becoming a lost art. Saddle up some gear, and join a REAL social network. We get together about monthly to jam on classics like Zeppelin, Skynyrd, Clapton and many others. If you don't/can't/won't play live with other musicians, I question your abilities. I have been trying to encourage lots of folks who I know are casual players to come out and "jam" even if that means playing one note really loud, in time with a bunch of people drinking and hanging out. I have spent lots of time playing and recording in my "studio"...playing with others is a bunch more fun.
BTW, I am in South Jersey about 30 minutes from any bridge...PM me if you are looking for a jam...I can play any instrument and would gladly pick up the 6 string or do vocals if that's what it takes to get a good jam together!
I'm pretty much always jamming. I've never been a not-for-note guy, not for lack of trying but inability. Every time I do a fill-in gig I'm jamming since I usually don't know all of the material.
There is nothing quite so amazing or capable of filling me with awe as having a couple of spontaneous riffs strung together, everyone is somehow mystically on the same page, and the air between you is an electric medium where a glance, a grin, a pentatonic lick, or a slight rhythm change speaks volumes and everyone knows what it means. It's like a live active mind meld, where you the sum is far greater than the parts and you're all saying the same thing in different languages.
I always say music needs to be *played* - so have fun, make mistakes, learn something, and don't stop no matter what until the end of the song. I agree not everyone gets it - I've played with older very experienced people who were gigging when I was watching Sesame Street who don't get it and young kids who started playing six months ago who do get it. I like paying with both types, but age has nothing to do with it.
^^ My piano player gets this evil little grin that means- Listen close, we're heading toward the planet Zotar, and we're gonna need seatbelts.
Planet Zotar! Great name for a really long jam.
I think a lot of it has to do with the fracturing of pop/rock into so many diverse types, so the bands I regularly listen to might overlap my drummer's list of favourites by ten or so bands, or the guitarist's by five or so, and they might overlap each other on seven or eight different bands. People who listen to blues or blues-based rock seem to get it the best.
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Miles is my #1 favorite musician and has been for many years, so I have much of his material through all of his decades innovating music. My favorite period is the from the mid 60's to the mid 70's. Box-set recordings of "outtakes" from those years are most illustrative of the improvising process. (Jack Johnson, In A Silent Way, Bitches Brew) After internalizing the produced versions over the years (bought them all when the first hit the record store) and knowing that material by heart, hearing how it went a few different directions in the studio and why he and Teo Maceo chose one over the other, or edited the final in the way they did is like a master course in improvisation, listening and critical/discriminating editing. If a box-set of "outtakes" was ever as valuable as the original - these are gold. From what I've read, Miles & Teo recorded many hours of playing - and distilled the material in the mixing booth for the products that were released. But live shows were performed and what was gained from those hours of exploration and later distilling created formats and structure that supported the improvisation on stage. If anyone wants to watch a prime example of this, the Isle of Wright concert (1970) is a beautiful document of that transitional period of "Miles electric" exploration. Every time I watch it I so envy young Dave Holland rocking his Fender P - can you imagine what he must have felt that day?
Your point is valid - and that's why @Paulabass attempting to lead 'workshops' in improvising is a noble cause. If a musician is a team player (not a wanker - egotistical overplaying), if your ears are open to everybody in the room, and if you are ready to fall on your face stretching to discovery and for the mutual gratification that is your reward when successful - the seeds of improvisation can be developed/grown. Not for everyone - those who have been there understand, and those who would rather not, shouldn't bother. No slight - I know classical players who wouldn't dream of improvising and are beautiful players. It's a specific animal who improvises and even those who don't can learn from an occasional successful jam session.
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I think of it like; the jam is developing slowly and suddenly it takes off - it could be anyone playing who instigates it either deliberately or instinctually, or something everyone at once falls into. At that critical juncture its get on the train or you'll have to wait for the next one!
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Improvisational singers are the best! (and yes, when they follow the same open-ears, not over-performing rules as everyone else)
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At the best jam-sessions I've experience over many years - 12 bar blues was silently understood by all a wet towel and avoided like the plague.
Passinwind
I know nothing.
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Yep, at least as often as not. But I try not to leave that to chance, which in my case means building an extended network of people to jam with over many years, and also being willing to play things pretty straight as and when needed. And it also means knowing when to punt on one scene and move on to another.
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As bass players, we have an inherent opportunity as "rudder" - working with the drummer to tactfully steer the ship into more interesting waters. That's why locking with the drummer is imperative. If the rhythm section is solid - it gives everyone else a platform/foundation to build on. Sounds familiar right? Luckily the guitarists I jam with are not "lead' players. They can play leads within a context but are more rhythm/general guitarists. The "lead guitarist" animal is a different story and can either be a really great part of a jam or a real downer. (ego-wanking) It's the nature of the beast.
I get what you're saying, but as far as the don't/can't/won't play live thing, some of us just got sick of all the BS involved with gigging, and don't really feel like going to open mics that always have the same people at them. Plus, when you would get paid to gig, it doesn't really sound that appealing to go to an open mic jam for free, when you can jam with friends for free anyway at somebody's house, ya know?
