The Sushi Box FX Secret Society

[Dr McBalders]

I have the standard Slampegg and the Venus Z, and the SP is pretty colorful, and it is baked in. The Venus is a little more neutral sounding, but warms the signal up nicely, with a pretty powerful eq section. As least this has been my experience. Hope this helps.
B.

 

[Rev_Slinky]

I just got my first delivery from Tube Depot and I have to thank y'all for sharing your wisdom and experience. I've only swapped one tube so far (a 12AT7 for the existing 12AX7 in v1 of a Smoke Signal), but it's already been a fun evening of sonic discovery! I might try a 5751 in that same spot next time, for just a bit more bite, but I also want to try that tube in Finally v1, just to see what magic ensues.

Does anyone have any other favorite SB substitutions to recommend?

 

[sloppy_phil]

I just got my first delivery from Tube Depot and I have to thank y'all for sharing your wisdom and experience. I've only swapped one tube so far (a 12AT7 for the existing 12AX7 in v1 of a Smoke Signal), but it's already been a fun evening of sonic discovery! I might try a 5751 in that same spot next time, for just a bit more bite, but I also want to try that tube in Finally v1, just to see what magic ensues.

Does anyone have any other favorite SB substitutions to recommend?

The 5751 is the magic bullet for me when it comes to Sushi. My experience is decidedly modest, though; only working with an Underground Accelerator and London Underground, so take it for what it's worth. It obviously ultimately depends on your bass, amp, playing technique etc etc. but for me the 5751 is the optimal blend of function; it pulls off just enough hair from the gain knob that it really opens up the "edge of breakup" sweet spot to anywhere from about 11:30-2:30 on the gain knob, depending on how saturated you want to go. But it still leaves room to achieve actual breakup/overdrive, whereas that's much harder with an AU7 or something. Likewise, it was harder to find that perfect sweet spot with the stock AX7s; they were a bit hot, and it went from super clean to full grit with what felt like a very small twist of the gain knob. Keeping it in that sweet spot was a little fiddly. FWIW, I play somewhat low output passive basses, so if you don't, this may be less relevant experience-sharing!

I have both of my pedals set for about 2 o'clock on the gain, and when I play light or moderately hard, it's just a nice, thick clean tone, full of saturation. Then when I dig in, it breaks up ever so slightly around the edges; the feeling of a full throttle engine fully revved up, waiting for that red light to turn green. Hit it with an overdrive, or any kind of dirt, in front, and magical things happen!

 

[Rev_Slinky]

The 5751 is the magic bullet for me when it comes to Sushi. My experience is decidedly modest, though; only working with an Underground Accelerator and London Underground, so take it for what it's worth. It obviously ultimately depends on your bass, amp, playing technique etc etc. but for me the 5751 is the optimal blend of function; it pulls off just enough hair from the gain knob that it really opens up the "edge of breakup" sweet spot to anywhere from about 11:30-2:30 on the gain knob, depending on how saturated you want to go. But it still leaves room to achieve actual breakup/overdrive, whereas that's much harder with an AU7 or something. Likewise, it was harder to find that perfect sweet spot with the stock AX7s; they were a bit hot, and it went from super clean to full grit with what felt like a very small twist of the gain knob. Keeping it in that sweet spot was a little fiddly. FWIW, I play somewhat low output passive basses, so if you don't, this may be less relevant experience-sharing!

I have both of my pedals set for about 2 o'clock on the gain, and when I play light or moderately hard, it's just a nice, thick clean tone, full of saturation. Then when I dig in, it breaks up ever so slightly around the edges; the feeling of a full throttle engine fully revved up, waiting for that red light to turn green. Hit it with an overdrive, or any kind of dirt, in front, and magical things happen!

Thanks! That sounds perfect! I play passive basses as well and am mostly looking for warmth and fatness, with a bit of grit at the edges. I'm looking forward to comparing the 5751 with the AT7 and AY7 to see what they each bring to the party.

 

[JackFawkes]

Thanks! That sounds perfect! I play passive basses as well and am mostly looking for warmth and fatness, with a bit of grit at the edges. I'm looking forward to comparing the 5751 with the AT7 and AY7 to see what they each bring to the party.

My experiences and opinions are pretty similar to @sloppy_phil 's.

I tried every different 12A_7 tube I own in my Finally to find my favorite (and because the circuit of the Finally is excellent to critically listen/audition different tubes in), and I also very firmly settled on a 5751 which hit a good sweet spot to be able to use my small stable of basses, synth, and guitars all either clean, edge-of-breakup, or nicely non-linear/distorted.
I also really liked the 5751 in my Slampegg Bee, but ended up going back to 12AX7 in that one just because it's baseline output was so low, I felt it ultimately benefitted from the extra gain of the AX in my signal chain.

Personally, I'm always a little baffled by how many people like to use 12AT7s and 12AV7s to reduce gain in a 12AX7 slot... very consistently in my experience:
5751 is a much better sounding/responding medium-gain substitute than a 12AT7, and
12AY7 is a much better sounding/responding low-gain substitute than a 12AV7, and
I feel that really makes sense too when you consider that the AT and AV were originally designed/intended to amplify radio frequencies, while the AY and 5751 were intended for amplification of signals in the (human hearing) audio frequencies... the AT and AV don't do a bad job by any means, they just don't seem to please my ear as much in critical listening tests (though of course once the output is mixed with different instruments, that minor character difference does mostly evaporate)

Jack

 

[Tassieviking]

Oh, I should make a quick video showing the tube swap process for Grand Slampegg. It's a little different, but in my opinion it's more elegant.

Yes please, I just looove looking under the bonnet on any pedal. (And V8 cars)

 

[GR7G5TER]

@Sushi Box FX


Any reason not to use one these? Specs seem right from (very limited) knowledge Seeing as I need to buy a new tube might as well go for NOS and see how that turns out. the 13D5 seems to get a lot of love. Not much more than getting a "tested" JJ 12AU7
View attachment 7077922

NOS Mullards really get good feedback but they well over £100, seen a matched pair for £950

@_Tay_

The Brimar sounds fantastic!

I honestly couldn't say if it's better than the JJ that i rolled in but i think it sounds a bit more tubey but i would really need to record them both to really hear if that's a difference or not.

I am getting some high pitched noise when everything is cranked (including the trimpot) that was present before the tube rolling began, but it's not really an issue.

@Sushi Box FX I was wondering if the SH had the polarity fix? It was in the last batch that went up for sale?

 

[Rev_Slinky]

My experiences and opinions are pretty similar to @sloppy_phil 's.

I tried every different 12A_7 tube I own in my Finally to find my favorite (and because the circuit of the Finally is excellent to critically listen/audition different tubes in), and I also very firmly settled on a 5751 which hit a good sweet spot to be able to use my small stable of basses, synth, and guitars all either clean, edge-of-breakup, or nicely non-linear/distorted.
I also really liked the 5751 in my Slampegg Bee, but ended up going back to 12AX7 in that one just because it's baseline output was so low, I felt it ultimately benefitted from the extra gain of the AX in my signal chain.

Personally, I'm always a little baffled by how many people like to use 12AT7s and 12AV7s to reduce gain in a 12AX7 slot... very consistently in my experience:
5751 is a much better sounding/responding medium-gain substitute than a 12AT7, and
12AY7 is a much better sounding/responding low-gain substitute than a 12AV7, and
I feel that really makes sense too when you consider that the AT and AV were originally designed/intended to amplify radio frequencies, while the AY and 5751 were intended for amplification of signals in the (human hearing) audio frequencies... the AT and AV don't do a bad job by any means, they just don't seem to please my ear as much in critical listening tests (though of course once the output is mixed with different instruments, that minor character difference does mostly evaporate)

Jack

Thanks for sharing your experiences with this, Jack. Now I'm even more excited about trying that 5751 in the Finally! Have you found much of a noticeable difference between types/manufacturers of 5751 tubes (or tubes in general, for that matter)? I'm amazed at how big the price differences are from one to the other.

 

[Sushi Box FX]

@_Tay_

The Brimar sounds fantastic!

I honestly couldn't say if it's better than the JJ that i rolled in but i think it sounds a bit more tubey but i would really need to record them both to really hear if that's a difference or not.

I am getting some high pitched noise when everything is cranked (including the trimpot) that was present before the tube rolling began, but it's not really an issue.

@Sushi Box FX I was wondering if the SH had the polarity fix? It was in the last batch that went up for sale?View attachment 7081047

That does indeed have the polarity fix.

 

[JackFawkes]

Thanks for sharing your experiences with this, Jack. Now I'm even more excited about trying that 5751 in the Finally! Have you found much of a noticeable difference between types/manufacturers of 5751 tubes (or tubes in general, for that matter)? I'm amazed at how big the price differences are from one to the other.

Most of the tubes in my shoebox sized collection are old stock/vintage, the only current production tubes that I've actually experimented with are the JJs that come stock in most SushiBox pedals. While I do hear small character differences between the different tubes in my collection (even different tubes of the same type, like 12AX7 which is what I have the most of). The differences tend to be pretty subtle, easily lost in a mix with other instruments, and even in isolation can typically be compensated for with very slight EQ'ing (more on that later).

I only have two 5751's in my collection and they're actually the exact same type: late-50's RCA 2-mica blackplates made for the FAA.
Ok, I do actually have a third, a GE from the 60's, but it's microphonic so it just sits in the shoebox taking up space...

As for the JJs, to my ear when critical listening, they make some of the most noticeable change in sound compared to every other 12AX7 I've heard. In my opinion they have a slightly "dark" or "veiled" sound; basically acting like a slight low-pass filter, rolling off a little high-end. Nothing that can't be "fixed" by turning up the treble a notch or two, but more noticeable than any other single tube manufacturer I've "heard". Aside from that tiny quirk, the general quality, reliability, and detail are all good on them; a good tube for sure.
The only other tubes I've heard that really roll off a perceptible amount of highs like a JJ are RFTs. Aside from that, the other slight difference that RFT 12AX7s tend to have compared to most others is that they seem to have a bit less overall "headroom" and go into non-linear "break up" sooner than most; a good trick if you like the sound of preamp tube distortion.

Spoiler: If you're curious what tube ended up in each of my SushiBoxes...

London Underground X: RFT ECC83 (12AX7)
Slampegg Preamp X: RCA (50's blackplate) 12AX7A
Black Eye X: Mullard (60's Blackburn) 7025 into Ei Niš (smooth gray) 12AX7A
Finally (handwired): RCA (50's blackplate) 5751
MORE: Raytheon (50's blackplate) 12AT7WA and RFT 12AU7

Jack

P.S.: While the sonic "differences" between the different makes is pretty subtle and not something that would ever stand out in a mix, I do appreciate that SushiBox pedals give my little shoebox of old glass tubes something fun and meaningful to actually do... that said, I also think most vintage tubes are hilariously overpriced beyond reason now; the prices reflecting a collector/speculators market, rather than representing that actual (very subtle) audio qualities they might have.
For example, a $400 1950's Mullard doesn't sound 400% "better" than a 1960's Mullard, it sounds 5% better (if even that much), and a $100 1960's Mullard doesn't sound 400% better than a $25 JJ, it sounds maybe 5-10% "better"... see what I'm saying? (Audio is such an abstract and difficult thing to try to "quantify" anyways )

 

[GR7G5TER]

That does indeed have the polarity fix.

I thought that would be case!

I'm gonna do some fettling at the weekend and see what's not playing nice, it's a non issue coz i have to engage extreme settings to get the noise, but i do love a trouble shoot.

 

[GR7G5TER]

While I do hear small character differences between the different tubes in my collection (even different tubes of the same type, like 12AX7 which is what I have the most of). The differences tend to be pretty subtle, easily lost in a mix with other instruments, and even in isolation can typically be compensated for with very slight EQ'ing

I concur, I'm sure if we actually measured it you could SEE the difference but there's very little in it sonically. Feel kinda cool to have NOS Brimar in my pedal but i don't feel the urge to go down a whole tube rolling rabbit hole.

....that said, I also think most vintage tubes are hilariously overpriced beyond reason now; the prices reflecting a collector/speculators market, rather than representing that actual (very subtle) audio qualities they might have.
For example, a $400 1950's Mullard doesn't sound 400% "better" than a 1960's Mullard, it sounds 5% better (if even that much), and a $100 1960's Mullard doesn't sound 400% better than a $25 JJ, it sounds maybe 5-10% "better"... see what I'm saying? (Audio is such an abstract and difficult thing to try to "quantify" anyways )

The prices i was seeing, especially for NOS Mullards was insane, at some of those prices I'd want them to be playing the bass for me!

 

[LSM07]

The gang's all here!


I gotta say you knocked it out of the park with this one, Nathan. It sounds fantastic on both electric and upright (at least, in my room). Right now just running it into the FX return of my BG-400, right away it sounded fantastic with bass/treble at noon. I don't have a good mic to record with but it's the best preamp I've bought so far, I think. Can't wait to give it some road testing.




Okay, now back to work...

 

[Mayo Fan]

Take it ease @LSM07, this isn't good for my GAS level

 

[wintremute]

The gang's all here!
View attachment 7081334

I gotta say you knocked it out of the park with this one, Nathan. It sounds fantastic on both electric and upright (at least, in my room). Right now just running it into the FX return of my BG-400, right away it sounded fantastic with bass/treble at noon. I don't have a good mic to record with but it's the best preamp I've bought so far, I think. Can't wait to give it some road testing.

View attachment 7081335
View attachment 7081336

Okay, now back to work...

How did you get it before I did! I was the first to order!! My day is ruined.

Just kidding. Glad you like it.

 

[_Tay_]

@_Tay_

The Brimar sounds fantastic!

I honestly couldn't say if it's better than the JJ that i rolled in but i think it sounds a bit more tubey but i would really need to record them both to really hear if that's a difference or not.

I am getting some high pitched noise when everything is cranked (including the trimpot) that was present before the tube rolling began, but it's not really an issue.

@Sushi Box FX I was wondering if the SH had the polarity fix? It was in the last batch that went up for sale?View attachment 7081047

Awesome! Some good testing

 

[Averell]

Just received one hour ago the Grand Slampegg. Damn that thing sounds good! I wanted to use that preamp alone for my practice space (a bass, the GS, an amp), and for that use the GS is perfect. It gives a nice and warm tone, rich mids, great sound ! The baxandall EQ is perfect for that use : simple and effective.

On my pedalboard I have a More and a Nobellium, both are more subtle preamps. I haven't checked yet, but I guess that the GS is better used alone, it has much more voice, so I may not replace my Nobelium with the GS in my pedalboard yet.

 

[darev]

Just received one hour ago the Grand Slampegg. Damn that thing sounds good! I wanted to use that preamp alone for my practice space (a bass, the GS, an amp), and for that use the GS is perfect. It gives a nice and warm tone, rich mids, great sound ! The baxandall EQ is perfect for that use : simple and effective.

On my pedalboard I have a More and a Nobellium, both are more subtle preamps. I haven't checked yet, but I guess that the GS is better used alone, it has much more voice, so I may not replace my Nobelium with the GS in my pedalboard yet.View attachment 7081664

Thank you for your observations so far. I find it interesting that both the Nobelium and the Grand Slampegg are based on a B15 but the Nobelium is more subtle. Well, the Nobelium, by way of Noble to get to the B15 clone.

I'm looking forward to more of your thoughts on the Grand Slmpegg.

 

[Averell]

Thank you for your observations so far. I find it interesting that both the Nobelium and the Grand Slampegg are based on a B15 but the Nobelium is more subtle. Well, the Nobelium, by way of Noble to get to the B15 clone.

I'm looking forward to more of your thoughts on the Grand Slmpegg.

Thanks. Don't take my observation for granted : my Nobelium is in my pedalboard, and I haven't listen to it alone for quite some time, and you cannot trust my memory. I haven't done a direct comparison between the two, but if you want I may record a loop and reamp that loop with the two preamps with different EQ settings.

And also : the EQ stack is very different. Boost only for the Nobelium, and Baxandall for the GS. The bass boost with HPF is very effective with the Nobelium : it gives plenty of bass, but very tight. You can do the same trick with the GS, but the resulting sound is "thinner". Either it's too boomy, either there's no bass (but I haven't take the time to dig that, I'm pretty sure you can have a very tight and full low end). And once again : it's not a direct comparison, so take all of that with some distance (and also my english is not as good as I want, so it's difficult for me to express what I truly feel, specially to express nuances).

When I have some time I'll make a quick video so you'll hear for yourself.

 

[Sushi Box FX]

Thank you for your observations so far. I find it interesting that both the Nobelium and the Grand Slampegg are based on a B15 but the Nobelium is more subtle. Well, the Nobelium, by way of Noble to get to the B15 clone.

I'm looking forward to more of your thoughts on the Grand Slmpegg.

The Nobelium is actually not based in the B-15. It's interesting how often I hear this, but the Noble preamp has almost nothing in common with the Ampeg B-15 circuit and in fact has more in common with a Fender preamp design.