They talked about Kirk’s Inverness Green SG on Fallon the other night. That is a sweet looking instrument!
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Thunderbird Club
- Thread starter TBird1958
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@11th Street Kid
The method I use for the three point bridge equipped bass set up. It's basically what's Noc posts but has a couple of additional trouble shooting tips.
Here it is from post #41490 in this thread...
Lots of advice on this thread about neck adjustments. I like my action very low so I might as well jump in with what has worked best for me... something I clipped from TB some time ago and modified heavily that has proven to be spot on for all my Gibby needs
Do this...
1. Loosen the strings to a slack setting then adjust your truss rod to create a slight back bow. From a dead straight neck position it might take two or three 1/3 clockwise turns. BTW, it's clockwise as seen from the headstock end of the bass looking down the neck towards the bridge.
2. Next, lower your bridge until the rear of the bridge is just off the body and the front of the bridge is about 1/8" higher than the rear.
3. Bring your strings up to tension and tune each string (don't worry about intonation yet).
4. Now check your action around the 15th and higher frets to see if it's comfortable for you without any or too much buzz (some players don't mind a little buzz). Don't worry about buzzing in the lower registers at this point. Raise your bridge as necessary to eliminate unwanted fret buzz in the 15th to end of fretboard area but always make sure the front stud is keeping the front of the bridge at least 1/8" higher than the rear of the bridge.
Note: the saddles on the 3 point bridge are specific in height to each string to ensure the strings match the FB radius, they are sequentially numbered so check to make sure each one is in the proper position. Also note that it is much easier on you, the studs and your stud inserts to slightly loosen the strings before raising the bridge height. Yes that means you'll need to retune after each adjustment. As an alternate, you can start step 4 with the bridge in a higher position and keep lowering and tuning until you get the level of buzz in the 15th and higher frets that suits you. Just be sure to always keep the front stud higher than the rears.
5. Now you've got your bass retuned with a lower action at the high frets. Your lower frets will now either buzz (see 6a for the subsequent steps) or the action will still be too high even in the low registers (see 6b for the subsequent steps).
6a: Low Register buzzes: You need to loosen the truss rod. Take off the truss rod cover and insert an allen wrench in the allen nut (the cheaper Epis generally have allen nuts). Don't detune the bass for that, rather lift the A and the D string to the side to the slots of the G and E string to have room for turning the allen wrench. With the bass' butt resting on your toes and the strings/fretboard facing away from you, you - while standing up and looking down - will now turn the allen wrench counterclockwise maybe 1/3 of a turn and immediately look to find out how the action of the bass has altered and buzzing has become less or disappeared. Don't be scared of overdoing it - it is impossible to break a truss rod by loosening it as you are releasing tension. That said, one or two "one third turns" counterclockwise should do it. sometimes you will need a few more of those to actually adjust the bass if the neck is too straight or even curved away from the fretboard (called back bow).
6b: Low Register has too much action: Same as 6a, except that you have too tighten the truss rod now which is done by turning the allen wrench clockwise. You will also have to be more careful as you can break a trussrod by overtightening it. When tightening a truss rod its best to slacken the strings a bit first, then make your truss adjustment followed by retuning and checking to see if your adjustment eliminated unwanted fret buzz.
7. After a combination of either steps 5 and 6a or steps 5 and 6b you should have a relatively or even totally buzz free bass with good to reasonable action. If there is still some persistent buzzing at some places then raise the bridge a little. Raising the front stud will raise all strings (remember to slacken the strings first then after raising the front stud retune the bass). Raising the treble side rear stud just a very tiny bit more may help the D and G string, or raising the bass side rear stud just a tiny bit more may help the E and A strings. The bridge does not have to be dead level but it should be very very close.
8. You should be done... but if you're still getting buzzing just on one string (while the other strings are buzz-free) and you have to raise the bridge considerably to make it go away even though you could stay much lower if it were just for the other strings, then double check you're saddles to ensure they're in the proper sequence. In a pinch you might be able to swap the D and A saddles but only as a last resort. If you still have unwanted buzzing then your low action expectations may be too much or you might have a string or fret level or neck hump problem. See step 9 for string checking. For fret level or twisted neck or neck hump or ski jump problems find a good luthier and see if they can fix the problem.
9. Occasionally it's possible to twist a string when installing a them on a bass. A twisted string can potentially have an odd oscillation that may make it vibrate in more of an elliptical pattern vs a flatter pattern. In some cases the effect is great enough to cause fret buzz on that specific string. To fix this, detune the string and starting at the nut pinch the string between your fingers and slowly slide down the string towards the bridge allowing the ball end of the string to spin as needed to eliminate any accidental twist you may have put in the string when installing. Once untwisted, hold the ball end in position and retune the string without letting the ball flip or spin. This should eliminate any twist related issues.
Edit: follow all the above steps in order. Don't skip steps or start in the middle.
The method I use for the three point bridge equipped bass set up. It's basically what's Noc posts but has a couple of additional trouble shooting tips.
Here it is from post #41490 in this thread...
Lots of advice on this thread about neck adjustments. I like my action very low so I might as well jump in with what has worked best for me... something I clipped from TB some time ago and modified heavily that has proven to be spot on for all my Gibby needs
Do this...
1. Loosen the strings to a slack setting then adjust your truss rod to create a slight back bow. From a dead straight neck position it might take two or three 1/3 clockwise turns. BTW, it's clockwise as seen from the headstock end of the bass looking down the neck towards the bridge.
2. Next, lower your bridge until the rear of the bridge is just off the body and the front of the bridge is about 1/8" higher than the rear.
3. Bring your strings up to tension and tune each string (don't worry about intonation yet).
4. Now check your action around the 15th and higher frets to see if it's comfortable for you without any or too much buzz (some players don't mind a little buzz). Don't worry about buzzing in the lower registers at this point. Raise your bridge as necessary to eliminate unwanted fret buzz in the 15th to end of fretboard area but always make sure the front stud is keeping the front of the bridge at least 1/8" higher than the rear of the bridge.
Note: the saddles on the 3 point bridge are specific in height to each string to ensure the strings match the FB radius, they are sequentially numbered so check to make sure each one is in the proper position. Also note that it is much easier on you, the studs and your stud inserts to slightly loosen the strings before raising the bridge height. Yes that means you'll need to retune after each adjustment. As an alternate, you can start step 4 with the bridge in a higher position and keep lowering and tuning until you get the level of buzz in the 15th and higher frets that suits you. Just be sure to always keep the front stud higher than the rears.
5. Now you've got your bass retuned with a lower action at the high frets. Your lower frets will now either buzz (see 6a for the subsequent steps) or the action will still be too high even in the low registers (see 6b for the subsequent steps).
6a: Low Register buzzes: You need to loosen the truss rod. Take off the truss rod cover and insert an allen wrench in the allen nut (the cheaper Epis generally have allen nuts). Don't detune the bass for that, rather lift the A and the D string to the side to the slots of the G and E string to have room for turning the allen wrench. With the bass' butt resting on your toes and the strings/fretboard facing away from you, you - while standing up and looking down - will now turn the allen wrench counterclockwise maybe 1/3 of a turn and immediately look to find out how the action of the bass has altered and buzzing has become less or disappeared. Don't be scared of overdoing it - it is impossible to break a truss rod by loosening it as you are releasing tension. That said, one or two "one third turns" counterclockwise should do it. sometimes you will need a few more of those to actually adjust the bass if the neck is too straight or even curved away from the fretboard (called back bow).
6b: Low Register has too much action: Same as 6a, except that you have too tighten the truss rod now which is done by turning the allen wrench clockwise. You will also have to be more careful as you can break a trussrod by overtightening it. When tightening a truss rod its best to slacken the strings a bit first, then make your truss adjustment followed by retuning and checking to see if your adjustment eliminated unwanted fret buzz.
7. After a combination of either steps 5 and 6a or steps 5 and 6b you should have a relatively or even totally buzz free bass with good to reasonable action. If there is still some persistent buzzing at some places then raise the bridge a little. Raising the front stud will raise all strings (remember to slacken the strings first then after raising the front stud retune the bass). Raising the treble side rear stud just a very tiny bit more may help the D and G string, or raising the bass side rear stud just a tiny bit more may help the E and A strings. The bridge does not have to be dead level but it should be very very close.
8. You should be done... but if you're still getting buzzing just on one string (while the other strings are buzz-free) and you have to raise the bridge considerably to make it go away even though you could stay much lower if it were just for the other strings, then double check you're saddles to ensure they're in the proper sequence. In a pinch you might be able to swap the D and A saddles but only as a last resort. If you still have unwanted buzzing then your low action expectations may be too much or you might have a string or fret level or neck hump problem. See step 9 for string checking. For fret level or twisted neck or neck hump or ski jump problems find a good luthier and see if they can fix the problem.
9. Occasionally it's possible to twist a string when installing a them on a bass. A twisted string can potentially have an odd oscillation that may make it vibrate in more of an elliptical pattern vs a flatter pattern. In some cases the effect is great enough to cause fret buzz on that specific string. To fix this, detune the string and starting at the nut pinch the string between your fingers and slowly slide down the string towards the bridge allowing the ball end of the string to spin as needed to eliminate any accidental twist you may have put in the string when installing. Once untwisted, hold the ball end in position and retune the string without letting the ball flip or spin. This should eliminate any twist related issues.
Edit: follow all the above steps in order. Don't skip steps or start in the middle.
I agree that they previously had the wrong "experts". Well designed and executed market research will tell you more than any expert can.* Experts have their place especially in providing suggestions that can be tested with market research and market experiments, but it is no way to make product decisions.
* The only exception might be in medical products in which the experts are well recognized and have a significant influence on practice (that is, they actually write the practice/treatment guidelines). However, my own experience with that is listen to the key opinion leader but check that the problems they profess match what the average sees. There is always segmentation to be done.
- Mar 13, 2008
- 18,894
- 142,206
- Disclosures
- Endorsing Artist Mike Lull T Bass pickups, The Bass Shop, Seattle WA.
Yes, easy enough to do, I've done at least 3 sets over the years.
It looks brutal, but the pickup feels no pain and is actually happy to be free of it's plastic skin.
I've heard that adding a metal pup cover can change the output and sound of the pup. Don't know if that's true or just a myth, but I'd be interested to hear from someone that's done it. Is it true, is it noticeable, or is it something that has to be put on a scope to notice?
I always find that the black pickups look bigger than chrome even when the same size.
yeah, basically what I was asking, I would think grounding the metal cover vs floating it would make a diff? not sure....
It's true, the phenomenon is called the "Eddy Current", or Foucault current. It depends on the strength of the magnet, the distance between the metal plate and the magnet, the sort of metal, and the frequency.
For a guitar pickup, it mainly affects the higher frequencies, it makes your treble less pronounced (the eddy currents cancel the high frequencies).
Same here. Fewer variables to think about. If I'm adjusting, I loosen the strings.
- Mar 13, 2008
- 18,894
- 142,206
- Disclosures
- Endorsing Artist Mike Lull T Bass pickups, The Bass Shop, Seattle WA.
You def lose some of the treble response, but TB plus are a bit different than say China Buckers anyway, so not always a bad thing - No real change in output.
Thought I’d share a bit of nostalgia I watched last night.
You’re defining experts far more narrowly than I am.
The Association was weirder than I expected given the music I was aware of. Trippy band intro. I had two of the suits, too.
Miles, I was surprised by that as well!
The Association was a pretty good live act, although a lot of the “hits” were originally recorded with the Wrecking Crew musicians. I have a double record vinyl live album from around ‘70 that is pretty good.
I played a gig opposite them in ~1974(?). We were the dance band, they were 'the show'. Nice, tight group.
ADDENDUM: Nice guys, too(as I vaguely remember).
Last edited:
Experts shouldn't be confused with ex-spurts.
I was just watching that last week. Enjoyed the Who performance!
Tracking said it would be delivered tomorrow. It just arrived! Talk to you all later!
