Enjoy the benefits of a premium membership!
Upgrade Account
-
TalkBass has been independent since 1998. Add your voice.
Create a free account to reply to discussions, view embedded media, and browse with fewer display ads.
Join free Log in
Want zero display ads or expanded classifieds tools? Compare plans.
What does the future look like for weekend warriors?
- Thread starter Jarrett
- Start date
The bar must be doing something wrong.....
6 originals bands some (3 or 4 ?) of whom were pretty bad.
The bar is doing something wrong.
Yeah, I've seen a lot of small-time original bands that really suck...that's not the venue's fault (other than they probably shouldn't have booked them in the first place).
In fact, I play in a couple bands just like that!
In fact, I play in a couple bands just like that!
Good point. BUT if I owned a bar, I'm pretty sure I could get 50 people to turn up to your party, and I'd cook up the best BBQ and mix kicking drinks.
Seems like alot of bands expect a bar to provide fans for their music/performance. If there are no extra people at the bar, whats the point of a band being there at all?
Everybody was at the club with the band that plays The Fray, One Republic, Avicii etc.....
My point was that nobody knew they were bad until they played. I used to go see bands play when I wasn't gigging and sometimes they were good sometimes they were bad but I went anyway because there were gems. The bar is doing something wrong because they aren't booking bands and drawing a crowd, they let these "promoters" hire any band that will sell tickets.
I agree to an extent, but it seems that more and more venues are relying on the bands themselves to bring in the whole crowd. There are tons of venues that have almost no regular crowd at all. I am not saying that the band shouldn't have some draw of its own, or that the venue should be packed by itself before you do anything, but there should be some middle ground.
"Back in the day" bars, restaurants, clubs, whatever you want to call those venues used to have a "regular" crowd. It likely wouldn't be a full house by any means, but you could expect a core group of people to be there on any given night of the week. there was a sense of familiarity and loyalty on both sides of the bar, and with that came acts that appealed to the audience there, the regulars brought some extra friends when there was live music, the band filled in the rest of the crowd with its following, and everyone lives happily ever after.
This does still happen to an extent, but from what I've seen and a lot of people here have echoed, it happens less and less. Not only are a lot of the venues that used to do this kind of thing struggling or closed, but people have a hard time being loyal to a breakfast cereal let alone a venue/band.
Some of that is the venues' fault. A lot of places have been the same for the last 30 years. They still have the same decor, the same menu, the same drink specials and beers on tap. The only thing that's changed about the *Bar's name* Burger in the last 20 years is the price. There's a local bar where a "good" night is when they have to turn the lights on in the other half of the place because they have one table that won't fit in the main space. They still have Molson OV on tap, and I can barely remember when my dad (and almost everyone else) stopped drinking that beer some 20 years ago. A lot of the places that have tried to modernize have tried way too hard, which scared away their remaining regulars, and no one's really taken to them since.
The bands' are fault too. Plenty of mention of bands playing "new" covers from 20 years ago with the majority of their music being from 20 years before that. Plenty of mention of bands who have turned up the suck knob to 11. There are some really talented bands out there, and/or bands that have kept up with some of the current music trends as well. As has been mentioned though, music has split into a million different genres and sub genres and spin offs and hybrids and stuff that you really can't have the mass appeal/please the majority of the crowd the way you used to when the only two genres were Country & Western.
I think the "Promoter" thing that is happening now is a failing attempt to do hang onto something that isn't working. Venues and bands aren't bringing in crowds, so they're hoping some third party who's only interest in the success of the event is usually their portion of the profit will be their silver bullet. And in a lot of cases, it really isn't working for anyone involved, and it's just adding someone else in there that expects to get paid from an ever shrinking slice of the pie.
Maybe bars and the bands that play them will "get back to basics" when it comes to providing a quality space and a quality product, and maybe that will bring the crowd back. Maybe it won't. In the here and now, I think we need to broaden our horizons and look at other opportunities. Non-traditional venues are starting to host music more and more now as they are realizing that it can draw in a crowd. Maybe your Deathcore band isn't particularly suited to a natural history museum, but there's a good chance if you meet the right visual artist, you could collaborate and put together their art with your music in an industrial space and put on one h*ll of a show.
That was a great post - but this right here is what I'm seeing much less of these days. It seems like more DJs and fewer bands are in those nontraditional places.
This entire thread has been worth the read; so many great points, and ideas, and sadly, a lot of the same stuff that has me ready to retire from playing, five months ahead of schedule. BACKGROUND: I had promised myself to be ready to quit, at 50, and that birthday comes in August. I have been fortunate enough to become a busy weekend warrior -with some weeknight action, too- in the last 5 years. Two years ago, I got in with my current band, which does a lot of "lite" gigs (acoustic guitar, me playing through a Shuttle 3.0 combo, and not much else) in wine bars. These lite gigs gave me a lot of freedom of expression, serving as paid rehearsals for full band shows. 2013 saw us get more into the full band side, and a few lineup changes have served to check the momentum.
I'm ready to hang up the basses, and store the amps, thinking to myself that it is time to work on other things, in my life, and that, if I am meant to keep playing, the situation will have to find me. This thread does not give much encouragement, but I am in a few Rolodexes and contact lists, so one never knows for sure if I am about to play my last gigs, or not.
The end is very near. I had hoped to be able to push this band into the casino tier, but see that it is not likely to happen. I end up showing the keytard a lot of his parts. He was actually the bassist I replaced, having left to deal with external stressors, but is the "attitude" guy in the band, and close buddies with the guitard/BL. I'm the BL's foil, in the literary/musical sense. Imagine Pete Townsend playing dance-pop variety covers from the 70's to now. Yup, I'm the Entwistle figure. The reader may perhaps see why I love those "lite" gigs, since I have a lot more sonic space to work with.
I've been aware that I was nearing this edge, since last summer, but there were a few "bucket list" venues and gigs left to do. We've done some, and will do another (Flicka's, for you locals), on the 22nd, with an outdoor festival, the following day. The April calendar looks like just lite gigs, due to the new drummer's contractual obligations elsewhere. In other words, the timing is right, and the overall situation is certainly providing some signposts, along the way. It won't get any better, once the drummer is unencumbered, in late April. Some beloved venues have shuttered, and most of the cover band musicians in this town are hacks. Most cover bands play the same tired war-horse songs, although ours does strive to be distinctly different, in terms of repertoire. We are not that far off the beaten path, despite my efforts at creative mashups, and less-than-obvious song choices from renowned artists.
Along comes this thread, and any uncertainty that I had about delaying the inevitable has been put to rest. It's been a good ride. Perhaps, as some have hopefully expressed, there will be an uptick in desire to experience live music, but I do not see it happening suddenly. In other words, if I'm done, I'm probably DONE...and I am OK with that.
Sorry to go long-winded. Some of you East Valley locals might wanna PM me, so I can turn your contact info over to the BL, when the bombshell is dropped, later this month. I do plan to keep the exit somewhat open-ended, should a nice gig line up, before my replacement is deemed ready. It is high time that the Chicks at Shows and Hot Singerbabe Club threads had some new blood, anyway. I'll probably still lurk here, now and again.
I'm ready to hang up the basses, and store the amps, thinking to myself that it is time to work on other things, in my life, and that, if I am meant to keep playing, the situation will have to find me. This thread does not give much encouragement, but I am in a few Rolodexes and contact lists, so one never knows for sure if I am about to play my last gigs, or not.
The end is very near. I had hoped to be able to push this band into the casino tier, but see that it is not likely to happen. I end up showing the keytard a lot of his parts. He was actually the bassist I replaced, having left to deal with external stressors, but is the "attitude" guy in the band, and close buddies with the guitard/BL. I'm the BL's foil, in the literary/musical sense. Imagine Pete Townsend playing dance-pop variety covers from the 70's to now. Yup, I'm the Entwistle figure. The reader may perhaps see why I love those "lite" gigs, since I have a lot more sonic space to work with.
I've been aware that I was nearing this edge, since last summer, but there were a few "bucket list" venues and gigs left to do. We've done some, and will do another (Flicka's, for you locals), on the 22nd, with an outdoor festival, the following day. The April calendar looks like just lite gigs, due to the new drummer's contractual obligations elsewhere. In other words, the timing is right, and the overall situation is certainly providing some signposts, along the way. It won't get any better, once the drummer is unencumbered, in late April. Some beloved venues have shuttered, and most of the cover band musicians in this town are hacks. Most cover bands play the same tired war-horse songs, although ours does strive to be distinctly different, in terms of repertoire. We are not that far off the beaten path, despite my efforts at creative mashups, and less-than-obvious song choices from renowned artists.
Along comes this thread, and any uncertainty that I had about delaying the inevitable has been put to rest. It's been a good ride. Perhaps, as some have hopefully expressed, there will be an uptick in desire to experience live music, but I do not see it happening suddenly. In other words, if I'm done, I'm probably DONE...and I am OK with that.
Sorry to go long-winded. Some of you East Valley locals might wanna PM me, so I can turn your contact info over to the BL, when the bombshell is dropped, later this month. I do plan to keep the exit somewhat open-ended, should a nice gig line up, before my replacement is deemed ready. It is high time that the Chicks at Shows and Hot Singerbabe Club threads had some new blood, anyway. I'll probably still lurk here, now and again.
Will, I agree DJ's are getting a lot of the love we aren't. While there definitely are some hack DJ's out there, often it's "better" for the venue and the entertainment financially to pay one body. Simply put, offer a DJ half the money you would a 3-6 piece band, and he's likely to take the gig and walk away happy. The 6 piece is likely to lament the days when they used to get real money for playing a show.
Maybe it is because I am a musician, but when I walk into a store/gallery/café/public space and there's a DJ doing their thing, my first instinct is to turn around and leave, or try to get in and out as quick as possible. When I encounter a band in an unusual environment, I am much more likely to stay a while. I feel like they are adding something that was not an option before, instead of a DJ who often is providing something interchangeable with that venue's normal ambient music.
Mr. Spanker: it sounds like you have had some ups and downs, but ultimately an enjoyable run. While hanging up the skates sounds like it is in the cards for you, I encourage you to keep a bass or two (or ten if that's your style) around and enjoy it as much as you can. Sometimes we get too caught up in the business side of things and the doom and gloom and forget to remind ourselves just how much we enjoy making music. Keep a couple of "lite" gigs and things that make you happy going. Life's too short to give up on something you love because the business of it is a bit crummy right now.
Mr. Pickle: I am sorry my attempt to not offend others came across as self-censorship. Sorry. I guess that's the Canadian in me trying not to rustle too many Jimmies. Sorry. Did I apologize yet? Eh?
Maybe it is because I am a musician, but when I walk into a store/gallery/café/public space and there's a DJ doing their thing, my first instinct is to turn around and leave, or try to get in and out as quick as possible. When I encounter a band in an unusual environment, I am much more likely to stay a while. I feel like they are adding something that was not an option before, instead of a DJ who often is providing something interchangeable with that venue's normal ambient music.
Mr. Spanker: it sounds like you have had some ups and downs, but ultimately an enjoyable run. While hanging up the skates sounds like it is in the cards for you, I encourage you to keep a bass or two (or ten if that's your style) around and enjoy it as much as you can. Sometimes we get too caught up in the business side of things and the doom and gloom and forget to remind ourselves just how much we enjoy making music. Keep a couple of "lite" gigs and things that make you happy going. Life's too short to give up on something you love because the business of it is a bit crummy right now.
Mr. Pickle: I am sorry my attempt to not offend others came across as self-censorship. Sorry. I guess that's the Canadian in me trying not to rustle too many Jimmies. Sorry. Did I apologize yet? Eh?
I'm doing my damned best to find out what happens when you like music that people like.
From what I've seen...the DJ's play the music that the patrons want to hear. I quit a band last June. Part of the reason was that the BL just didn't get it. We kept playing the same s**t gig after gig after gig after...............!! And most of it didn't get folks up to dance. We'd take a break and the DJ would spark up and immediately the floor was filled. So I told him he needs to write down the names of the songs the DJ is playing and work them into the setlist. Never happened and the patrons always complained "we don't want to hear that sappy love song s**t, we want to dance'. And this one spot was known as a stepper club. If you don't know what 'stepping' is, look it up! Last March or April 2013, when Blurred Lines first hit, I told BL, 'yo, we need to add that'! Never happened. I quit in June 2013. You know when they finally played it? October 2013. Over 6 months later! And that was the only current top40 tune in their setlist. The band is all but defunct now!
Quality control.
Quality control on the food, quality control on the drink, quality control on the amenities, quality control on the staff and quality control on the live show.
If you're not doing that, you've got no right to expect anyone to support your establishment...
Quality control on the food, quality control on the drink, quality control on the amenities, quality control on the staff and quality control on the live show.
If you're not doing that, you've got no right to expect anyone to support your establishment...
That would have been my second guess. ASU students generally won't venture much further than Mill. Check out Rula Bula on a Friday. Red Owl has had patronage issues going back at least 7 years or so. Terrible location. And some of it may be the way it's run.
I assume you will have this conversation when a new venue cold calls you to offer you a gig, not when you approach a new venue about getting in the door?
By the way, if I was a club owner, and you hit me with that, I would say the following:
"Why would I need the exposure of catering your party for free next weekend when I will already be operating my club business profitably that night?"
Quality, a very good point. This little word seems to have fallen on hard times as of late. In my opinion there is enough blame to go around on both sides of the equation. My town use to have a thriving live music scene, I believe this was a direct result from having a ton of really great talent here combined with a ton of venues to play, The cream rises to the top, you had to be good to work steady, the bar was set high and thats what you aspired to, otherwise you worked hole in the wall joints out of town. Good bands fillled venues on a regular basis, I remember times you could barely squeeze through the door they were so full. These same places you could throw a rock through the room on a friday night and not hit anyone. Why you ask ? Economy ? maybe , DWI laws , people are people and still like to go out, Im not making excuses for impaired driving though, the law is still the law, use good judgement here. No, in my opinion the Quality, yes theres that word again, has gone down considerably, some of the local acts I've seen lately were not good at all, and I blame the venue for hiring such half assed outfits, Im sure they got all there buddies to come out and that made the lazy club owner happy because he sold lots of drinks, seems no one really cares about the Quality of the show so long as there cash register is ringing up sales, this setting a bad precedence, in the the psych world this would be termed as "co dependcey" not a healthy thing for either party. SO, bands .... step up your game, and bar owners, give the public some reason to patronize your esablishment, you know, like exemplary service, drink and food specials,"quality entertainment" a little advertising never hurt either, OK I've rambled on long enough, I speak only from many years of personal experience, your experiences may be different than mine.
"Why would I need the exposure of catering your party for free next weekend when I will already be operating my club business profitably that night?"[/QUOTE]
I think you've missed the point here, is turn about not fair play? if not, we might as well stop playing in clubs altogether, would you go to your day job and not get paid for your labor? I hardly think so.
I think you've missed the point here, is turn about not fair play? if not, we might as well stop playing in clubs altogether, would you go to your day job and not get paid for your labor? I hardly think so.
