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Why are standalone preamplifiers a dying breed?

What do you think about standalone bass preamps

  • I wish there were more options for standalone bass pre's

    Votes: 89 28.3%

  • I think there are plenty of options for standalone bass pre's

    Votes: 70 22.2%

  • I get everything I need from integrated heads

    Votes: 91 28.9%

  • I used to use bass pre's, now I used studio channels

    Votes: 12 3.8%

  • I went fishing once. I like ice cream. Durr Hurrrrr....

    Votes: 53 16.8%
  • Total voters
    315
#101
david meissner said:
i like the simplicity of this pre/power set-up ...
Aguilar DB659 preamp
Stewart 2.1 poweramp

lightweight , powerful , reliable .
:cool:
Click to expand...

And I feel likewise about this set-up. Just because it goes loud doesn't mean I have to play loud. In the end, it's about what makes me happy...not what makes others happy. So there! :p Count me among those who wish that there were more stand-alone bass preamps available. I bought one so at least I'm doing my part in keeping the breed alive. :)

ImportedPhotos00248.jpg


M. M.
 
#102
Hi, I just landed here but this is a tree at which I've been barking for some time.
From a portability standpoint, a rack with a preamp and a power amp is not THAT less portable than a head.
Anyway,the main pro point I see in heaving separate pre is that, on the long run it is easier to create your setup over time. Lets look at my example: I can't really afford a proper head with proper power right now but I have an "almost nice" power-amp (200W bridged-mono) that I can connect to a cabinet.I spend 150€ in a low budget pre and I have more power per buck than with any head in that price range and some extras. If I need more power I can just spend 300€ and get like 1000W no problem because I have only to buy a power amp. If I want valve power I can get it without having to pay for the pre and when I can afford a Sansamp RBI or a tube pre I can buy it without caring about the power section.

My current setup (somewhat low budget) is a T-Amp power amp and a Behringer Bass V-Amp Pro. When I sell my Fender Rumble 100 1x15 I'll buy a 4x10

So I wish there were more pre-amps specially things like the Sansamp.
 
#106
BassmanPaul said:
How? You can only get 1800VA from a standard 15A wall socket. No amp can produce more power than its supply can provide.
Click to expand...

Not for a steady state signal. But since music isn't a steady state signal, if the amp can produce more for transients and short-burst demand, its still meets needs.
 
#107
I have been using a pre/power rig of one kind or another since the late sixties. I simply don't like the colouration built into most bass heads. There are many ways to go with pre-amps. Simple, like one of the ART TubeMP series, Mic pre-amp strips, from cheap to the unbelievably expensive, or the range of Bass specific pre-amps. Failing all those, you can always build your own if you have the knowledge to do so.

Paul
 
#111
BassmanPaul said:
For transients I agree Bongo, but without the steady power behind it it's meaningless.
Click to expand...

No, not meaningless. Misleading maybe, because it does give the idea that you could pump a constant 3KW sinewave all night long, but as greenboy points out, music is "just" a series of transients, and the power amp really can put out 3KW of transients.
 
#112
To bring this back on topic....

I'd be curious to know from the pre/power guys exactly what is missing from the current available line up of preamps? There seems to be a nice selection of tube and SS along with some fairly transapent and others that are coloured...

A Sansamp RBI is just over $300, Demeter HBP-1 for $850 and the Pope for $1500 with allot inbetween, what exactly am I missing?
 
#113
bongomania said:
No, not meaningless. Misleading maybe, because it does give the idea that you could pump a constant 3KW sinewave all night long, but as greenboy points out, music is "just" a series of transients, and the power amp really can put out 3KW of transients.
Click to expand...

Yes, because the real quantity of concern is average power (current) and under dynamic input like music, even if you're hitting clip the odd time, the average power produced and drawn by the amp is a fraction of its maximum power.

Along with the energy storage of the filter caps in the amp, the wall circuit will also allow transients far greater than the steady-state power they can provide.
 
#114
In fact even with very heavily compressed music the crest factor is still high enough that power amps with rated output way above "what the wall can deliver" continue to be in demand because they actually can meet needs. If they couldn't I'm sure at least a few people in MI and SR circles would notice by now ; }

Really for the most part amps are humming along producing an average of maybe 1/8 to 1/4 their rated output even when considered being fully used, but having the capability of reproducing peaks, transients, fuller dynamics on demand is not to be sniffed at. It also sidesteps early clipping when burst of higher SPL are demanded.
 
#115
I had a Yamaha PB1 back in the late 80's/early 90's, it was nice but when it got stolen in a bar in Austin I replaced it with the GK 800RB that I still use today. I liked the separate pre-amp because it was more flexible than a lot of integrated amps, but contemporary heads allow you to do a lot of things, like effects loops, parametric EQ's, and bi-amping that you couldn't do back then without separates.

I see the same thing happening in high-end audio, separates used to be the deal, and now they're few and far between.
 
#116
Jumping back to the OP, I personally wouldn't be surprised if we see even less preamps in the future. It seems to me that they are being squeezed from all sides.

1) Lots of folks are going lighter and smaller, trimming the number of customers who would want a component system. Neodymium speakers have helped this trend along alot.
2) Alot of the folks still going big have found that there are increasing numbers of good sounding (a'la b1500) high powered bass heads at affordable prices.
3) The coolness factor. There was a time when it was cool for bassists and guitarrists to have racks, now heads are "cool", and stand-alone tube amps seem to be more popular than they were a decade ago.
4) The guitar spillover. I have a theory that as guitarrists move away from rack effects/amps/pre's, music gear manufacturers adjust their bass offerings similarly.

There are exceptions of course, but it now seems that the only folks going for standalone pre's are those who need massive amounts of power and aren't satisfied with the head options out there and that's a smaller and smaller group of people.

My assumption is that there are enough pre's out there to meet this demand, but that the numbers may shrink in the near future.
 
#118
peterpalmieri said:
I'd be curious to know from the pre/power guys exactly what is missing from the current available line up of preamps? There seems to be a nice selection of tube and SS along with some fairly transapent and others that are coloured...
Click to expand...

One thing that is missing in 98% of bass heads and that you can only find in Channel strips type pres is a "Q" on the parametric section.
And two of these please.
I don't always want to cut 1/2 an octave , 1/10 usually enough...

That's why I love my 828mkIII, the EQ and comp are AMAZING.....

Also this guy is pretty good for the price , the EQ is "scalpel" like....
Invalid Link Removed

PS the Smartube thing is useless...
 
#119
As far as I know there aren't any bass specific (hi end) preamps with patches like the Marshall JMP1 for guitar. Yes you have the PSA1 and the Mesa one but they aren't bass specific (I might be wrong). Also there is a big gap in the low budget area, you have the Behringer RBI21 at 44€ and then the Hartke VLX at 130€ and these are pedals.

As for the portability, well if you can fit it into a pedal you can fit it in to a lightweight rack and with class D amps you can have pre+power (lots of it) in the usual 2U that most heads use.
 

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