Workshop Tools - the essentials???

[BassHappy]

I made my own bench too, probably cost me about $40 or so.

I took a whole bunch of 2"x4s", cut them to 7' length to fit my shop layout, and then used my drill press to punch out holes for threaded rods to fasten them (together like a raft). The resulting table surface is rock solid, heavy and stable.

I realized on my way to work, I was having a confusing moment. I really need two benches, a stripped down wood working bench more like 'glo's - for the downstairs wood shop. I also need a fully loaded bench upstairs, to do my set ups in. I would love it if my set-up bench had a couple of drawers for tools like the Harbor Freight one, but 60" is too long for a set-up bench. With my medium scalers the longest bass is 44"" stem to stern. Plus I have a 4' area near the stairs to put it in. So I think I will start planning the build of both benches. Not building anything though, until this barn deal goes through. Building the benches are right up my wood shop's alley - I just have to be careful, they are furniture builders so they will want to talk me into hyper-deluxe and hence expensive.

I also have some nice thin protective foam and some VERY expensive European cotton velvet leftover from my display cabinet to cover the set-up bench surface.

Good point, 'glo about the dust. I am also lobbying for what I am calling a couple of "walk-in" closets, one for storage and one for the wood shop. We will see. Would help a lot with dust.

 

[PDX Rich]

Building a solid bench is a good way to get acquainted with your new tools. You do not need to build a fancy woodworking bench! Just a solid flat-surfaced bench will do the trick. I'll add that you will want to make the top removable, as you will probably desire some modifications down the road. I initially had a chipboard top, but I replaced it last year with MDF and hardboard and it is fantastic for my needs. It would be cool to design something with an end vise and leg vise as well as some bench dogs at some point, but I am happy with the simplicity now. Just make sure you allow enough space around the perimeter for clamps!

 

[Ross W. Lovell]

Hey Ross

It's being refurbished now - they just finished the sheathing on the outside but still have to do the roof. They sprayed insulation everywhere and used 1.5" thick insulated board on everything inside. It's electric but I am negotiating for a wood stove upstairs as well. Electric heat sucks, but this baby is airtight with lots of insulation and a Tyvek wrap. I am hoping that the electric heat bill doesn't kill me. I think I posted a photo of it previously, but here it is again:

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This would be the area for the shop downstairs:

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It's like 40' X 24' approximately, I would use some areas for storage.

My office and jamming area would be upstairs, the hardwood floors are in and the bathroom is complete:

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Nice space, but I'd be surprised if the wood stove would be wanted for a whole host of reasons. Agree with the electric issue though a tight building might be workable. Pellet stove a different animal but personally partial to small oil fired boilers and baseboard heat. Insurance issues regarding proper chimney and the tightness of structure might be the reason for not allowing. Went this route myself, lot of work and hard to utilize with a variable schedule, when you have to wait for space to warm up.

Might want to investigate a motor home/trailer sales place fo see if they have any LP heater takeouts from older units that have been scrapped. Usually can be had for minimal monies. They are forced air units not baseboard but they can be handy.

My workshop is mostly for my shop which consists of two floor routers, also known as Bridgeports, my lathe, a couple of bandsaws, horizontal and vertical, a surface grinder and my Miller TIG 300, along with my sport cars and a few motorcycles, that all live reasonably harmonious in a single story 30' X 50' building.

I mention, not brag, mind you as humidity is a big deal to me. Heat usually set for 10 degrees higher than outside temperature except in summer, otherwise, turning it on every time the shop was entered would produce a sheen of condensation upon anything within making my life miserable.

You might want to think about a whole house fan upstairs, $$$ pays for quietness in air moving. Plus you'll drop 10 degrees off your ambient temp. and guessing a/c isn't on the list or budget yet.

 

[BassHappy]

Nice space, but I'd be surprised if the wood stove would be wanted for a whole host of reasons. Agree with the electric issue though a tight building might be workable. Pellet stove a different animal but personally partial to small oil fired boilers and baseboard heat. Insurance issues regarding proper chimney and the tightness of structure might be the reason for not allowing. Went this route myself, lot of work and hard to utilize with a variable schedule, when you have to wait for space to warm up.

Might want to investigate a motor home/trailer sales place fo see if they have any LP heater takeouts from older units that have been scrapped. Usually can be had for minimal monies. They are forced air units not baseboard but they can be handy.

My workshop is mostly for my shop which consists of two floor routers, also known as Bridgeports, my lathe, a couple of bandsaws, horizontal and vertical, a surface grinder and my Miller TIG 300, along with my sport cars and a few motorcycles, that all live reasonably harmonious in a single story 30' X 50' building.

I mention, not brag, mind you as humidity is a big deal to me. Heat usually set for 10 degrees higher than outside temperature except in summer, otherwise, turning it on every time the shop was entered would produce a sheen of condensation upon anything within making my life miserable.

You might want to think about a whole house fan upstairs, $$$ pays for quietness in air moving. Plus you'll drop 10 degrees off your ambient temp. and guessing a/c isn't on the list or budget yet.

Hey Ross

Your shop sounds interesting to say the least. Got any pics handy to share?

Thanks for the comments, all good points. The electric heat is there - it's just a matter of how it is on the wallet. This place is definitely well-insulated, but who knows what that means in the end? There will be a landlord-provided air conditioning unit upstairs, downstairs will likely be up to me. Fan is a good idea. I spent a lot of money on my office 18 years ago and like a fool - all the money I spent stays with the building and the landlord when I leave. Lesson learned - not doing that again. Ever.

I will make a proposal once the building is ready for the walk through - and the owner will accept it reject it as he sees fit. After all, it's a 7 year lease, and while we haven't locked into the monthly - at $1000 per month X 7 years is $84K. Certainly nothing for him to sneeze at.

Hard to see but here is the building as of this morning - with the outside done, the end windows painted - but the roof not yet replaced:

 

[Ross W. Lovell]

Hey Ross

Your shop sounds interesting to say the least. Got any pics handy to share?

Thanks for the comments, all good points. The electric heat is there - it's just a matter of how it is on the wallet. This place is definitely well-insulated, but who knows what that means in the end? There will be a landlord-provided air conditioning unit upstairs, downstairs will likely be up to me. Fan is a good idea. I spent a lot of money on my office 18 years ago and like a fool - all the money I spent stays with the building and the landlord when I leave. Lesson learned - not doing that again. Ever.

I will make a proposal once the building is ready for the walk through - and the owner will accept it reject it as he sees fit. After all, it's a 7 year lease, and while we haven't locked into the monthly - at $1000 per month X 7 years is $84K. Certainly nothing for him to sneeze at.

Hard to see but here is the building as of this morning - with the outside done, the end windows painted - but the roof not yet replaced:

Eventually, ..............it's a sty currently, one too many cars and a couple of bikes exploded for winter rebuilding that never finished. Need to do spring cleaning this is New England and my lawn takes two nights after work to complete. Bridgeports have flat shelf like spaces.........need I say more?
Twenty years ago the shed roof had rolled roofing with an 18" reveal. Leaked as it was at least thirty years old. Eighteen, 5-gallon buckets of roof coating squeegee on like driveway sealer solved the probes for almost seven years until I replaced the roof with corrugated metal and 2000 or so screws and rubber washers holding it down. Noise is an issue only when raining.
Bought my house because of the shop. Mother in law was less than enthused as she explained that I'd be better off buying more house. She was duly informed that if she was paying "the nut" her opinion would have status and value, but since she wasn't volunteering, her opinion was worth exactly what I paid got it. She shut up, fo a while.
You are renting this right?

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[Ross W. Lovell]

Hey Ross

Your shop sounds interesting to say the least. Got any pics handy to share?

Thanks for the comments, all good points. The electric heat is there - it's just a matter of how it is on the wallet. This place is definitely well-insulated, but who knows what that means in the end? There will be a landlord-provided air conditioning unit upstairs, downstairs will likely be up to me. Fan is a good idea. I spent a lot of money on my office 18 years ago and like a fool - all the money I spent stays with the building and the landlord when I leave. Lesson learned - not doing that again. Ever.

I will make a proposal once the building is ready for the walk through - and the owner will accept it reject it as he sees fit. After all, it's a 7 year lease, and while we haven't locked into the monthly - at $1000 per month X 7 years is $84K. Certainly nothing for him to sneeze at.

Hard to see but here is the building as of this morning - with the outside done, the end windows painted - but the roof not yet replaced:

View attachment 865313

Lighting is also a big cost as they are needed in multiples. Can't run high bays and 8' RDC fluorescents aren't inexpensive anymore. For me a bigger cost as they need to have good coverage via multiple fixtures and they stay on a lot.
LED's are great but mega costly right now and there are not a lot of different configurations, making the application poor. Currently I use 14, 8' double tube fixtures on auto transforming ballasts, meaning I run at 208V using less amperage, meaning less cost. Just relamped the plant 100,000 sq. ft., no eight foot LEDs available when they did it last year. PITA. Four foot two strip fixture about $350 each with reflectors.

 

[Lonnybass]

Lighting is also a big cost as they are needed in multiples. Can't run high bays and 8' RDC fluorescents aren't inexpensive anymore. For me a bigger cost as they need to have good coverage via multiple fixtures and they stay on a lot.
LED's are great but mega costly right now and there are not a lot of different configurations, making the application poor. Currently I use 14, 8' double tube fixtures on auto transforming ballasts, meaning I run at 208V using less amperage, meaning less cost. Just relamped the plant 100,000 sq. ft., no eight foot LEDs available when they did it last year. PITA. Four foot two strip fixture about $350 each with reflectors.

Another interesting point about lighting - I went the fluorescent route in my shop...great for lighting up broad spaces but tends to make everything look very flat and cold, and tough to spot any detail work or surface imperfections. I added an adjustable table lamp with a warm white (non fluorescent) bulb that I can point at whatever I'm working on, and get much better shadowing and clarity as a result.

 

[BassHappy]

Hi Ross,

Yep - renting. And I think of a lot of the things you are mentioning are for the commercial builders. At this point, I am nothing more than a hobby builder building basses for myself. Unless something miraculous happens with my prototypes it's just me building some new stuff and re-purposing some of the instruments I have, maybe 4 a year if I am lucky with my time restraints. Remember, I run a full time business and have two album projects going right now in my studio.

SO, IT'S TIME TO TEAR THE NEWBIE UP~

Yes, time to embarrass me, call me a fool, wave your hands in the air, roll your eyes - while you are explaining to me in no uncertain terms exactly how wrong I am on every level. I am ready for it.

I put together a list of items that I feel I would need to make the shop the way I would be comfortable working. However, before examining it - please note the following:

• Trying to keep the budget around $1500. for what I consider to be the basics. Not a used equipment guy. Sorry, not sophisticated enough or skilled enough to rebuild or maintain problem machinery. Don't want the distraction. My shop guys will stop by when needed to help out with problems after the warranty runs out. Not interested in Craigslist bargains. I love warranties and since today's machinery is so inexpensive, I will go the new route. It's like that $300 laser printer. You use it for a few years until it dies, then go buy a new one for $250 because the price goes down every year. If you have to hire someone to fix that printer the service call with parts will be more than the $250 for the new one. Actually I am seeing nice laser printers now for $150. Of course, it's not apples to apples but my point is - it doesn't always pay to have things fixed. There is not a piece of equipment on here that goes for more than $375.

• If there is some thickness planing or jointer work that I have to do I will run to the other shop. A router and sled seems like a good way to go, but I can stop by their shop - and use their jointer and thickness planer, and get it done in just a few minutes when I need to. Plus, hopefully they will be happy to see me.

• What I have here is what I am familiar with - what we have used so far in the building of my prototypes and machinery and equipment that I am trained on. I do realize that this is starter stuff - I am just a guy getting addicted to process who wants to tinker. While I have some drill bits and other accessories, I know there are a tons of other items I will need to add, hopefully as I go. Especially hand tools, and I do have a nice 2" Orbital sander but it works on air, so eventually I will need a compressor. And also remember, this stuff will all get light duty as far as usage goes.

So, please comment - especially if you see something crazy and out of line. Remember I am the rookie in the locker room trying to find his way around. I also realize that tools and machinery - just like bass guitars - are subjective, and everyone understandably has their own favorites, based on their views and their experiences. I am also looking for a special grinder that they used at the shop - but I have been unable to locate the grinding attachment. I will ask them about it when I see them on saturday - it was a great sculpting tool when we were shaping the odd and highly carved bodies.

 

[T_Bone_TL]

By way of an update, my neighbor does have a Shop Smith in his attic, but he says he doesn't have the full set - and he didn't mention if it is the Mark V or 7.

If the barn deal goes through, I am leaning towards picking up used - a band saw, and a drill press

I will now repeat S L O W L Y : Drill press is one of the jobs that the ShopSmith is actually Quite Good At. Especially if it's "more or less free" (or on loan as long as you need it) which is what I understood you to say. If it's not borked, you don't need to buy a drill press. Leave it set that way, and/or lay it down when horizontal boring makes sense, don't worry about anything else it does.

 

[Lonnybass]

My friend -

A few suggestions for you as you tool up - might be worth checking out owners manuals and online parts availability in advance for anything you aren't buying locally, or for any less accessible brands.

For example, I've never heard of "Central Machinery" brand bandsaws before - not to devalue it at all - and I'm not sure where it's made (inevitably China?), so you'll want to make sure that you'll be able to identify and source replacement components from a reliable parts distributor here in the States, otherwise you may run into trouble down the line.

The major only non-name brand item in my shop now is a Wilton brand planer that I got for $99 during a Christmastime blowout sale at Rockler. Amazingly, it lasted 8 years until last month when a bevel gear broke in half, rendering it unusable without a fix. A little Googling revealed that it was made in the same factory as Grizzly products, and so I was able to track down the right schematics and identify the exact replacement part for less than $20, including shipping, to get the thing running again. Without that, I would have been screwed!

You also might want to do some checking at your local Lowe's and Home Depots...they have tons of floor models in the tool section that just sit there, and you could probably negotiate some good deals in the right situation. My bandsaw, drill press and a few other big tools were the result of this strategy. The Lowe's guy was willing to take like 40 percent off the drill press because they didn't have a chuck key for the thing! Awwwww shucks, I guess the thing will never work the way it's supposed to.

Plus, Memorial Day is coming up and you may find a few sales as well.

Lonnybass

 

[earlysecond]

Getting tooled up is cool. I can only comment that while you are at HD consider, instead of buying a couple of different bench sanders you can go all in 1 with the rigid oscillating spindle/belt combo. It is priced at $200 and may or may not be a good option for you. The 24" belt oscillates as well which is a nice feature. The only real limitation is the size of the belt.

BTW- I have spent a lot of time on a lot of other forums and this little corner of TB is a pretty safe place. Go get you tools and get set up and we can ask dumb rookie questions at the same time. Really everybody here has been so cool and helpful. That is one of the reasons I post too much and built to little (at least this week). Well, even that is my fault. I have a router jig set up kicking my butt. HEY, maybe that is why I am hating routers?? HAHA

Good luck. Others will be most helpful. One thing I was told by a couple of people. Older, gently used tools from CL and local web listings can be a great score and can also be of better quality than what we can buy off the shelf, especially at a box store.

Brent

 

[PDX Rich]

Yup! the Rigid Oscillating Spindle Sander (ROSS)/belt combo is an excellent tool. Many of us here own them. Sure, it is nice to have a huge disk sander and belt sander, but the ROSS is excellent and it is easy to find different grit 4" belts on Amazon for cheap. For the higher priced items, keep your eyes peeled for deals on Craigslist. Many folks "tool up" and find that they no longer have the time nor energy to keep their horde of lightly-used machines. The key here is to be patient! I am still waiting for a drum sander to become available at a price that I can work with.

By all means, buy all the tools your budget will allow, but you can find better tools at the prices you want, by being patient.

 

[T_Bone_TL]

I personally found that LED lighting was quite affordable, especially with the power company subsidizing certain fixtures. Not having to wait 5-15 minutes for the light to stabilize when it's cold is a big plus.

With the advent of efficient (High COP) low-temperature (work Below Zero F outside) air-air heat pumps, they make a LOT of sense if you run the numbers - even here, where electricity is expensive and electric resistance heat is crazy expensive. Having A/C on tap is a (usually small, but the weather is getting nuttier) bonus. Not having a flame in the building is a BIG plus, fire-risk-wise.

 

[earlysecond]

LED's everything, all the time. . .even my gimmicky guitars! LOL I bought 4' LED's at Sams. I think they were $27 on sale I own 4 and may buy more. I am in search of a good LED fixture for my bandsaw. I am old and my eyes are going bad!

 

[mapleglo]

...
For example, I've never heard of "Central Machinery" brand bandsaws before...

That's the Harbor Freight brand. I have no experience with their bandsaws.

Regarding the oscillating spindle sander, I'd suggest the Ridgid model, available at Home Depot for under $200.00:

A bigger surface on which to rest the work piece, and includes a belt sander. Very useful.

 

[Ross W. Lovell]

I personally found that LED lighting was quite affordable, especially with the power company subsidizing certain fixtures. Not having to wait 5-15 minutes for the light to stabilize when it's cold is a big plus.

With the advent of efficient (High COP) low-temperature (work Below Zero F outside) air-air heat pumps, they make a LOT of sense if you run the numbers - even here, where electricity is expensive and electric resistance heat is crazy expensive. Having A/C on tap is a (usually small, but the weather is getting nuttier) bonus. Not having a flame in the building is a BIG plus, fire-risk-wise.

Have to ask how tall your ceilings, what's the prevailing color of walls and ceiling and what did you use?
The facility I'm at had the subsidized lighting. Once approved their contractor comes in, does a lighting lumens survey based on type of light needed for each manufacturing situation, we had many and then designs package around your needs. My conversations with the "designer" yielded a lack of certain configurations.
Usually retro lighting with new illumination means mimicking the previous format but different bulb types. Have yet to see a replacement for an 8' fixture, at least when this took place almost a year ago. This presented problems as the original finished product threw shadows because lighting did not have the same overlap and believe it or not the electric company's designer is to provide same light levels with fewer fixtures.
Luckily the lumens levels were inconsistent with the prior one, and had to be remedied. Example: the four foot units had 4 strips, 4' long in the fixture. An 8' unit would have had the same linear footage of LED's with only two rows, I know, I gabbed one up just to prove it, and was met with a dumb stare.
Meanwhile what state are you in? Seems like 4 instruments a year is not a good trade off for $12K a year.
I'm able to deal with older tools and prefer for far too many reasons than can be explained in a reasonable time frame. The high cost of inexpensive tools doesn't usually help a business plan, and usually fail at the most inopportune time plus some failure modes are dangerous to the operator.
A Walker-Turner drill press with $10.00 worth of bearings and. $5.00 drive belt will last you for 20 years and cost about $100.00 used and be better made. The import stuff usually suffers from plastic parts and thin castings, failure of either means the equipment is scrap. For me, wight is an issue for vibration. Harder to tuning fork a tool if you set up a bad harmonic.
I'm a Parts-Caster guy. Wrong guy to ask about woodworking. I do it and more than well but I think you woodworking guys need to raise the bar. I work in metal, usually a wide tolerance spec for me is +/-.005, having woodworking tools that are designed in +\- 1/32 is laughable, in my opinion, in this day and age. The other woodworking done here is coach building the wood sub structures of cars from before the 40's, when wood was wrapped with steel for the body panels. Symmetry wasn't very important back then, which depending on the car's historical importance usually gets corrected on AutoCad. On the other hand some of the new tools, while plastic have great tolerance control compared to years ago. DRO's/digital read outs have been put on some of my wood tools.
My shop suffered this year as the lack of snow kept me from closing it up like normal and then when snow arrived, things were pitched in wildly-nilly with no regard for working within. The "purge" has already started and will be finished by June.
First is a long shot, doing lawn today other two are contents, my '34 SS1 SWB Tourer down to frame and the end-table Bridgeports, or at least that appears to be their function currently, the rest, too embarrassed to show.

 

[Hopkins]

I know you said you don't want to go used, but you can get a used Delta 14 inch band saw for about the price of that Harbor Freight job and you will have a much better saw. In my opinion you are throwing your money away with that HF job.

I second the recommendation for the Rigid belt/spindle sander.

That drill press is likely fine

Bosch tools are great, but as far as routers go, as far as I am concerned Porter Cable is the gold standard and will save you some money over the Bosch.

I would skip the table saw for now, and hold out for a larger saw with a bigger table. Those small ones are basically useless for cutting anything larger than a 2x4 and totally useless for sheet good.

 

[earlysecond]

Kinda glad my HF table saw was unusable. I ended up with a Porter Cable on a stand that folds away under the workbench and even before I get all of my big tools. . . space is tight but I just cannot pass them up at the prices I'm getting them for. Unless I destroy them none will be a waste of money.

 

[BassHappy]

Thanks everyone for all the responses, much appreciated! I have to chuckle a little at how much machinery and the emotional bonds are so much like the bonds we have with Fender vs. Squire vs. Rickenbacker vs. Spector ad infinitum. It's quite a hoot.

T Bone

No need to say anything S L O W L Y - I might be a tiny bit OCD in some ways, but I can read and write just fine. I hear ya, but my neighbor has been doing everything he can to talk me out of the Shopsmith. I don't think he wants to deal with dragging it out of the attic and moving it and setting it up - I think it's mostly because it is incomplete. I also think it's because it reminds him of his past and some bad memories that are attached to it. So I am no longer counting on that. Subject to change, but that is where we are right now.

I have no idea at this point what lighting is even in the building, they are still tending to those details. The lawyer who owns the building is obviously waiting for the big "walk-through" and doesn't want to firm things up until the building looks amazing. I hadn't thought about it much, but you are right - no flame in the building is the way to go. Thanks to you and anyone else who mentioned that. I am hoping that the electric bill is reasonable, but we will see.

LonnyBass

Funny to me that you picked on the Harbor Freight item. I have been hearing a lot of mixed reviews about their stuff as well. I had the Craftsman 14 incher as my second choice. Sears is close by and free delivery:

the Memorial Day sale thing is a great idea, thanks for that.

early second

I have no idea what anyone else's experience is - but I found it a bit of a pain even swapping out the spindles on the spindle sander when we needed to. It interrupts the flow. Of course, it is a necessary evil. At our shop the disc sander, the belt sander and the spindle sander are cocked and ready to go at any point at the flip of a switch. Like everything in my life, building is an exercise in rhythm and the less I need to interrupt that flow with menial tasks - the better off I am. It keeps the creative juices flowing.

I couldn't agree more about the folks on Luthier's Corner and actually TB in general. I love this place. Occasionally you run into some major personality flaws, and the ugly banter that sometimes accompanies it - but that is what makes the world go round. What a boring place if everyone felt, thought and experienced the same. It would be like everyone playing Fender basses. Oh, that is right, everyone DOES play Fender basses. I almost forgot. I don't think anyone looks at a bass though and goes - "WOW you cut that out on a Delta band saw, didn't you? Man that smokes the Central Machinery saw. I thought so, I could tell by that contour....." Let's all face it, like our basses - we are attached to brand names when it comes to our tools and equipment.

PDX Rich

Thanks for the feedback. Geeeeeez, if it was up to me I would probably have half a dozen spindle, disk and belt sanders all set up with different grits loaded and ready to go! Those sanders are dirt cheap. Why interrupt the creative flow by swapping things around if you don't have to? Just me and the way I like to work.

Hey 'glo

Maybe I will add one of those sanders too, as mentioned - as far as I am concerned the more the merrier!

Hey Ross

I have to smile a bit when I read your post. First of all, the building isn't even finished yet, so I have no idea what the answers are to most of the questions you are asking. It's not my building. I don't own it. If all works out I hope to rent. And since you asked, I am in the State of Confusion - of course - that would have to be New York. Yes, absolutely the State of Confusion. Of course, we have a very nice and well regarded Monastary a couple of miles away - with the largest statue of Bhudda in the Western Hemisphere - so maybe it's the "State of Confucious" but for my nickel, State of Confusion works just fine.

Should it come to fruition - this building will serve several purposes for me. This guitar building thing is actually an afterthought. My office will be upstairs and bass building is my part time passionate hobby. But I do need a place for Bernadine:

Also will use the building for some storage - so I will need to clean out and vacate the storage units I currently have.

In the end, it will be very cost effective for me. In the office area upstairs, I will also have my Eden Metro ready to go along with an alternating 5 or 6 of my favorite basses. I will also have my set-up bench along with the appropriate tools, which I already have. I will put our small PA over there along with a few keyboards and a drum set and we can sponsor some fun jam sessions with some friends.

I saw your car - or the car you are working on - would love to see a better pic....

Hopkins

As always, great suggestions - not going off without considering the things that make me happy. I wanted feedback and that is what you all provided. I will take everything under advisement and continue my exhaustive research. But the input is absolutely appreciated.

Thanks so much.

 

[Ross W. Lovell]

Thanks everyone for all the responses, much appreciated! I have to chuckle a little at how much machinery and the emotional bonds are so much like the bonds we have with Fender vs. Squire vs. Rickenbacker vs. Spector ad infinitum. It's quite a hoot.

T Bone

No need to say anything S L O W L Y - I might be a tiny bit OCD in some ways, but I can read and write just fine. I hear ya, but my neighbor has been doing everything he can to talk me out of the Shopsmith. I don't think he wants to deal with dragging it out of the attic and moving it and setting it up - I think it's mostly because it is incomplete. I also think it's because it reminds him of his past and some bad memories that are attached to it. So I am no longer counting on that. Subject to change, but that is where we are right now.

I have no idea at this point what lighting is even in the building, they are still tending to those details. The lawyer who owns the building is obviously waiting for the big "walk-through" and doesn't want to firm things up until the building looks amazing. I hadn't thought about it much, but you are right - no flame in the building is the way to go. Thanks to you and anyone else who mentioned that. I am hoping that the electric bill is reasonable, but we will see.

LonnyBass

Funny to me that you picked on the Harbor Freight item. I have been hearing a lot of mixed reviews about their stuff as well. I had the Craftsman 14 incher as my second choice. Sears is close by and free delivery:

View attachment 865465

the Memorial Day sale thing is a great idea, thanks for that.

early second

I have no idea what anyone else's experience is - but I found it a bit of a pain even swapping out the spindles on the spindle sander when we needed to. It interrupts the flow. Of course, it is a necessary evil. At our shop the disc sander, the belt sander and the spindle sander are cocked and ready to go at any point at the flip of a switch. Like everything in my life, building is an exercise in rhythm and the less I need to interrupt that flow with menial tasks - the better off I am. It keeps the creative juices flowing.

I couldn't agree more about the folks on Luthier's Corner and actually TB in general. I love this place. Occasionally you run into some major personality flaws, and the ugly banter that sometimes accompanies it - but that is what makes the world go round. What a boring place if everyone felt, thought and experienced the same. It would be like everyone playing Fender basses. Oh, that is right, everyone DOES play Fender basses. I almost forgot. I don't think anyone looks at a bass though and goes - WOW you cut that out on Delta band saw, didn't you? Man that smokes the Central Machinery saw. I thought so, I could tell by that contour..... Let's all face it, like our basses - we are attached to brand names when it comes to our tools and equipment.

PDX Rich

Thanks for the feedback. Geeeeeez, if it was up to me I would probably have half a dozen spindle, disk and belt sanders all set up with different grits loaded and ready to go! Those sanders are dirt cheap. Why interrupt the creative flow by swapping things around if you don't have to? Just me and the way I like to work.

Hey 'glo

Maybe I will add one of those sanders too, as mentioned - as far as I am concerned the more the merrier!

Hey Ross

I have to smile a bit when I read your post. First of all, the building isn't even finished yet, so I have no idea what the answers are to most of the questions you are asking. It's not my building. I don't own it. If all works out I hope to rent. And since you asked, I am in the State of Confusion - of course - that would have to be New York. Yes, absolutely the State of Confusion. Of course, we have a very nice and well regarded Monastary a couple of miles away - with the largest statue of Bhudda in the Western Hemisphere - so maybe it's the "State of Confucious" but for my nickel, state of confusion works just fine.

Should it come to fruition - this building will serve several purposes for me. This guitar building thing is actually an afterthought. My office will be upstairs and bass building is a part time kind of passionate hobby/afterthought. But I do need a place for Bernadine:

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Also will use the building for some storage and clean out the storage units I currently have.

In the end, it will be very cost effective for me. In the office area upstairs, I will also have my Eden Metro cocked and ready along with an alternating 5 or 6 of my favorite basses. I will put our PA over there along with a few keyboards and a drum set and we can sponsor some fun jam sessions with some friends.

I saw your car - would love to see a better pic....

Hopkins

As always, great suggestions - not going off half-cocked, I wanted feedback and that is what you all provided. I will take everything under advisement and continue my exhaustive research.

Thanks so much.

No offense meant honestly.

Just figured if you had a lease agreement going together, easier to ask about these things BEFORE they get put in and he says...."wish I had known before we installed those". Lease being 7 years if accepted is 7 years worth of savings on any of it. The insulation, will go a long way, windows are a big heat loss.

Looked at relocating a few years back to the Watkins Glen area but the taxes for me seem worse than Connecticut and the ratio of taxes versus services is skewed more toward taxes. So we passed, BUT we have no family there just ties to the old track.

State of Confusion......Good One! Actually, I always refer to Connecticut and being New York State's Beta test site for liberal policies. According to Freedom Of Information records, Connecticut politicians are funded more by New Yorkers than native Connecticut people. Greetings from the Socialist State Of Connecticut.

Again, meant no offense, just thought having the 7 year lease might be able to leverage and address these details BEFORE the work has been completed.