Crossdressing and bandmates.

[Gravedigger Dav]

Therein lies the rub... which is which?

depends on who you ask.

 

[Marial]

depends on who you ask.

Exactly my point.

 

[Gravedigger Dav]

Exactly my point.

Which goes back to my original point that this argument has been going on since civilization began. It will be over when civilization ends; unfortunately, with no resolution.

 

[Marial]

Most likely. I'm of the mind that progress is being made, however. More inclusion, more tolerance, more equality... these are goods things, if you ask me.

 

[-Asdfgh-]

He is expressing traditional social norms. You are denying they exist.
Social norms change slowly over time. There is always a lot of acrimony in the transition. Look back through history at how women were seen 100 years ago, or race relations 100 years ago.
I will not use the term "progressive", because the loosening of some social norms are detrimental to society and others are beneficial.
You are hung up in a argument as old as civilization.

Moving away from detrimental norms to more beneficial seems like progress

 

[Gravedigger Dav]

Moving away from detrimental norms to more beneficial seems like progress

I agree, but it is half of what I said. The other half, moving away from beneficial norms is regressive.
And, if you haven't read nor understood my previous posts on this, which are detrimental and which are beneficial is an age old argument that will never be solved. Everyone has an opinion.

 

[Ubersheist]

Depends on the project. A lot of bands are about only one person's personal expression. And some bands have dress codes and conduct codes. Mine does, for example. We all wear the same thing and none of us drink during our gigs (some of us don't drink hardly at all). If that's what you're looking for, that's cool, but it will exclude you from certain bands, but not because they're necessarily anti-LGBT, just that's how they operate.

Of course, that's different. Like, if you're all in black and white tuxes, except for one dude in a dress, or if there's a distinct costume/theme. However, if that's not the case...

 

[bluesblaster]

If you have the "Nads" to wear a dress on stage , go for it. I hope that people understand that the stage is a place for entertainment, your not trying to corrupt anyone's moral values or advocate anything.

 

[-Asdfgh-]

I agree, but it is half of what I said. The other half, moving away from beneficial norms is regressive.
And, if you haven't read nor understood my previous posts on this, which are detrimental and which are beneficial is an age old argument that will never be solved. Everyone has an opinion.

Some people have more than one!

 

[-Asdfgh-]

If you have the "Nads" to wear a dress on stage , go for it. I hope that people understand that the stage is a place for entertainment, your not trying to corrupt anyone's moral values or advocate anything.

As long as the dress covers said 'nads'

 

[bluesblaster]

agreed, one needs to exercise some bit of modesty

 

[TBird1958]

Modesty is overrated.
Honestly, I'd be way more nervous showing as my male alter ego than being dressed up.

 

[bluesblaster]

thats a tastetful outfit, dangerous but not slutty, dont know how you walk in heels though.

 

[TBird1958]

It's a bigger heel, no stilletos! Those are for other activities, not being on stage

 

[JimmyM]

Modesty is overrated.
Honestly, I'd be way more nervous showing as my male alter ego than being dressed up.

Well hey, if I had those legs...

 

[TBird1958]

Well hey, if I had those legs...

If your work ever brings you to Seattle - I'm so buying you a beer or beverage of your choice.

 

[JimmyM]

Well we'll talk when it gets closer to May.

 

[One Drop]

He is expressing traditional social norms. You are denying they exist.
Social norms change slowly over time. There is always a lot of acrimony in the transition. Look back through history at how women were seen 100 years ago, or race relations 100 years ago.
I will not use the term "progressive", because the loosening of some social norms are detrimental to society and others are beneficial.
You are hung up in a argument as old as civilization.

That I understand and of course accept, there are plenty of things I'm not used to and I often find myself thinking 'our way was better' or some such.

My comment was directed at the way he was acting in the thread, trying to start an argument by baiting rather than engaging it.

And where one might consider the norms to be ´loosening', others may not, and see it simply as change.

The norms you describe are particular to a few times and places, in fact.

And I fully agree that not all change is progressive, and that the term is wrong. I never actually liked that term but is the best understood current term for the loose grouping of positions involving increased acceptance of differences, and a particular view of society and social change.

 

[GwenOnBass]

In the spotlight on stage.

 

[One Drop]

Which goes back to my original point that this argument has been going on since civilization began. It will be over when civilization ends; unfortunately, with no resolution.

The answer to me is that being aware of that and that knowing that standards and mores are always changing probably means that they do so for a reason, and sometimes those original reasons for forbidding or encouraging certain behaviour disappear and all that is left is the interdiction, for example.