Dingwall Owners Club

[SnoozeButtonBen]

Not to make an assumption John but I'm guessing he meant between the NG series and AB series and he assumed with the price difference there would be more tonal options.

To the OP asking the 4 settings that are standard are well thought out and all awesome. I personally decided to do a 6 way with my incoming Z3 simply to add the middle only option and also thought while I was doing it I would get rid of the bridge only and maximize my options. Also since John Fox was awesome about paying shipping one way it only cost me shipping one more way to get it done.

So if you're thinking about it and the bass is already shipped I would see what you think of the tones stock because while Mo's work is impeccable and extremely reasonable shipping with insurance on 5k will probably cost you 300 round trip depending on how far from CA you are.

I actually meant a difference between the NG-2 and NG-3...for the finish I'm looking at the difference is nearly 300 euros, and I actually lose the use of the middle pickup by itself in the bargain.

Unfortunately since I live in the EU, shipping it to any of the popular modders is not really an option, and the bass itself is already built so.i can't special-order a mod, so it would have to be a DIY job (though I have a local bass tech I trust). Could somebody link to the six way switch in question?

 

[ThisYouCanTrust]

With your new six-way plus the series/parallel switches, you will have 24 distinct tones available in passive mode, and then even way more when you turn on the preamp and use the tone controls. It'll practically feel infinite I bet!

At some point it just becomes too much I guess.

Oh, and bridge solo is what I ended up playing the most

 

[xnewyorka]

I actually meant a difference between the NG-2 and NG-3...for the finish I'm looking at the difference is nearly 300 euros, and I actually lose the use of the middle pickup by itself in the bargain.

Unfortunately since I live in the EU, shipping it to any of the popular modders is not really an option, and the bass itself is already built so.i can't special-order a mod, so it would have to be a DIY job (though I have a local bass tech I trust). Could somebody link to the six way switch in question?

I believe the switch is Item # 3516: Rotary Switches | stewmac.com
Somebody else who has done the mod can probably confirm that or correct me.
Maurilio Mina ("Mo") from Mo's Shop (and he also works at Nordstrand Audio) in California is the one who has done most or all of these mods so far, so he is very familiar with the process. Maybe if you contact him, he could give instructions to your luthier for how to do it. Since he has done all of the design work, I think it would be fair to pay him some reasonable amount of money to get his design documentation so you don't have to try and figure it out yourself. It would save you a lot of time and trouble.
Mo is pictured here, on the right:
Carey Nordstrand and Maurilio Mina
His contact info is here:
Contact

 

[xnewyorka]

At some point it just becomes too much I guess.

Oh, and bridge solo is what I ended up playing the most

I'm with you, but I think you and I are definitely in the minority.
The Z3 at the start of this video was recorded with the bridge pickup solo, and that was a tone that I liked and used probably the most on that bass:


It's natural to be drawn to the bridge-middle series position because it's louder than all the others, and psychologically, louder always sounds better to most people. But if you equalize the levels across all the positions, some of the other positions can be very tasty. Interesting that some of the heavy aggressive tone guys swear by middle-solo, some swear by neck-solo, and some almost always use bridge-neck parallel. And of course, many swear by the all-on position as well, for those with the D-Roc switch. Proof positive that there is no right and wrong. They are all just different flavors of good.
What I will be really curious about is: (a) how long it takes @Ryno1330 to explore all 24 positions and decide which ones he likes best; (b) how many positions end up making his "Favorites" list; and (c) whether he can find any 'bad' or 'unusable' settings out of the 24 positions, and if so, which ones those are.
So Jay, be sure and keep us updated after you complete that homework assignment!

 

[IvanBassist]

I'm with you, but I think you and I are definitely in the minority.
The Z3 at the start of this video was recorded with the bridge pickup solo, and that was a tone that I liked and used probably the most on that bass:


It's natural to be drawn to the bridge-middle series position because it's louder than all the others, and psychologically, louder always sounds better to most people. But if you equalize the levels across all the positions, some of the other positions can be very tasty. Interesting that some of the heavy aggressive tone guys swear by middle-solo, some swear by neck-solo, and some almost always use bridge-neck parallel. And of course, many swear by the all-on position as well, for those with the D-Roc switch. Proof positive that there is no right and wrong. They are all just different flavors of good.
What I will be really curious about is: (a) how long it takes @Ryno1330 to explore all 24 positions and decide which ones he likes best; (b) how many positions end up making his "Favorites" list; and (c) whether he can find any 'bad' or 'unusable' settings out of the 24 positions, and if so, which ones those are.
So Jay, be sure and keep us updated after you complete that homework assignment!

The bridge tone of the Z3 sounds incredibly FAT! Love it

 

[packrat]

I actually meant a difference between the NG-2 and NG-3...for the finish I'm looking at the difference is nearly 300 euros, and I actually lose the use of the middle pickup by itself in the bargain.

Unfortunately since I live in the EU, shipping it to any of the popular modders is not really an option, and the bass itself is already built so.i can't special-order a mod, so it would have to be a DIY job (though I have a local bass tech I trust). Could somebody link to the six way switch in question?

Here's a relatively neater version. I believe at least person here has built this switch, but I haven't yet had an opportunity to do it myself. I include an option of how to build the switch to have a B+M vs a B||M option in position #2.

B>

 

[BassBH]

I actually meant a difference between the NG-2 and NG-3...for the finish I'm looking at the difference is nearly 300 euros, and I actually lose the use of the middle pickup by itself in the bargain.

Unfortunately since I live in the EU, shipping it to any of the popular modders is not really an option, and the bass itself is already built so.i can't special-order a mod, so it would have to be a DIY job (though I have a local bass tech I trust). Could somebody link to the six way switch in question?

Another option, as mentioned by John, is the D-Roc switch. It gets you the M soloed. I was pretty sure I was going to switch it out to a 3X on my NG-3 because I wanted the BN setting, but a little counter intuitive tweaking of the preamp with all pickups on gives me a better BN sound than I thought possible. Plus, I fell in love with M soloed, and couldn't bear to part with it. Note that I haven't actually compared (ie ABed) the all on setting with BN, but with the right strings (Payson RC nickels), I know I found the tone I was looking for with it. A very BN tone to me.

 

[Thumper]

D-rocs, where are the strap attach points at the bridge end?

 

[singlemalt]

Dbird, but I figure the Droc balances the same.

Photo credit: pbass6811

 

[spiritbass]

Plus, I fell in love with M soloed, and couldn't bear to part with it.

To me, this is the voice of my NG-2 (the neck pickup being in the same position as the middle on a 3x). So satisfying. Sounds like a monster P to my ears.

 

[Thumper]

View attachment 3850770
Dbird, but I figure the Droc balances the same.

Ok, couldn't tell if there was and end pin. To keep my Lull T5 from rolling forward, I wrap the strap around the front of the body, not sure if that is possible either a D-roc (or D-bird).

Photo credit: pbass6811

 

[xnewyorka]

If you are worried about it preventing it from rolling forward, you don't have to worry about that problem. Sheldon already solved that problem so you won't have to. The instrument is perfectly balanced just as it is. It's magic!

 

[Thumper]

Thanks John. I'll assume the body roll is limited to Tbirds and D-birds then, unless I hear differently (P.M. is okay, as it may be limited to people like me who have a bit of padding around the belly). Also, body roll only manifests when I attach strap at neck plate, not when using the upper horn strap mount.

 

[AB Nate]

If you are worried about it preventing it from rolling forward, you don't have to worry about that problem. Sheldon already solved that problem so you won't have to. The instrument is perfectly balanced just as it is. It's magic!
View attachment 3850828

you know, even that cavity cover plate is dead sexy. Great lines

 

[Salciniclas]

Here's a relatively neater version. I believe at least person here has built this switch, but I haven't yet had an opportunity to do it myself. I include an option of how to build the switch to have a B+M vs a B||M option in position #2.


View attachment 3850041B>

yap, that is me. And it worked quite amazing and still does !

 

[Sheldon D.]

Yep it's a good point and I agree. It's obviously not a crazy difficult change and for the caliber and cost of the instrument an upcharge option with the 6 way would be a great option.

The complexity of a 6 way switch increases dramatically (as does the size) when you want to use a circuit board. They can be handwired point to point of course but then the cost goes up and the reliability goes down.

 

[Ryno1330]

The complexity of a 6 way switch increases dramatically (as does the size) when you want to use a circuit board. They can be handwired point to point of course but then the cost goes up and the reliability goes down.

Good to know. I think my (and John's) point was that on premium (5-9k basses) that it would be a nice custom option even if hand wired as people like the idea. Even if it is a couple hundred dollars it costs that much just to ship it to CA and back just to have one installed.

Anyway not trying to change the way you guys do things and understand your point - thanks for the response.

 

[johnsonabq]

The complexity of a 6 way switch increases dramatically (as does the size) when you want to use a circuit board. They can be handwired point to point of course but then the cost goes up and the reliability goes down.

Good to know. I think my (and John's) point was that on premium (5-9k basses) that it would be a nice custom option even if hand wired as people like the idea. Even if it is a couple hundred dollars it costs that much just to ship it to CA and back just to have one installed.

Anyway not trying to change the way you guys do things and understand your point - thanks for the response.

Just spitballing off the top of my head but, what about a toggle switch for each pickup? The you can config as you please. Each switch could be a three-way with center being off. Up is on in parallel, and down is on in series. I'm sure I'm missing something here.

 

[packrat]

Just spitballing off the top of my head but, what about a toggle switch for each pickup? The you can config as you please. Each switch could be a three-way with center being off. Up is on in parallel, and down is on in series. I'm sure I'm missing something here.

Yes you are. It's easy to switch how the coils are inside each pickup (that's what the dingwall switches do), but more fiddly to effect a different arrangement of pickups where they are wired in parallel or series with each other.

If you have two pickups the series parallel can be done with a DPDT single switch but on/off is harder, for 3 it's really hard, and iterations with "off" and "series" are problematic.

It's instructive to consider how to wire up a simple Series/Parallel as well as a Dingwall 2x switch (note, this may be different to the specific dingwall one, but this will work

http://www.rattus.net/~packrat/audio/dingwall/dingwall-2x.jpg

Also take a look at
http://www.rattus.net/~packrat/audio/dingwall/dbird-switch-breakdown.pdf
and
http://www.rattus.net/~packrat/audio/dingwall/dbird-switch.pdf

which are my working out of what the DBird switch is doing in each position, and which I used to figure out how to wire the 6-way that's up above.

B>

 

[Maramos43]

I’m gonna disagree and say middle, here is my combustion with a P-Tone in the middle position next to a standard P (quick picture so not measured it) but they look pretty close to the same spot if you go by where the pickup sits on the G.
I also think the P-Tone sounds better in the middle than at the neck in this bass, it used to be 3X but I got rid of the extra pickup.

View attachment 3824417

Just saw your combustion pic, and I'm wondering, what string retainer fits the original one? I'm about to go with the black hardware face lift and the only thing missing is the retainer. Cheers!