Fearful Part 14: one better than 13!

[KJung]

I am still interested in Ken's take on it. Particularly since he went composite. I'm still fighting the last of the 15/6 vs TC115 issues out in my head. I'm going with Mike, either way. TC115 form and 4ohm and port tuning has me thinking good things. However, fEARful has more exposure and no proprietary components, so repair issues seem easier down the road, and the modularity for expansion is attractive. I have no doubt they both sound amazing, though in slightly different ways.

I'll post up in a while when the cab is broken in, and I have some gigs under my belt.

One thing I will say at this point is that the Thunderchild voicing is quite different from the 15/6 or 12/6 voicing. I've spent much time with a variety of 15/6 and 12/6 cabs, and of course, have many gigs on my TC112.

Since Duke's design goal with his 15 is to basically make a 'louder Thunderchild 12', I feel like I have a pretty good handle on the difference (edit: I'm sure the slightly lower crossover point and more heavy duty compression driver impact the top end of the 15 version of Duke's cab a bit versus the 12, but most reviews that I've read describe the general tone very smilarly between the two models).

Tom's comment of the 12/6 and 15/6 top end being a bit 'clinical' is right on. Duke's cabs sound like REALLY good bass guitar speakers (Roger Baer's cab is the same way). Plug just about any head into them, and you are good to go. No muss and fuss on fancy EQ, high passing, high power at 8ohms, etc., etc. (IMO and IME) The 15/6 and 12/6 executions using the 18Sound mid driver are more 'PA cab' sounding. Very even upper mids, even in that area around 1 or 2K that can result in some trouble with many heads and basses (i.e., harshness, gank, brittleness). You really need a head like the Streamliner that has a naturally sweet voicing up there, or a lot of EQ power (like that Carvin head that many fEARful guys like) to make the top end of these cabs sound 'musical' IMO.

The low end is quite a bit more extended and 'big' sounding with the 15/6 and 12/6 cabs versus the tighter voicing of Duke's cabs also.

So, quite different in size, voicing, everything. If you don't need to shake the ashtrays in the room, it is hard not to like the beautiful, 'custom' voicing of the Thunderchild cabs, their small size, and the nice voicing options with the port plugging and that wonderful treble roll-off switch. If you are playing all out rock or whatever, and are looking for the maximum wump in the low end, and have the skill and motivation to work with that rather clinical (IMO) upper mid response, the 15/6 is quite impressive.

Interestingly, the Streamliner just SINGS through the 15/6, where it sounds a bit 'flubby and dull' through the Thunderchild to me. That warm, smooth, creamy voicing is perfect to make the 15/6 sounds 'musical' (for lack of a better term), but is a bit too much of a good thing with my Thunderchild. The low end of the Streamliner is also perfect for the 15/6 cab.... big, but VERY controlled with the very nicely designed hi pass filtering that the Genz engineers use. I do find myself pushing the preamp gain control quite a bit more with the 15/6 versus my Bergs or whatever, just again to 'warm up' that upper mid response that can get a bit 'ice picky' if you aren't careful. Dialing in just a touch of hair with the Steamliner really sounds nice.

Anyway, blah, blah, blah.... they all sound good in their own way, and Tom's posts above pretty much nail it.

 

[lelandcrooks]

You may be confused as to what you have just bought... See the below quote.

No, he's the first to get a 12/12 flatpack. We've worked on it off and on for a while, between other stuff. Once his is done, I'll put it on the site. Learned my lesson about getting these things tweaked before shipping.

Same is true with the 15/15 flatpack. One of them is underway also. Both are pretty intimidating cabs to get jigged up. Enough bracing to choke a horse.

 

[CL400Peavey]

No, he's the first to get a 12/12 flatpack. We've worked on it off and on for a while, between other stuff. Once his is done, I'll put it on the site. Learned my lesson about getting these things tweaked before shipping.

Same is true with the 15/15 flatpack. One of them is underway also. Both are pretty intimidating cabs to get jigged up. Enough bracing to choke a horse.

Good to know that those options are out there. Even with a flat pack I still dont have the room or tools to do a build, so I made the right choice contacting Dave.

That said, having someone cut all your pieces/build the crossover is a huge bonus to those that just want to do the finishing!

 

[tombowlus]

If you don't need to shake the ashtrays in the room, it is hard not to like the beautiful, 'custom' voicing of the Thunderchild cabs

What are you doing with ashtrays in your room?

 

[domestique]

You may be confused as to what you have just bought... See the below quote.

Actually, to clear things up, my fEARfuls (two 15/6/1s) were built by Rob Anchak. But I bought my greenboy badges though speakerhardare..... Thanks Leeland!

 

[domestique]

I know you asked Ken, but I play a SL900 thru a 1515/66, and the bass is a P/J (G&L SB) w/flats. We use a little room recorder at gigs, nothin fancy, and don't worry where we put the recorder. Every post gig review is clear deep fat bass and I can hear every thing I do right or wrong.
Sometimes I will ask my guitar slinger bandleader if I am too loud. He just says," I f--- love it!"
Last gig we had 2 bands of his friends and former bandmates opening, plus another bass playing friend who stopped in just to listen. I got a lot of compliments from bass and guitar player perspective. Trust me it was the gear. I am an average player. It's a great combo for old school and blues. Can't comment on slap etc.

thank you for the write up. You are not helping my GAS any, but if I ever need a smaller foot print it sounds like the streamliner is a good pair.

 

[KJung]

What are you doing with ashtrays in your room?

That description sure does give away my age and generation Don't miss the smokey bar days one little bit!

 

[aborgman]

Anyone use a tube head with their fEARful? I'm making a trade this afternoon- a cab for a tube head and cab, so I'll know soon enough how it sounds, but I've read on TB that tube heads like sealed cabs more than vented/ ported cabs... any experience?

I run an LDS built Fearful 15/6 with an Ampeg B-18 head.

It sounds great, but 50W isn't enough to super loud.

 

[tombowlus]

Interestingly, the Streamliner just SINGS through the 15/6, where it sounds a bit 'flubby and dull' through the Thunderchild to me. That warm, smooth, creamy voicing is perfect to make the 15/6 sounds 'musical' (for lack of a better term), but is a bit too much of a good thing with my Thunderchild. The low end of the Streamliner is also perfect for the 15/6 cab.... big, but VERY controlled with the very nicely designed hi pass filtering that the Genz engineers use.

One nice thing with the fEARfuls is that they can handle all the lows you want to throw at them without getting muddy. I think of high-pass filtering as more of a tonal option rather than a requirement for tight bass when you are using the fEARfuls. I've slammed mine with both tube and solid state heads (like the Mesa M6, which of course has no or very little high-pass filtering), and the fEARfuls just eat it up.

 

[KJung]

One nice thing with the fEARfuls is that they can handle all the lows you want to throw at them without getting muddy. I think of high-pass filtering as more of a tonal option rather than a requirement for tight bass when you are using the fEARfuls. I've slammed mine with both tube and solid state heads (like the Mesa M6, which of course has no or very little high-pass filtering), and the fEARfuls just eat it up.

+1 all the way. The M6/M9 will destroy most cabs, and that 3015/3012LF driver will just take it. Tonally, that does very little for me personally (too much of a good thing), but that, as you say, is more of a tonal choice.

Again, if BIG low end at high volumes is your thing, the various cabs based around the stock 3015LF is about as good as it gets!

 

[BurningSkies]

One nice thing with the fEARfuls is that they can handle all the lows you want to throw at them without getting muddy. I think of high-pass filtering as more of a tonal option rather than a requirement for tight bass when you are using the fEARfuls. I've slammed mine with both tube and solid state heads (like the Mesa M6, which of course has no or very little high-pass filtering), and the fEARfuls just eat it up.

That's why I enjoy it...I find that I can be loud and low and not become a washy mess. Although I will say that I'm not a reggae player who does the 'max the bass, cut all mids and treble' thing, instead I boost the bass a little and leave my mids flat.

I'll also say that I don't find my mids and upper mids all that clinical sounding, but I'm using the Kern now, and previously a LMII, and they're pretty 'warm and sweet' in those areas. I don't even roll the Kern's 'tonal balance' to the fat/vintage side of things, I leave it pretty well due north.

 

[monsterthompson]

Thanks Ken! I wasn't looking to start any kind of "which is better" noise here, and it looks like y'all have stayed very gentlemen-like. These cabs are so few and far between that I think I'm not the only guy curious about finer points. I have no doubt hat both are amazing. Having just played a fEARful, I was hoping to get a relative sense of the differences, particularly since TC115 cabs are even less plentiful.

I'm planning to continue on with my M6/Dingwall combo, which added up to be a bit heavy with the Baer mid driver (pre-adjustment recently made) in the upper mids. The 12/6 and 15/6 cabs I played were quite musical with my amp/bass combo. The EQ nobs seemed to make meaningful and useable changes, without needing heavy parametric and slider trickery.

The best thing about this quest for a new cab has been the ear training it has taught me. I'm listening for, and hearing things I'd never been aware of. I'm currently playing with my existing rig to mimic the qualities I like from what I've heard so far. I've certainly found myself going 180 degrees some days and 360 degrees on others. The funny thing is the "in the fingers" sound I'm finding. I've started to hear myself adjust my technique to get the sound I like, regardless of the cab or amp I use. Some cabs just make sweet spots easier to find.

 

[KJung]

Thanks Ken! I wasn't looking to start any kind of "which is better" noise here, and it looks like y'all have stayed very gentlemen-like. These cabs are so few and far between that I think I'm not the only guy curious about finer points. I have no doubt hat both are amazing. Having just played a fEARful, I was hoping to get a relative sense of the differences, particularly since TC115 cabs are even less plentiful.

I'm planning to continue on with my M6/Dingwall combo, which added up to be a bit heavy with the Baer mid driver (pre-adjustment recently made) in the upper mids. The 12/6 and 15/6 cabs I played were quite musical with my amp/bass combo. The EQ nobs seemed to make meaningful and useable changes, without needing heavy parametric and slider trickery.

The best thing about this quest for a new cab has been the ear training it has taught me. I'm listening for, and hearing things I'd never been aware of. I'm currently playing with my existing rig to mimic the qualities I like from what I've heard so far. I've certainly found myself going 180 degrees some days and 360 degrees on others. The funny thing is the "in the fingers" sound I'm finding. I've started to hear myself adjust my technique to get the sound I like, regardless of the cab or amp I use. Some cabs just make sweet spots easier to find.

As Tom mentioned, with the M6, the fEARful is the real deal IMO, and a wonderful match. All these cabs are 'top notch' for what they do, and like any cabs, each 'sings' in its own way, and differentially pulls ahead depending on the rest of the signal chain, tone goals and playing contexts (type of mix and volume capabilities).

Hard to go wrong with any of these offerings, including the Bergantino cabs.

 

[::::BASSIST::::]

Ken, so I assume you received your AoN fibreglass cab by now?

 

[Mike Arnopol]

Thanks Ken---very useful info. I have played some Fearfuls now and also the TC112 and 115 and I agree with your opinions.

Bottom line---neither cab is better---just different and for different needs. It's just great to be able to have such wonderful choices---either way you can't go wrong!

 

[Hollow Man]

Ken, so I assume you received your AoN fibreglass cab by now?

Ken's post from yesterday:

Here is the Art of Noise 15/6. I'm very pleased. 35 1/2 pounds (amazing), and nicely put together.

Sounds GREAT with the Streamliner and the P. The treble control on the Streamliner is voiced nicely to take a bit of the gank out of that mid driver, and the mids boosted at 250hz with the bass either flat or slightly cut results in a very full, warm, articulate tone with my 5 string P with nickel wounds.

Ken, thanks for your thoughts earlier today about the AoN 15/6... as always, extremely helpful!

 

[KJung]

Thanks Ken---very useful info. I have played some Fearfuls now and also the TC112 and 115 and I agree with your opinions.

Bottom line---neither cab is better---just different and for different needs. It's just great to be able to have such wonderful choices---either way you can't go wrong!

Hey Mike.... I look forward to checking out your new builds. You are doing some VERY cool stuff with the composite thing! Hope to run into you this summer sometime, as we discussed!

 

[tbss454]

This GAS is killing me. I have an M6 and want a fearful so badly, my Mesa cab can't deal with the low end. Stop talking about how well this cab works with the M6!

 

[smeet]

Tom's comment of the 12/6 and 15/6 top end being a bit 'clinical' is right on. ... Very even upper mids, even in that area around 1 or 2K that can result in some trouble with many heads and basses (i.e., harshness, gank, brittleness). You really need a head like the Streamliner that has a naturally sweet voicing up there, or a lot of EQ power (like that Carvin head that many fEARful guys like) to make the top end of these cabs sound 'musical' IMO.

Currently the Streamliner is my only amp. Maybe that's why my fEARful sounds so rich and warm to me. I'm looking for another small but powerful amp, and I've been thinking about the GK MB800. My fear is the "gank" factor. In combination with the fEARful, am I going to have a lot of that without the ability to dial it out?

 

[KJung]

Currently the Streamliner is my only amp. Maybe that's why my fEARful sounds so rich and warm to me. I'm looking for another small but powerful amp, and I've been thinking about the GK MB800. My fear is the "gank" factor. In combination with the fEARful, am I going to have a lot of that without the ability to dial it out?

I have not tried that combination (Tom B. probably has). My guess is, given the big low end of the GK MB series, combined with the nicely voiced upper mid control (I think centered at 1K), you would be good to go with the fEARful.

The Markbass F500 sounds quite good when you dial back the upper mids at around 1K, and boost the low mids slightly at around 200hz, and also widen the low end a touch. You should be able to do the same with with that GK.