Grindcore

[bluewine]

Sorry on the GF thing there Blue..hope you bounce back soon.

No big deal, I'll find someone else. I am going to stay cool for a while.

Thanks

 

[Bigmouth]

OK, I'm not going to read 30 pages, I gave up after 5 or 6. But here's what's alternating on my car stereo . Mountain Nantucket Sleighride , Melechesh, and music from the playlist of the Titanic. (turn oh you beautiful doll up really loud)And I'm in my fifties.

 

[bolophonic]

On the contrary -- they are absolutely made up (note: I do agree that it's not ALL cases -- but many). The only question is (a) WHO is making them up, and (b) are they meaningful (or "WHY")

And I really have been unfair to the fans on this -- rereading some stuff about "grindcore" I neglected the fact that BANDS are often to blame, trying to give themselves some unique identifier...and "journalists" who need to prove themselves experts in something.

I find it very annoying, and promise not to jump into a whatsit-core debate and scream "ALL YOUR CORES ARE BELONG TO NOTHING" (for then I would be the troll) but when it comes up in a thread like this one, I get to call it out...

Oh, and back to your comment -- the account I read of how the term "grindcore" was invented makes it clear that it was simply made up, and not very creatively...and what I find really weird is that I NEVER hear it until now...I was a very active music geek when that term was born, but never heard it used...I know it means I wasn't an insider to that scene, but I still find it interesting that I never ran across it...

Another non-metal dude talking about metal like they know what they are talking about.

 

[lethargytartare]

Another non-metal dude talking about metal like they know what they are talking about.

LOL -- you're funny...

 

[NateS]

saw the following comic and thought of this thread...

[Invalid or Expired Link Removed]

 

[LaklandBass]

OK, I'm not going to read 30 pages, I gave up after 5 or 6. But here's what's alternating on my car stereo . Mountain Nantucket Sleighride , Melechesh, and music from the playlist of the Titanic. (turn oh you beautiful doll up really loud)And I'm in my fifties.

Melechesh = Awesome

 

[LaklandBass]

Sorry to hear about the GF bluewine. Thats never a fun situation for anybody.

 

[bassbully]

saw the following comic and thought of this thread...

[Invalid or Expired Link Removed]

End/Thread

 

[scorpionldr]

they have no grind. everything about them is either death metal or hardcore. there is no grinding at all. vocal delivery, guitar lines, speed, and drumming were all death metal influenced, with hardcore breakdowns.

sweet video, interesting to see the suits in metal. crowd sucked though...didnt' look fun...

Speed is only death metal influenced? You've clearly never went to a Napalm Death concert. They started that before anyone else. You clearly have some reading to do.

Yes actually, they do. Grindcore and deathcore are completely different types of music.

Look, you can say whatever you want about the whole grindcore/deathcore drama, it really means nothing to me. Your looking for a whole list of BS defined traits that give you an excuse to ignore a band if it doesn't fall in with your tastes.

Its simple. If there's blasts, there's grind. If there's grind, it falls in with grindcore sound characteristics.

 

[scorpionldr]

The guitars sound literally grindy.

?? what does "grindy" mean as far as sound? Really, what is it, is it a reference to note audibility? Or is it just how high the guitarist's gain knob is? Or is it just because the bassist throws in a distortion pedal into his signal?

 

[kcole4001]

End/Thread

I think you could actually end almost any thread I've ever read with this pic...

 

[sloasdaylight]

I'm sorry if anyone likes them, but Suicide Silence is THE WORST! band I have ever seen perform live. Their entire stage show consists of their singer bobbing up and down like a pterodactyl, and their guitarists/bassist windmilling. I saw them with Megadeth and Machine Head in Orlando at the Hardrock live, and if one of them got out of sync with their windmilling, they would literally stop playing, reposition themselves, then start playing and windmilling again. It was such a joke.

That was the only show, other than local original gigs that I've ever been to where the applause after each song was intermittent and half hearted.

 

[KayXero]

lmao did someone say pterodactyl

 

[IbanezBass69]

Wait... I just realized this in the "Band Management" forum... And I must ask why it has not been placed in the "Random Assortment of Posts" forum....

 

[Ben Noblit]

I'll have to disagree with this one. If you went to a white, suburban high school and are instrumentally inclined, I can see what you're saying as being the case. But, are the kids who go to an inner-city school in a Black neighborhood who are musically inclined playing Metal? If you're musically inclined vocally, as opposed to instrumentally, are you going to gravitate to Metal?

What I will say though is that the Metal kids, at least in my experience were more into the cerebral part of music. We were into the technicality and complexity of it. We wanted to be good, and this music was challenging to us and required us to know more theory than a 3 chord pop tune. Although we could appreciate listening to "Love Me Do", we couldn't be bothered learning it because we viewed it as being too easy. Not that it was a bad tune, but we were full of ourselves at the time, and couldn't be bothered dealing with "easy" songs.

From a musical standpoint it was great to really push ourselves, but we also didn't learn the lessons about the biz. But heck, we were in High School, so who cared back then. We were some punk kids having fun. But, later in life as music became more of a business, I find that at 39 I'm playing those 3 chord pop tunes that I couldn't be bothered with when I was 17, and actually enjoying some of them.

Ah, good point. I was thinking of the "instrumentally inclined." Amateur singers are everywhere. I didn't go to high school, but was fairly deeply involved in the young people's music "scene," and aspiring metal bands/musicians outnumbered everyone else by the thousands.

Your point about demographics holds true, but I still think there are more metal-inclined young musicians than there are rappers, for a number of reasons.

First of all, there are more white kids in this country than there are black kids.

Next, white kids tend to be wealthier, which means they have more access to equipment, transportation, and more parental and financial support to play.

Third, remember my original point was about people who identify themselves as musicians, with that being a huge part of their image and sense of self. IME, when you ask a white kid who plays, they tend to say something like "I'm a metal guitarist" or "I play in {insertbandnamehere}. With black kids who rap, again IME, they tend to identify themselves first with other things (ie: "I'm an athlete, I'm a computer geek," etc.) and then say something like "Oh, and I can rap too." They view it more as just another skill. It seems to me like "musician" and "metalhead" are distinct social classes among white kids (who thus work at it more since that is their primary method of obtaining social status) whereas "rapper" is not among black kids.

I hope that makes sense.

 

[NateS]

Speed is only death metal influenced? You've clearly never went to a Napalm Death concert. They started that before anyone else. You clearly have some reading to do.

i as saying that the AMOUNT of speed was death metal influenced. death metal is slower than grind. the song was not fast enough to be grindcore.

sorry, from now on i will spell out every meaning, to a tee.

(that means that will thoroughly explain everything, in case you didn't know)

(thorough explanations are generally attributed to the postercore genre. black metal is generally more philosophical, leaving open wonderings and thought of death while death metal generally has more "brutal", "maniacal" lyrics, possibly towards murder and causing pain. grindcore is often times just for shock or extreme volue, or in the case of some bands, politically motiviated)

 

[LaklandBass]

I'm sorry if anyone likes them, but Suicide Silence is THE WORST! band I have ever seen perform live. Their entire stage show consists of their singer bobbing up and down like a pterodactyl, and their guitarists/bassist windmilling. I saw them with Megadeth and Machine Head in Orlando at the Hardrock live, and if one of them got out of sync with their windmilling, they would literally stop playing, reposition themselves, then start playing and windmilling again. It was such a joke.

That was the only show, other than local original gigs that I've ever been to where the applause after each song was intermittent and half hearted.

The pterodactyl thing is just toooooo funny. Im not a huge fan of them at all but I do find it to be entertaining on video. Theres a couple songs that I dig but overall not my thing.

Lately my metal listening has included Dying Fetus, Job for a Cowboy, Bring Me the Horizon, Melechesh, older Cradle of Filth, Megadeth, Through the Eyes of the Dead and Despised Icon.

I know a lot of people laugh at all of the sub genres of metal but if youre really into heavy music it comes in handy to describe all of the new bands that keep coming out.
If you take the Human Abstract, Killswitch Engage and Behemoth you have three VERY different bands yet they all fall under the blanket of "metal".

 

[LaklandBass]

Ah, good point. I was thinking of the "instrumentally inclined." Amateur singers are everywhere. I didn't go to high school, but was fairly deeply involved in the young people's music "scene," and aspiring metal bands/musicians outnumbered everyone else by the thousands.

Your point about demographics holds true, but I still think there are more metal-inclined young musicians than there are rappers, for a number of reasons.

First of all, there are more white kids in this country than there are black kids.

Next, white kids tend to be wealthier, which means they have more access to equipment, transportation, and more parental and financial support to play.

Third, remember my original point was about people who identify themselves as musicians, with that being a huge part of their image and sense of self. IME, when you ask a white kid who plays, they tend to say something like "I'm a metal guitarist" or "I play in {insertbandnamehere}. With black kids who rap, again IME, they tend to identify themselves first with other things (ie: "I'm an athlete, I'm a computer geek," etc.) and then say something like "Oh, and I can rap too." They view it more as just another skill. It seems to me like "musician" and "metalhead" are distinct social classes among white kids (who thus work at it more since that is their primary method of obtaining social status) whereas "rapper" is not among black kids.

I hope that makes sense.

A lot of that absolutely does make sense. Ive worked in a number of different types of neighborhoods in the chicago area and I support your post after seeing what I have seen.

It reminds me of the difference between how many girls say that "they sing" versus when a guy tells you he sings he usually means that he performs or records or anything of that sort. where as with females in the younger age group the vast majority will say that they "sing".
Perhaps it just has to do with females having a natural vocal range that fits into popular music more easily.

 

[lethargytartare]

Ah, good point. I was thinking of the "instrumentally inclined." Amateur singers are everywhere. I didn't go to high school, but was fairly deeply involved in the young people's music "scene," and aspiring metal bands/musicians outnumbered everyone else by the thousands....

You guys had quite a different experience that I did. In high school (late 80s), the guys actually playing music were playing (a) REM style "college radio" rock, or (b) classic rock. The guys listening to metal were the "burnouts" -- and knowing quite a few of them personally, they weren't linking into the "cerebral" part of it -- it was the counter/alienating aspect of it. By the 90s, it was all alt rock. The metal heads in college were actually the townies who weren't in college...lord, the biggest musical presences were (a) Garth Brooks and (b) The Cure...at least until Nirvana broke...oh, and hip-hop, especially in the clubs. All the guys in band (high school) -- no metal heads.

And for decades, the most "cerebral" musicians I've dealt with were prog guys. And we would often fight about the fact that they were WAY too cerebral about it all (both the fans and the bands). Until this thread, I have never run across that idea that cerebral musicians gravitate toward metal...obviously I'm skeptical, but I didn't grow up in all places at all times, so I really find it fascinating!

...Your point about demographics holds true, but I still think there are more metal-inclined young musicians than there are rappers, for a number of reasons....

You follow this with crazy speculation that is pretty badly rooted in racial stereotypes...It's too easy to drag it out point by point, but really, the whole argument is nonsense, and I can't see any hint that it reflects the real world either...

Again, my experience -- I saw one kid do a Metallica tribute at a talent show, and dozens of kids do rapping (and, given the time, break dancing) performances at talent shows, beach parties, etc. etc. etc. And we were a largely caucasian town (although a lot more ethnically diverse than a lot of other towns in the state).

IME, when you ask a white kid who plays, they tend to say something like "I'm a metal guitarist" or "I play in {insertbandnamehere}. With black kids who rap, again IME, they tend to identify themselves first with other things (ie: "I'm an athlete, I'm a computer geek," etc.) and then say something like "Oh, and I can rap too." They view it more as just another skill. It seems to me like "musician" and "metalhead" are distinct social classes among white kids (who thus work at it more since that is their primary method of obtaining social status) whereas "rapper" is not among black kids.

I've never met a musician -- NEVER -- who prefaced the fact that he played an instrument with a genre...or even the fact that he was IN a band. "I'm a computer geek" -- who in the world are you talking to?!?! "I can rap too" -- seriously?!?! What planet are you from?? In a few decades of life I've never heard ANYONE use the expression "I can rap, too" or "I'm a computer geek" or "I'm a [insert genre here] guitarist" -- who talks like that?!?! lol! I'm having a "I feel like I'm taking crazy pills" moment...

That whole post sits on a fine line...sometimes trying too hard to prove a point can make you say some real "shake your head" things...

 

[NateS]

You guys had quite a different experience that I did. In high school (late 80s), the guys actually playing music were playing (a) REM style "college radio" rock, or (b) classic rock. The guys listening to metal were the "burnouts" -- and knowing quite a few of them personally, they weren't linking into the "cerebral" part of it -- it was the counter/alienating aspect of it. By the 90s, it was all alt rock. The metal heads in college were actually the townies who weren't in college...lord, the biggest musical presences were (a) Garth Brooks and (b) The Cure...at least until Nirvana broke...oh, and hip-hop, especially in the clubs. All the guys in band (high school) -- no metal heads.

And for decades, the most "cerebral" musicians I've dealt with were prog guys. And we would often fight about the fact that they were WAY too cerebral about it all (both the fans and the bands). Until this thread, I have never run across that idea that cerebral musicians gravitate toward metal...obviously I'm skeptical, but I didn't grow up in all places at all times, so I really find it fascinating!



You follow this with crazy speculation that is pretty badly rooted in racial stereotypes...It's too easy to drag it out point by point, but really, the whole argument is nonsense, and I can't see any hint that it reflects the real world either...

Again, my experience -- I saw one kid do a Metallica tribute at a talent show, and dozens of kids do rapping (and, given the time, break dancing) performances at talent shows, beach parties, etc. etc. etc. And we were a largely caucasian town (although a lot more ethnically diverse than a lot of other towns in the state).




I've never met a musician -- NEVER -- who prefaced the fact that he played an instrument with a genre...or even the fact that he was IN a band. "I'm a computer geek" -- who in the world are you talking to?!?! "I can rap too" -- seriously?!?! What planet are you from?? In a few decades of life I've never heard ANYONE use the expression "I can rap, too" or "I'm a computer geek" or "I'm a [insert genre here] guitarist" -- who talks like that?!?! lol! I'm having a "I feel like I'm taking crazy pills" moment...

That whole post sits on a fine line...sometimes trying too hard to prove a point can make you say some real "shake your head" things...

note: i do not feel that i am rascist in any way, just that these are simply facts. i am not praising or condemning any type of lifestyle for what color the person is, or assuming that because they are that color that they have to live a specific life style and should be treated that way. However, i do know that people may jump to that conclusion, and so i state that now - i mean no offence, and if i do, i'm very sorry.

now...

hip hop and black culture is very deeply ingrained in music to the point of it not being a big deal. i know countless black people who record albums, and it's just whatever. they don't aim to get signed, make it big, consider themselves "making it", it's just life.

i've known lots of white people to precede their musicality with "what genre i play". i actually preface state myself as "i kinda play everything", but only because i do - if i stayed in metal only, i'd say that. that's because in "white" culture, there are many different paths that don't involve music at all, and music is a sort of a rebellion against that standard path in a way.

in "black" culture, music is generally much more important, whether as a money source or just as something that is there, since the 20's jazz scene. it is often sterotypically said that black people who may deviate from that standard path to "be white", or "not black". (again, just stating from what i've abserved growing up in a poor area and raised around these sterotypes from the black perspective) There is a pressure within the "black" culture to be "black", and follow the culture. And this includes music. So, music is rarely seen as a special point to state. i've never heard "yea i'm a rapper, i just recorded a cd, wanna buy it?", i generally have to bug my black friends to let me hear their stuff.

but what does all of this have to do with grindcore?

who knows.....

hope i didnt' offend anyone with this post. if i did i'm truely sorry and will delete it.