i hate sound guys

[ga_edwards]

It should be worth saying though that it pays to be nice to good soundman though. If you're courteous, they'll be more open to suggestions and more likely to take care with your sound.
It also pays to thank them at the end of the night. Hopefully they'll remember you if you ever work with them again. Hey, even if the sound wasn't perfect, it still doens't hurt to be nice and thank them.

And whilst you're at it, thank the venue too if it's appropriate to do so. Again, the chance of being asked back increases if you're polite.

Manners cost nothing!

 

[D.A.R.K.]

It should be worth saying though that it pays to be nice to good soundman though. If you're courteous, they'll be more open to suggestions and more likely to take care with your sound.
It also pays to thank them at the end of the night. Hopefully they'll remember you if you ever work with them again. Hey, even if the sound wasn't perfect, it still doens't hurt to be nice and thank them.

And whilst you're at it, thank the venue too if it's appropriate to do so. Again, the chance of being asked back increases if you're polite.

Manners cost nothing!

agreed. with much of the attitude displayed in this thread, it's no wonder techs roll their eyes so much, and shake their heads when they see it coming.

 

[TheBassPreacher]

I think this sums it up...

 

[lanceropolis]

So it was my band's first gig and i was excited to play. I get up on stage during a short intermission for the band to get our equipment on and to let the other band get theirs off. i was borrowing a '65 fender bassman but the sound guy wouldnt let me use it because he was to lazy to mic it or something so i ended up playing straight into the PA. He kept turning me down during the songs until i had to check multiple times if my cable was still plugged into my bass or not. Has this ever happened to you? If so wat do you do about it?

Sounds like a bad experience. I agree with one of the follow up postings, and tell him you run through an amp, and you are happy to go di if he has a direct box. (It is been my experience, that parting with some coin for a decent direct box has been very, very worth it) Also, I always, and I mean always buy the soundguy a drink. Never had it go wrong. Seen him pissed at other guys in my band, but always nice as punch to me.

 

[lanceropolis]

20 gigs... when you've really gone out in the trenches then maybe you'll find that it's not the sound guys that are the problem.

Try touring, going to a new venue every night, dealing with different stages, bad food, cranky band members, etc. Then let us know how you like the sound guys ok.

I'm not trying to be a jerk here, it's just that 20 gigs is a drop in the bucket to what the real gigging world is like. So a blanket statement of "always the soundman is a mother****er" is an ignorant statement. And it just shows me that since you're not a pro, you're probably not acting like one, and thus making the soundman angry.

I've noticed, over the years, that the "green" bands out there expect a lot and tend to be dicks about it, whereas the veteran musicians are usually pretty chill and appreciate what the soundguy can do for them. I refuse to work with any musician that acts like a prick to soundguys, or anybody else for that matter.

I don't know you're particular circumstances so I could be wrong. For all I know you're a total pro and a gentleman and it just so happens you really have encountered the 20 worst soundguys in the biz.

I agree with you 100%. I think being pro means a lot more than just being superb at your instrument. Rules of the road (taught to me by a vet road guy in Nashvegas)

1. Great players
2. Great pay
3. Great hang

If two out of three match up, then go for it. lol... never steered me wrong, but it proves a point. Be a great hang for these guys. I'm sure I'd want to help a dude out that calls me out from stage instead of letting me know in advance if there were some problems. And seriously, be flexible people. A stiff reed in a swift river breaks, but a maliable one can change the course of water.

And, isn't breaking the sound guys ****, oh I don't know.. illegal? How are these guys not charging you for breaking things?

 

[engedi1]

I Be a great hang for these guys.
QUOTE]

+1 Nothing has caused me more pain than ego driven grown up children who can't hang. Humility rules! As a bass player, you better have some humility! If a musician wants to stay in this business, he better be a super nice guy, unless you are the headliner and are writing the checks.

 

[mccartneyman]

absolutely. and a pedal sounds just like an svt, why the hell would anyone use an svt?

Because they like hauling around 250 pounds?

 

[JimmyM]

Because they like hauling around 250 pounds?

doesn't bother me. i've been hauling a 250 lb rig before most of you were born. i do have to admit, though, that lately i've been using the b-15 more often, and even used an lmii on a gig last week. still, if it's a fairly easy load-in without stairs or deadlifts, ain't nothing like the svt.

anyway, spend less time worrying about what others use and more time worrying about your own thing, and you will be the better for it.

 

[D.A.R.K.]

Because they like hauling around 250 pounds?

probably because when used properly it sounds like 250 tons of sweet, sweet tone

 

[mccartneyman]

Invalid Link Removed

 

[agedhorse]

man
i have played live like twenty times and always the soundman is a mother****er, they don't know anything and they don't help.

Wow, 20 gigs and 20 bad sound guys. With odds like that maybe you need to buy a lottery ticket real quick.

I can't even say that I've ever encountered that high a percentage of a-hole guitarists. Maybe a dozen or two out of a couple thousand. Hardly a home run.

Well, as a pro sound guy for a lot of years let me give you a little insight into the touring world from our perspective. I think it matches up well with what some of the pro players here have experienced as well.

1. Do unto the sound guy as you would like him/her to do unto you. If you are an ass to him, don't expect a boquet of roses in return.

2. Play appropriately for the room, the band and the audience. If you dominate the band's volume, everybody will struggle all night, your band mates included.

3. If you want to play at the venue again, think twice before opening your mouth to the sound guy. Generally their advice to the booker is going to be listened to, especially if youy don't draw big numbers.

4. Don't damage anybody else's equipment... they may be bigger and meaner than you expected.

5. Don't ever start a fight that you are not prepared to finish, the crew are generally pretty friendly with security and security watches their backs. In fact, I saw an incident happen (names not mentioned) where a tour manager (a pretty big guy) who had a reputation of being a real prick was in an "insane rage" and took a swing at the crew chief at a "large" show. He connected and went to kick the guy on the ground when one of the other hands hit him over the head with a 2x4. They had to do CPR, called the paramedics and off he went to the hospital for surgery to remove broken bone from his brain. His touring career is over. It was determined to be self defense, the crew chief had a broken jaw and had the tour manager kicked him, could have really hurt him a lot worse. This leads me into the next "rule"

6. No drugs at gigs. Ever. Not appropriate, and can lead to irrational, uncontrollable behavour as in 5 above (yes, drugs played a big part). In the early 80's there was a good up and coming band that was signed to RCA, their first album was quite successful with one hit. Everything was going well until they got busted for drug(s). Game over.

7. Drink responsibly... nobody wants to deal with a loud, obnoxous, abusive musician. If you can not handle your alcohol, don't drink.

8. If you travel internationally, be sure all your paperwork is in order, don't carry drugs and don't do anything to get your band in trouble in another country. You may find that you are prohibited from re-entry in the future (if they don't throw you in their version of jail first).

9. Respect your bandmates and play with them as a group, not as an individual. If you agreed to play a bass line in a particular style because that's what the band decides, play it that way and not the way you WANT to play it.

10. Recognize that nobody is out to get you, and that most sound guys are really nice guys, who do their jobs well and can make you sound either better OR worse than you really are. Just depends on how you treat them.

Hope this helps.

 

[modulusman]

Andy, nice post. It is nice to see you checking out this live sound forum. I know your busy with work and the other boards but if you can drop in here occasionally and offer some pro sound advice i'm sure it would be appreciated.

 

[agedhorse]

Sometimes threads are PM'd or e-mailed to me because a forum member is interested in my perspective. I think Bob Lee would be another one with a more "experienced" touring perspective as well. Hey, if I can learn more about the bass world from you guys, it's a win-win deal right?

 

[modulusman]

Sometimes threads are PM'd or e-mailed to me because a forum member is interested in my perspective. I think Bob Lee would be another one with a more "experienced" touring perspective as well. Hey, if I can learn more about the bass world from you guys, it's a win-win deal right?

Yeah I have gotten some good advice from Bob Lee here and on the qsc forums.

 

[mrkreuzschlitz]

The BEST sound guy, by far, has been the one that actually talks about gear with my band. The first time we ever used him, our drummer had his line check first, and as soon as all of the gain on the mics and eq's were done, I heard "dude, your set sounds really good man." I checked my bass, he was like "sweet deal bro!" and we got guitars, vocals, and did our soundcheck. After the show, he came up to me and told me I had the best sound there all night. I mean... sweet. I like it when sound guys TRY to make you sound good.

My roommate ran sound for 8 years, and we were talking about this, and he's no musician, but has spent TONS of time with them. He thinks all sound guys should play an instrument at the least, there's a lot of them that don't and give crappy mixes.

 

[JimmyM]

andy, great post.

story time, kids...

1979...one of my first rock club gigs...a week alternating with a band who were friends of ours. first night, the owner hated us and loved the other band. he told us we sucked and we were way too loud. we were used to playing without adequate pa so we blasted. they owned the pa and were totally used to it. we almost got fired but we promised we'd do something about it the next night. we turned way down and let the soundman control us completely and did everything he told us. every person who was there both nights said it was a dramatic improvement, so we went with it. it was a little disconcerting at first, but we could hear ourselves in the monitors better and ultimately had more control over our sound than ever before. by the weekend, we were blowing the other band off the stage, and the lower volume onstage translated to screaming loud in the pa, which we were deliriously happy about.

and you younger folks can think that your music is really special and needs to be played screaming loud out of your amps, but don't think that the rules of sound reproduction automatically change just because you think you're special all the same rules applied now as they did 30 years ago. so as much as i advocate the musicians getting what they want, you need to have a sense of responsibility. and that means listening to the soundman. if a soundman thinks i'm too loud from my massive 25w b-15, i'll turn down no problem. i'll call him a pussy, but i'll turn down

 

[agedhorse]

I forgot to mention the special rules on the bus, including the bathroom rules.

 

[ga_edwards]

andy, great post.

story time, kids...

1979...one of my first rock club gigs...a week alternating with a band who were friends of ours. first night, the owner hated us and loved the other band. he told us we sucked and we were way too loud. we were used to playing without adequate pa so we blasted. they owned the pa and were totally used to it. we almost got fired but we promised we'd do something about it the next night. we turned way down and let the soundman control us completely and did everything he told us. every person who was there both nights said it was a dramatic improvement, so we went with it. it was a little disconcerting at first, but we could hear ourselves in the monitors better and ultimately had more control over our sound than ever before. by the weekend, we were blowing the other band off the stage, and the lower volume onstage translated to screaming loud in the pa, which we were deliriously happy about.

and you younger folks can think that your music is really special and needs to be played screaming loud out of your amps, but don't think that the rules of sound reproduction automatically change just because you think you're special all the same rules applied now as they did 30 years ago. so as much as i advocate the musicians getting what they want, you need to have a sense of responsibility. and that means listening to the soundman. if a soundman thinks i'm too loud from my massive 25w b-15, i'll turn down no problem. i'll call him a pussy, but i'll turn down

+1. Absolutely. A house soundman will know the venue's acoustics infinitely better than any musician.

By all means discuss any tonal requirements, but as far as volume and mix goes, listen to him (or her!) and let them do their job.

 

[mccartneyman]

I think every band that has formed since 1970 should be forced to stop using large amps and miking everything. Make the guitarists play with no more than 50W amps, basses with no more than 100. Use PA columns, and maybe not stage monitors. After they have learned to balance sound onstage, maybe they can be allowed to use microphones on amps -- but they will not be allowed to use large amps. I'm a cruel man, but fair.

 

[D.A.R.K.]

I think every band that has formed since 1970 should be forced to stop using large amps and miking everything. Make the guitarists play with no more than 50W amps, basses with no more than 100. Use PA columns, and maybe not stage monitors. After they have learned to balance sound onstage, maybe they can be allowed to use microphones on amps -- but they will not be allowed to use large amps. I'm a cruel man, but fair.

look! a flying pig!