Identify Fretless or Not from old recording

[SwamiB]

Re "The Third Most Mysterious Song On The Internet", what are people's consensus about the bass being played in the song here >>>

There are NO OTHER RECORDINGS OF THE TRACK. It's a 3rd generation youtube upload from a cassette tape.

From research of the lyrics, I'm surmising it is circa 1970, San Francisco folk rock. Was fretless a thing back then? Were there any players known for fretless in late 60s early 70s?

Please indicate definitely or definitely not, probably or probably not". I dont want a lot of could bes/maybes.

Are there any old SF players from that era who might recognise the "sound" of the song and maybe the singer.

 

[GretschWretch]

Wow! This is a fine song. Thanks for posting! If this is a fretless bass it is being plucked very near the bridge so as to minimize mwah. I did not hear anything in the track, not even the glissandos, that could not be done with a fretted bass, so I am going to say fretted.

 

[SwamiB]

Hey, thanks mate. Great input! Yeah, lovely song. I'm no bassist, just seeking tell tale signs that might identify the players or sjnger. I think 1965 - 1975 was too early for fretless. Fender and Jaco P only got popular late 70s, I read.

 

[tim gueguen]

The first production fretless electric bass guitar was probably the Ampeg AUB1 of 1965. Fender put out the first fretless Precision Bass in 1970. So there was a bit of a market for them even before Jaco hit the scene.

 

[SwamiB]

Yes, I read that. But not to split hairs ...

My hunch is that some unknown SF indi folk rock players of that era would not have afforded or played one quite so early. And, legend says that Bill Wyman pulled frets out of a fretted bass with pliers in 1965 ... but does that qualify as a fretless!!! Lol.

Did you even listen to the track? What about the technique and sound? Can you say it is or isn't a fretless? That's what I'm digging for, not arcane discussion about dates.

Btw, you forgot to include the whole quote you wrote:
"The first commercially available fretless bass was Ampeg's AUB-1 which arrived in 1966, and Fender followed suit with their fretless Precision bass in 1970, but neither sold in huge quantities. It took a virtuoso to make the bass community consider the fretless bass as an instrument that was not just a novelty" ... from Fretless Bass History )

 

[MonetBass]

Just listened on noise-canceling headphones and my ears say fretless for sure. There are some slides/glissandos in there that don't sound fretted at all.

 

[luciens]

Sounds FL to me. And yes the FL predated Jaco (Jaco mainly popularized it) and you could get em from Fender in the 70's. You can find factory FL 70's Fender P's on Reverb from time to time too.

L

 

[JTE]

Was fretless a thing then? Freebo was playing a factory fretless Precision by early 1972 with Bonnie Raitt.

 

[luciens]

Eg. if you really want to replicate a 1970 fretless P bass experience, just to prove to yourself there was such a thing see below. A new Tony Franklin would be a much better choice if you were going to gig it, but if you're a collector, here's a nice one:

1970 Fender Precision Fretless Sunburst | Dayton Vintage Guitars & Amps | Reverb

L

 

[Lo-E]

If I’m not mistaken (and I very well could be) Rick Danko was already using his fretless Ampeg scroll bass when The Band recorded Music From Big Pink in 1969.

I’m also pretty sure Bill Wyman had removed the frets from his bass even earlier than 1965 and that Percy Jones had filed the frets down on his bass (under the G string only at first) sometime around 1967.

 

[Passinwind]

H
From research of the lyrics, I'm surmising it is circa 1970, San Francisco folk rock. Was fretless a thing back then? Were there any players known for fretless in late 60s early 70s?

Certainly: Bill Wyman, Rick Danko, Freebo, Jim Fielder, Alphonso Johnson, and a number of lesser known jazz players around where I lived in Vermont. Heck, I was playing a fretless in 1972, it was my very first bass.

 

[MCS4]

And, legend says that Bill Wyman pulled frets out of a fretted bass with pliers in 1965 ... but does that qualify as a fretless!!!

Yes. This is how plenty of fretless basses are made, including the most famous fretless bass of all time, i.e. Jaco's "bass of doom." Coincidentally also how the least famous fretless bass of all time was made, i.e. my Carvin B4 fretless conversion.

 

[TomB]

Certainly: Bill Wyman, Rick Danko, Freebo, Jim Fielder, Alphonso Johnson, and a number of lesser known jazz players around where I lived in Vermont. Heck, I was playing a fretless in 1972, it was my very first bass.

I would say fretless. I was gigging mine (the only bass I owned at the time) in 1970. Rick Danko was my inspiration. He toured with The Band using a fretless Ampeg Devil Bass as early as ‘69.

 

[Richard Lindsey]

Hohner was also making a fretless back in the late '60s/early '70s. A friend of mine had one, and it was the first fretless I ever had my hands on.

Link Removed

 

[eastcoasteddie]

Definitely fretless.
What I’m curious about is how you’ve arrived at exactly “circa 1970” from the lyrics. Is it not possible to have written the song in 1976 and then recorded the song in say, 1978, with 1970 San Francisco in mind?

 

[filwitheneff]

Sounds like a fretless to me. And it sounds like a cool song.

 

[rashrader]

Jaco didn’t need anyone to play Fretless before Jaco.

Yes, it does indeed sound like a Fretless.

 

[kinopah]

I would say so.
Definitely a few fragments (0:51 or so stands out) which sound distinctly fretless to me.

 

[Wood and Wire]

I would bet my favourite underpants that this actually dates from the early 90's (possibly late 80's, local studio level production), and it's almost certainly a Music Man StingRay.

 

[Ric Vice]

It’s some kind of fretless for sure, unless it’s just an old bass with the frets so worn down that it sounds fretless. As to the instrument itself That’s hard to say. The fretless versions of Ampeg AEB-1 didn’t grow on trees back in the 1960’s. The entire line of Ampeg made electric basses only had three basic models, The AEB-1, the Devil bass and a solid body. They didn’t sell well (I had a fretted one) the original “mystery pickups” were notoriously bad. They stopped manufacturing them after only a few years of production. So the chance of that being a fretless Ampeg AEB-1 on that recording are narrow to slim.

PS. Only Labella extra long scale strings fit that bass.