Is global warming fake?

[hbarcat]

if it's fake, people are making lots of money.
if it's real, people are making lots of money.

i've kinda grown fond of the earth, so that's where i put my efforts. if the joke's on me, then at least my karma is ok...

Except that the cost of appeasing your "karma" is a doubling or tripling of the cost of energy around the world which would necessarily result from the forced abandonment of fossil fuels over the next decade or so. Imagine every country on Earth being simultaneously hit with hyper-inflation as well as energy rationing just because some politicians are scaring the public with pseudoscientific B.S. and telling us that we need to believe them because we can't afford not to.

The people who stand to make all the money in the new status quo are the politicians who are screaming the loudest about global warming as well as their special interest group supporters.

The alternative is to be more cautious and simply adopt the new alternative energy sources as they become economically feasible and practical and gradually phase out fossil fuels over the coming decades. The free market will make fossil fuels obsolete before the next century even if no comprehensive energy policies are enacted and regardless of what any politicians or special interest groups want.

 

[Eric Perry]

You have it backwards: Since 'global warming' is the "new thing" and mostly just talk so far, the burden of proof lays with the group insisting it is 'real'.. not the other way around. Yes, dinosaurs certainly did exist. We have ample fossil evidence understating that and getting more all the time. Global Warming however has no such 'smoking gun'.. just a lot of emotional, fearful rhetoric, and media hype provoking hysteria and nonsense govermental "solutions".

There's no proof all over the country? Where are these silly scientists getting all there data from then?

 

[Andrew.Glose]

I have a question, and I don't mean to be rude, it's just a question. Why is is that a lot of religious people call global warming a hoax?

A question to those as well, would you like to see the world flooded or go into another ice age?

Be careful, you bring RELIGION up and the topic will be shut down.

Here's my thing: Regardless if someone BELIEVES global warming is happening, what's the problem with buying into keeping the earth clean?

Ex: Most people's SUV'S are unnecessary. I'm rather glad gas is so expensive, as people are converting to more legitimate forms of transportation, such as hybrids and bikes/Vespas. Overweight America could use some more people on bikes.

It's fact: The earth is warming up. Ice caps are melting. Summers are getting hotter.

On the other hand: The earth is also in one of it's coolest periods.

Regardless, taking better care of the planet that harbors the very reason you're able to live is a good idea in my book.

Andrew

 

[bradjonesbass]

Explain the increasing ice mass in Antarctica.

 

[Jazz Ad]

 

[mike_v_s]

Why don't you go out and prove it doesn't exist? Explain the polar ice caps melting. Explain the rising temperatures. Explain the winter storms.

Explain the rising popularity of Extreme Youth Combat. I've also decided that most people's Vespas are unneccesary. Seriously. That's a total waste of gas. You can look just as dumb and save the planet by walking to work in a clown suit.

Mike

 

[afinalfantasy]

Explain the increasing ice mass in Antarctica.

http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2008/01/080114-antarctica-melting.html

And for the record, I'm not Atheist is people think I am.

 

[hbarcat]

There's no proof all over the country? Where are these silly scientists getting all there data from then?

The case for significant anthropogenic (man made) global warming is based entirely on computer models which have inherently high amounts of error and which also suffer from flaws of oversimplification as well as the problem of not being phisically testable or falsifiable except over time scales of centuries. In addition, the many significant factors that naturally affect climate variability are known by climatologists to sometimes completely overwhelm any possible anthropogenic factors and it's not possible to isolate the natural factors from the man made ones with our current understading of the complex interacting systems.

These problems would be enough to render the hypotheseis unsupportable (scientifically untenable) at this point in any other scientific debate, but the politics of this particular issue has thrown that standard out the window and it's now accepted by some as a genuine scientific theory, without the necessary evidence.

There is a paralell here to Lysenkoism in the former Sovient Union when Stalin adopted the genetic pseudoscience of Trofim Lysenko for political reasons and made agricultural policy from it, forbidding any dissent or skepticism on the issue. The result was mass starvation as crops, because of a reliance on a faulty science, inevitably failed. If we now decide to mandate a world energy policy on the scientifically dubious hypothesis called man made global warming then we run a similar risk.

I don't trust politicians or even grandstanding scientists on either side of the debate; I prefer to look at the evidence and right now the evidence is far from compelling.

 

[Eric Perry]

The case for significant anthropogenic (man made) global warming is based entirely on computer models which have inherently high amounts of error and which also suffer from flaws of oversimplification as well as the problem of not being phisically testable or falsifiable except over time scales of centuries. In addition, the many significant factors that naturally affect climate variability are known by climatologists to sometimes completely overwhelm any possible anthropogenic factors and it's not possible to isolate the natural factors from the man made ones with our current understading of the complex interacting systems.

These problems would be enough to render the hypotheseis unsupportable (scientifically untenable) at this point in any other scientific debate, but the politics of this particular issue has thrown that standard out the window and it's now accepted by some as a genuine scientific theory, without the necessary evidence.

There is a paralell here to Lysenkoism in the former Sovient Union when Stalin adopted the genetic pseudoscience of Trofim Lysenko for political reasons and made agricultural policy from it, forbidding any dissent or skepticism on the issue. The result was mass starvation as crops, based on a faulty science, inevitably failed. If we now decide to mandate a world energy policy on the scientifically dubious hypothesis called man made global warming then we run a similar risk.

I don't trust politicians or even grandstanding scientists for either side of the debate; I prefer to look at the evidence and right now the evidence is far from compelling.

Thanks for the well thought out response. I appreciate it.

I don't trust any politicians (or anyone with a political agenda) either. What I see is pretty compelling evidence, though (to me).

 

[mike_v_s]

Thanks for the well thought out response. I appreciate it.

Yeah, I don't know what that's doing in here. My knee jerk reaction was to ask him to prove it. I thought for a minute that I might be taking a dumbed down portion of a standardized test... "one of these things is not like the others". I'm still skeptical that it isn't a joke.

Bring back the dragons and sorcery drivel!

Mike

 

[JansenW]

Natural global warming has been occurring on both Mars and Earth.

Are humans significantly responsible for the global warming of Mars as well as for Earth? (Maybe we should stop crashing our future junk into Mars. ))

Most likely, sun activity and the Earth's orbital parameters are the major contributors to global warming.

 

[Andrew.Glose]

Explain the rising popularity of Extreme Youth Combat. I've also decided that most people's Vespas are unneccesary. Seriously. That's a total waste of gas. You can look just as dumb and save the planet by walking to work in a clown suit.

Mike

SUV's are a total waste of gas.

There's more to life than worrying what people think you look like.

Andrew

 

[mike_v_s]

SUV's are a total waste of gas.

There's more to life than worrying what people think you look like.

Andrew

Really? I've been structuring my entire life around other people's opinions. Up until this very moment it had never occurred to me to look beyond the gazing eyes of those around me and actually turn that stare inwards to find out who I truly am and what I can really offer to this world beyond being ridiculously, incredibly good looking.

On to smaller and more insignificant things like gasoline and global economic collapse...everyone that I know who owns an SUV uses the space it provides daily. I know it's fun to paint a caricature of rich irresponsible soccer moms putting two grocery bags in the back of a Suburban, but it's just not the case in more instances than you might want to realize. Try to imagine that when you see someone pass by you in an empty SUV that you are only seeing 30 seconds of their day. How about your boss? You want him to write your annual review based on the time he saw you picking your nose coming out of the bathroom? Food for thought (the sentiments, not the booger).

Mike

 

[HollowBassman]

SUV's are a total waste of gas.

There's more to life than worrying what people think you look like.

Andrew

That's all great, but when you have eight youngin's that have to be at the match, rain or shine, SUVs are the obvious choice.

I tried the whole horse and buggy thing, but after being bitten a few times, the horses became very uneasy around the children and would increasingly run right into lamp post and trees for not keeping their eyes forward.

 

[mike_v_s]

That's all great, but when you have eight youngin's that have to be at the match, rain or shine, SUVs are the obvious choice.

I tried the whole horse and buggy thing, but after being bitten a few times, the horses became very uneasy around the children and would increasingly run right into lamp post and trees for not keeping their eyes forward.

It's the orange triangle. That's what makes the horses behave and drive straight. On a side note, before I dumped my horses for a Corrolla, I had invested in some 3 hoof motion. I need to sell the set up quick, you know any takers?

Mike

 

[Eric Perry]

Food for thought (the sentiments, not the booger).

I just dribbled out Diet Lime Coke!!

 

[Andrew.Glose]

Really? I've been structuring my entire life around other people's opinions. Up until this very moment it had never occurred to me to look beyond the gazing eyes of those around me and actually turn that stare inwards to find out who I truly am and what I can really offer to this world beyond being ridiculously, incredibly good looking.

On to smaller and more insignificant things like gasoline and global economic collapse...everyone that I know who owns an SUV uses the space it provides daily. I know it's fun to paint a caricature of rich irresponsible soccer moms putting two grocery bags in the back of a Suburban, but it's just not the case in more instances than you might want to realize. Try to imagine that when you see someone pass by you in an empty SUV that you are only seeing 30 seconds of their day. How about your boss? You want him to write your annual review based on the time he saw you picking your nose coming out of the bathroom? Food for thought (the sentiments, not the booger).

Mike

Be cute. It helps your argument.

 

[peaveyuser]

vespas make more pollution the SUV's although they take less gas.


2 stroke engines, are a lot dirtier and make a lot more smoke then a 4 stroke car engine. Even though the car engine is bigger and uses more fuel the way it burns that fuel is cleaner.


And I HATE SUV's I don't see why if you need that space you can't get a Van.

 

[HollowBassman]

It's the orange triangle. That's what makes the horses behave and drive straight. On a side note, before I dumped my horses for a Corrolla, I had invested in some 3 hoof motion. I need to sell the set up quick, you know any takers?

Mike

I'm afraid I don't. My recently acquired elite status has required me to reevaluate my top ten. As it is now, they have oil in their pockets and, as you would expect, insist on taking the choppers.

 

[Ripper]

ok... first, it is no longer called global warming... after data started showing the earth cooling down and/or not warming up as apocalyptically as they were planning, they changed it to the more politically correct "climate change"... therefore, no matter what happens to the climate, they're still right.

and as far as high gas prices being a good thing, think about all the very large machines that pick all the crops you buy (yes, even the soy beans that go into that organic soy milk and tofu that you green people buy)... combines and pickers, the power to run the processing plants, semis and trains to get the product to the stores... the trickle down effect is not pleasant even if you never use cars and have 3 solar panels, a windmill, and a pedal powered generator to run all your electric appliances