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Old School vs. New School Amplification

OP here... My intention here was to gather some feedback from those who have compared "old school" lead sleds like my old Crest CA9/Alembic F1X to the newest generation of bass amps- the class D, micro amps. At the heart of my question is whether there is any sonic sacrifice for the sake of portability. Most think not.

How the thread turned into several pages of amp gut shots is a mystery to me. I suppose threads take on lives of their own and that is fine. This is, after all, a public forum.

It deserves to be pointed out however that returning to hand wired, PTP, all tube amps was never an option I was even remotely considering. To spite the seductive, old school, military spec, overbuilding that the gut shots clearly show, power tubes, in and of themselves, are the weak link in those bass amp designs. They may deliver a sound that you like but arguing that they are superior is just silly.

The wiring may be spectacular, the transformers may be bigger than a Buick, the chasis' may be made of aircraft aluminum, but if there is a power tube involved you are using an inherently delicate, and therefor, unreliable technology. Amplifying bass frequencies places enormous strain on power tubes. Practicality must be considered.

A look under the hood of a Ferrari will reveal the same kind of meticulous crafting, but nobody would ever claim that a Ferrari is the best car to drive to work.
 
chicken-cordon-bleu-sandwiches.jpg


I thought I'd post a picture of the inside of my lunch. Can anyone tell me how it tastes?

no but I can tell it sounds awesome!
 
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OP here... My intention here was to gather some feedback from those who have compared "old school" lead sleds like my old Crest CA9/Alembic F1X to the newest generation of bass amps- the class D, micro amps. At the heart of my question is whether there is any sonic sacrifice for the sake of portability. Most think not.

How the thread turned into several pages of amp gut shots is a mystery to me. I suppose threads take on lives of their own and that is fine. This is, after all, a public forum.

It deserves to be pointed out however that returning to hand wired, PTP, all tube amps was never an option I was even remotely considering. To spite the seductive, old school, military spec, overbuilding that the gut shots clearly show, power tubes, in and of themselves, are the weak link in those bass amp designs. They may deliver a sound that you like but arguing that they are superior is just silly.

The wiring may be spectacular, the transformers may be bigger than a Buick, the chasis' may be made of aircraft aluminum, but if there is a power tube involved you are using an inherently delicate, and therefor, unreliable technology. Amplifying bass frequencies places enormous strain on power tubes. Practicality must be considered.

A look under the hood of a Ferrari will reveal the same kind of meticulous crafting, but nobody would ever claim that a Ferrari is the best car to drive to work.
Oh... class D? Yuck!
Edit: SUPER YUCK!
 
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OP here... My intention here was to gather some feedback from those who have compared "old school" lead sleds like my old Crest CA9/Alembic F1X to the newest generation of bass amps- the class D, micro amps. At the heart of my question is whether there is any sonic sacrifice for the sake of portability. Most think not.

I borrowed the QSC A/B/X comparator from Bob Lee and tested a CA9 vs a PLX2 1804 using a Read Purity preamp and a few other signal sources. Sadly, even listening with my eyes let me down and I never could pass the A/B/X test. I also bench tested power at several different frequencies and found any differences to be negligible. I tried really hard to suss differences, but the only thing I managed to find was different limiter behavior that only manifested on a scope trace, but not in any of my listening tests. Perhaps that would've shown up at very high volumes at the headroom limits, but I simply don't run amps that way in my bass rigs.

I recently sold the 1804 as I have found no advantage to it in my bass rigs over various Class D amps with smaller and/or lighter form factors.
 
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There probably is, but who's to say which is "better" sounding? ;)
I did not say that. I'm making a point. There is "is quality" and there is "not is quality" and not is quality does not sound like is is quality. :roflmao:

I know for a fact which one will be messier upon failure of the cap ;)
That don't sound right. :smug:
 
The only thing about a high end component system would be how to protect it.
I'd be looking at shock limiting suspension mount rack systems.

This never leaves the house, but works for D/I out to my interface or as a very rich old school tube vocal preamp.

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'52 Ampex 403-P mic-line preamp.

I can't begin to imagine what it would cost today to faithfully re-create this circuit.

One of the very few cool things my father left me.
 
To the OP - there's only one way to know the difference between a Crest CA and something newer like a Crest 2.0. Rent 'em both from a local sound contractor and try them with your band. Anything else is dancing around that test. You might hear something, you might not, and what you hear may well be different but equally acceptable.

Personally, the new class D stuff that is well designed sounds great, is easier to transport and makes a lot less heat. I interchange between a class D micro and a conventional head with nary a thought. They sound different, but both sound very good. I switch between them depending on which eq I want to use for the genre and the room, no other reason.
 
Hey guys, we like spirited discussions. We like them especially among friends. Let's keep it at the friends level, because friends don't violate rule 1, (or 10) and then I can spend my time looking at Amp pr0n, and Chicks at Shows and stuff like that, which makes everyone a lot happier, especially grumpy old me, in the long run. Thanks. Over and out. :)