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Play for free, huh? Not cool!
- Thread starter DWBass
- Start date
One of the players in my band tells the story of meeting Barry Rick (big local agent in the DC area) in the 70's. Barry wanted his band to play for the "exposure." He said, "Barry - we'll get just as much exposure if you pay us!"
i always expect that all audiences/crowds are keeping up with the band, but i could be wrong!Possibly also never had anything but a crowd of heavy drinkers as your following? (Sorry. Couldn’t resist.
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I don't understand all the hate here. You should always expect to have to compete no matter how old/experienced you are, and have no entitlement to a free ride, especially just because of your ego. Monopolies and closed shops are bad for everyone. This band obviously wants to grow from the experience of gigging, and good on them for being prepared to do whatever it takes to get better.
if you're a professional musician and are threatened by a startup band charging nothing then that's a sure sign that you need to honestly reevaluate your actual product/ability, it's true market value, and how you are marketing it. If that in turn leads you to stop resting on your laurels and learn/practice more to make the differentiator more obvious, change bands, or sell your gear and get a job that pays more/you're better at, then any of those would be a positive change in your own life.
if you're a professional musician and are threatened by a startup band charging nothing then that's a sure sign that you need to honestly reevaluate your actual product/ability, it's true market value, and how you are marketing it. If that in turn leads you to stop resting on your laurels and learn/practice more to make the differentiator more obvious, change bands, or sell your gear and get a job that pays more/you're better at, then any of those would be a positive change in your own life.
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Just my opinion, but to me it's not about the money, it's about not being taken advantage of. If I'm making a club owner money, I expect to be compensated.In some cases, yes! Including me! I wasn’t a dentist or lawyer, but rather a civil engineer for the past 35 years (I retired in December 2018). And during those 35 years, I played bass in classic rock cover bands purely as a hobby. I had a fantastic time doing that, and I never cared one iota if I got paid for playing music. I played music (and still do) solely for the love of playing music! Every note I play puts a smile on my face, and THAT is what makes it worthwhile for me!
One of the drummers I was in a band with was an anesthesiologist, and he also played purely for the fun of it and didn’t care about band bucks.
Yes, I fully understand that some folks rely on band income to pay bills. I wish them success!
wintremute
mediocrity at its finest
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Only band I was ever in that did something similar was offer to play for $25 on the first night of a two night first time booking. After that first night the regular rate prevailed. But that was before the advent of things like YT and social media sites where anybody interested can now audition your live videos.
Sorry, but they ARE idiots. And, it’s a mean world. Beyond just the band getting paid issue, it furthers the mindset in the gen pop of being entitled to free music. Music itself us devalued. Unfortunately, at this point, the horse is not only out of the barn, it’s way down the road. Now, I’m sure these guys probably don’t need the money, it’s just an expensive hobby and a chance to live out a fantasy on stage. Others may not be so lucky, and even if they are not out trying to ‘make it’, there’s still expenses to be met that meager merch sales won’t cover. I know many a band has had to make this decision privately, as a tactical move, on occasion. I don’t begrudge anyone for that. But to purposely pull down your pants and bend over, it sends a certain message to bar owners, who then go on run with it as standard operating procedure. These guys are sluts. Whores still get paid.
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I didn’t think I had to clarify that the industry I was talking about was local cover bands and not multimillion dollar recording acts that do their own original music.
We have played for free before as well if the situation was appropriate, but this is different. This is undercutting every other band in that market and can the overall payment down for everyone. Maybe not immediately, but certainly over time.
I absolutely understand and respect that position!
And I would venture to guess that most folks would have that same position.I totally *get* that I’m in the minority here, but I just never was interested in band bucks. If the owner of the venue is making money, my attitude is, good on him!
It helps him keep his business open, which helps me enjoy my hobby of playing music! 
As long as I get to play music, I’m happy!That may be true. But there’s also something called “managing expectations.” And that’s every bit as critical in running a business.
If your customers receive free (and your initial transaction sets a psychological anchor for all future transactions) their following paying offer will be almost always be reduced accordingly. The local music business seldom operates on building long term relationships from what I’ve seen. “Don’t tell me about all the things you’ve done for me. Tell me what you’re going to do for me right now.” is the most common attitude I’ve run into from club owners.
TB staff members are people. People have opinions. As long as those opinions don’t violate the rules or negative about a member here, we’re not prohibited from expressing them in the public parts of the site.
I don’t hope they’re terrible because I’m a vindictive person. Some markets are struggling to get decent pay as it is. This is only going to make it harder in that city/region if the band doesn’t negatively affect the crowd. Why would a bar own pay $500 for when he could pay $0 and still come out just as far ahead?
Feel free to report my post if you feel it was out of line.
If you're afraid your band is going to lose paying gigs because some startup band is offering to play for free, maybe you should up your game.
I totally *get* that I’m in the minority here, but I just never was interested in band bucks. If the owner of the venue is making money, my attitude is, good on him!
Which is why “pay to play” has become the norm in so many places.
With the services sectors of the economy, marketing and economic theory both show that the entry and acceptance of amateurs and hobbyists into any service sector will inevitably lower standards and ultimately drive out the professional providers by destroying their economic basis. Because “good enough” becomes the new standard for acceptable performance and there’s no longer any demand for better.
If a band that is charging can’t provide a better product than a band that will do it for free, the band that wants to be paid doesn’t really have a product. There are professional photographers and cousins with a DSLR. You can get both to shoot pictures at your wedding, but one is likely to have much better value when you see the results. Bands need to up their game.
Ric5
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Just because they aren't supporting your overblown sense of entitlement doesn't make them idiots.
I'm guessing no one in the band has any confidence in negotiating pay for gigs or in the quality of their playing. I would never, ever play for free, unless it's one sort of charity event.
Maybe they just wanna play for the sake of playing. There are those of us who just enjoy playing music. And don’t care about the money
...Which to me seems like a perfectly reasonable attitude for them to have. They are a business. Obviously If you attract customers and increase their takings more than you playing costs them then they will probably want you back(which pretty much comes down to stagecraft, what music you play and how well).
If you get a no then always ask why, then try another venue. Chances are No's are because at least one of: your pay expectations are unrealistic, you're not playing what their customers actually want to hear (which is often venue-specific), or you need to play better. Fix and repeat.
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