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Pre/Power setups that KILL!!!

What's your poison?

  • Pre/Power setups ROCK!

    Votes: 181 69.9%
  • Head for me, thanks!

    Votes: 50 19.3%
  • I'll take my combos, any day...

    Votes: 11 4.2%
  • I'll plug into a carrot and rock the house!!

    Votes: 17 6.6%

  • Total voters
    259
I have a couple of preamp/amp setups and I swear by both.

My main, "large" one is my rack setup which features, among other things, a Trace Elliot AH200 GP11 used as preamp with a Carvin FET1000 (2 500-watt mosfets) for the power amp.

My more portable setup is an Ampeg B-1R head used for the preamp, an Audio Centron 31-band EQ and an old Trace Elliot 500-watt power amp.

Like I say, i love both. So much so that I don't even use my Trace Elliot 600 watt head, which is for sale, btw, for CHEAP! ;)
 
Count me in as another satisfied Alembic/QSC PLX guy. Very clean, fat, round, clear sound, and totally reliable.

My cabinets are okay ... Carvin 1x15 and 2x10. The tweeter and crossover in the 2x10 have intermittent issues. The 2x10 doesn't go very low. However, the 1x15 is a great cabinet, clean bass, loud, light, and it has wheels!
 
PHP:
I might get a Berg 115 for the bottom of my HT322 just for kicks.

Big String! You're scaring me. (And giving me GAS) Man, my Bergie HT322 gets such a sweet, deep, punchy and authoritative deep, low end as is. Adding the Bergie 115 would be incredible. I've played through that cabinet alone and found it to be incredibly clear, while still possessing the old school depth that 15's are known for. Quite a sexy thought. I would need however a Pre/Power to do it right since the HT115 is an 8 Ohm Cab and my HT322 is a 4 ohm Cab. My Ashdown ABM500 EVO will only go down to 4 ohms. Honestly, I don't ever want for more power that a sound man can't give me. I have all the power and volume I need for stage volume and club gigs that have no FOH sound system with a sound man.

I would love to try the Bergie HT115 with a Bergie HT210 on top. That looks like the Bergie modular rig of choice in my eyes. No problem there with amp racks fitting a top either.
 
Originally posted by Roscoe5
PHP:
I might get a Berg 115 for the bottom of my HT322 just for kicks.

Big String! You're scaring me. (And giving me GAS) Man, my Bergie HT322 gets such a sweet, deep, punchy and authoritative deep, low end as is. Adding the Bergie 115 would be incredible. I've played through that cabinet alone and found it to be incredibly clear, while still possessing the old school depth that 15's are known for. Quite a sexy thought. I would need however a Pre/Power to do it right since the HT115 is an 8 Ohm Cab and my HT322 is a 4 ohm Cab. My Ashdown ABM500 EVO will only go down to 4 ohms. Honestly, I don't ever want for more power that a sound man can't give me. I have all the power and volume I need for stage volume and club gigs that have no FOH sound system with a sound man.


I would love to try the Bergie HT115 with a Bergie HT210 on top. That looks like the Bergie modular rig of choice in my eyes. No problem there with amp racks fitting a top either.


Heck, I scare myself! Your quite right, the 322 does not need and assit. But think about the bootay that would create....
And your right again, the perfect "other", set up would be the Berg 210 on top of the 115 as Boogie will testify. I do have the capability to run a 4 and 8 ohm with my 2402. SCARY...oooh. I'm not gassing yet just a hopeless gear junkie.
 
Originally posted by Biker4Him
o.k. I'm soooo pumped I've got to chime in. I just changed my entire rig, and ended up with Eden Navigator-> Qsc 1602-> Accugroove El Whappo.

I thank my Lord & Saviour every day since.

It's great to play bass!

Cool rig!

You need to give us (or point us to) a detailed review (here's a review of my rig).

[Don't forget to update your profile (current setup), dude.]
 
Thanks!

Let's see. I think the QSC has been reviewed to death, but here is a little synopsis of the rig as a whole. I bought the Accugroove over the Bergie 322, as a result of some input from a few bass players that had tried both. Based on most of my playing being metal, and heavy groove oriented rock, we came to the conclusion the Accugroove would be better suited, because of the additional low end provided by the 15. Let's face it though. This is a completely different cabinet from the 322, so comparing them is not really fair. Also, a few well timed (and unsolicited by me) emails from Mark Wright seemed to help. As a side note, Mark has been awesome in the way he has dealt with my questions. And let's not forget Adrian for selling me the bad boy. Anyway, when the cab arrived, I was IMPRESSED. This was 1000 times better than my Ampeg PR410HLF. It sounded great being driven by my M-Pulse 600 (in my house) Live there was a big problem. When run up to stage volume, the cab sounded like poop. I thought the speakers were coming apart. Actually, it was the other problem. Not enough juice. So, a little gear swapping, and I ended up with the QSC 1602. (an no preamp) Already tons better in a live situation. The bass sounded awesome. The cab was true, and do more breaking up. Then, I got a call from my local shop. "guess what we got in today? An Eden preamp" I was down there is 15 minutes. He let me try it for a couple of days. First, the Navigator added volume. I probably didn't have enough level without the preamp, and with it, the rig sounded even better. Second, I was already missing a little bit of the tubey goodness. I thought the preamp on my Boogie was good. But this thing was the stuff!! I ended up setting it almost flat. Adding a slight amount of tube gain, and cutting a little of the mid on the semi-parametric eq. The thing is, each little tiniest of turn on the eden, seems to make a TON of difference. Before the gig I was goofing off, and boosted the highs, and treble, and got the MOST EXCELLENT slap tone I have ever heard (this was with the bridge pickup 100%, neck pickup 0 on my Roscoe) But back to reality. I set it all back flat, put the pickup back to all neck) boosted the bass and low mids on the bass, turned up just a tad tube gain, and we played for two hours.

I have never had the punch, depth, warmth, and fullness as I do now. For some reason with the Navigator, the bart preamp on my bass seems to have 1000 times more possibilities, and then the Eden on top of that. The Accugroove, sounds amazing. It just needed more power. Now it will punch harder than Mike Tyson did in 1987. And sing as pretty as nightengale (although that's not my forte')

I probably talked too long, and didn't get into as much detail, but there is my story. And I'm stickin to it!!!
 
o.k. I'm soooo pumped I've got to chime in. I just changed my entire rig, and ended up with Eden Navigator-> Qsc 1602-> Accugroove El Whappo.

I am sure that this rig rocks! I have a Navigator, PLX 3002, and a bunch of cabs, but I was thinking about getting one or two Whappo, Jr.'s to go with this. How hard is the El Whappo to lug around? I have not heard the EW, but I did get to check out the Tri 208, Mini Whappo, and Whappo, Jr., and I was quite impressed with the B-string handling capabilities of the Whappo, Jr. I can only imagine what the El Whappo cranks out! However, I am trying to get away from the super heavey cabs, as the basement steps seem to keep getting longer...

Enjoy!

Tom.
 
Wow... sorry I've been away. Let me try to answer the questions. I run the QSC bridged mono. Yes I love the way my setup sounds. The El Whappo is not as difficult to lug around as my old Ampeg PR410HLF. It weighed about 120 this El Whappo is under 100. I have a 4 wheel all steel cart with 10 inch pnuematic tires that I throw all my gear on and roll it right to where I wanna be. Or.. you can just put casters on it.

The El Whappo seems to be a perfect fit for my Roscoe. The Roscoe's are know for their Low B (mines tuned to A) and the El Whappo just makes it sound that much more incredible. It's heartstoppingly deep and bold, yet crystal clear, and will punch you right into next year!! When you want to get fancy..... those double tweet's just sing like a bird. I like the 12 for the mid/lows. You don't lose any punch, since the 15 is the "sub" the mid/lows don't lose anything going into the 12, and the midrange 6 is all there as well. I really can't say enough about the cab. Mark got it all "Wright" (wow, that was a lame joke!!) with this baby. It's more expensive than any cab I looked at, but I have yet to regret giving up my hard earned money.

In the never ending quest for "it", someday I might try putting the Whappo Grande 21" sub under it, but honestly..... I don't need it. And I think I'd have to get more power to push it and the El Whappo.
 
hey all,

just had to chime in. I have found my dream rig and I'll stand by it from now 'til I can't lug it:

Demeter VTBP-201s
Stewart 2.1

AccuGroove El Whappo
AccuGroove Whappo Grande

my Conklin's got passive pickups and I generally steer clear of effects. I get a detailed tone that blows me away every time I plug in!

from the low end,


Stew
 
Originally posted by Brian Barrett
CREST LT2000 - 2400 watts @ 27 Lbs and 2 rack space. Sale price is $950


As for Preamps, man, so many used to choose from............. but I like running my bass direct into the amp to hear the tru tone with no preamp color :D

Brian,
Curious, what bass onboard preamps put out enough signal to really drive a power amp without a regular preamp and also what kind of input sensitivity are you dealing with on the power amp?
Thanks.
 
I use the Benavente Preamp's in the Benavente's and the Smith's pre in Smith's, Ritter's, etc. All different types. Most have enough to run a power amp. You won't get the best performance from the amp, but you can do a show with no problem. Been talking to Jim Bergantino and he is coming out with a Volume only box with a DI built in. its for people who want the pure tone of their basses and to hear what they pay for!!!!!

Not sure when the small box will be ready but a proto-type is finished.

Cab's I use/sell in the shop are the Bergantino's and the Epifani's. Those are the only two Cab's I like I believe are a true musical cab for bass!
 
Originally posted by lo-freq


Brian,
Curious, what bass onboard preamps put out enough signal to really drive a power amp without a regular preamp and also what kind of input sensitivity are you dealing with on the power amp?
Thanks.

lo-freq, almost any onboard active preamp can drive a typical power amplifier. For example, I'm using an older QSC amp with an input sensitivity of 1.16Vrms. With the gain attenuator on the amp set at the zero position, and the bass volume control fully open (the pickups are a pair of EMG J pickups with peak output of around 1.1Vrms), I can drive the amp into clipping.

I know that there are many high power preamps that have output voltages that run nearly 10x in excess of the input sensitivity of my amp, but regardless of what they're producing, they'll have to get attenuated to within the sensitivity window of the amp anyhow. I think that if your preamp is noisy, you can get around the problem with a high output voltage and gain attenuation at the amp.

For my passive bass, I use a Fishman outboard preamp that, owing to its extremely quiet circuitry, can drive the same amp to clipping (powered bu only a 9 volt battery) that a big clunky rack mount tube preamp would do with 120VAC and step up transformer :) If your onboard preamp provides the equalization controls you need, there's nothing more you need (assuming your amp has a sensitivity in range with your preamp) to get maximum power from your amp.
 
Originally posted by GooseYArd


lo-freq, almost any onboard active preamp can drive a typical power amplifier. For example, I'm using an older QSC amp with an input sensitivity of 1.16Vrms. With the gain attenuator on the amp set at the zero position, and the bass volume control fully open (the pickups are a pair of EMG J pickups with peak output of around 1.1Vrms), I can drive the amp into clipping.

I know that there are many high power preamps that have output voltages that run nearly 10x in excess of the input sensitivity of my amp, but regardless of what they're producing, they'll have to get attenuated to within the sensitivity window of the amp anyhow. I think that if your preamp is noisy, you can get around the problem with a high output voltage and gain attenuation at the amp.

For my passive bass, I use a Fishman outboard preamp that, owing to its extremely quiet circuitry, can drive the same amp to clipping (powered bu only a 9 volt battery) that a big clunky rack mount tube preamp would do with 120VAC and step up transformer :) If your onboard preamp provides the equalization controls you need, there's nothing more you need (assuming your amp has a sensitivity in range with your preamp) to get maximum power from your amp.

My SR5 won't drive my PLX1602 (owner's manual says input sensitivity is 1.1v @ 4 ohm) to anything close to clipping (and that's with a brand new Duracell)(might be able to do a very quiet acoustic coffeehouse gig with it).

Sounds like I need one of Jim B's little boxes.
[Or get the input sensitivity modified on my PLX.]
 
Originally posted by lo-freq


My SR5 won't drive my PLX1602 (owner's manual says input sensitivity is 1.1v @ 4 ohm) to anything close to clipping (and that's with a brand new Duracell)(might be able to do a very quiet acoustic coffeehouse gig with it).

Sounds like I need one of Jim B's little boxes.
[Or get the input sensitivity modified on my PLX.]

Without knowing the output voltage of your pickup, it's hard to say why that might be. I'm assuming that you tried it with the input attenuation on the amp turned all the way up (down?), if not, that'll probably do it, if your preamp can exceed the input sensitivity of the amp. I'm not an electrical engineer, so I could be oblivious to the effect of the amps input impedance on the instruments output. It's pretty precise work and hard to do with your ears, especially if you're worried about damaging your speakers and err on the side of caution by using the amps attenuator.

Since the power amp is not going to give you any indication that it is getting close to clipping (it's just either clipping or not clipping), then without knowing the nominal outlevel of the pickups/preamp, its difficult without a meter or an oscilloscope to see how close to clipping it is and to get your gains balanced. Car audio guys are geniuses at this and have all that junk at their disposal.

Doing it this way probably seems like an academic excercise to most people, but its pretty cool that the power amplifiers that many of us use are actually precision instruments who's behavior can be predicted very accurately as long as all the quantities are known. Jeez I'm rambling :)
 
biker4him

Are you kidding me or what!!! You tune your Roscoe to "A" & your Accugroove puts up with it!! Give me a break!!! Either you have a .080 B string or don't know what low end really is.

I had one & it couldn't deal with what I gave it through 1100w of QSC & Kern or Eden pre's! That's why I sold it & tried a 6x10 Berg & an AcmeB4 which both were better but STILL didn't cut it! The Eden XLT 4x10 had more solid low end!?!

Now before all you weirdo's & 10" lovers gang up on me, tell me what your bands style music is & what gear you use. I'm a VERY extreme player, so when a company tells me what their cab is allegedly rated at & "I" try it unbiased, I have every right & "on hands" experience to speak about it.

The only cab I tried lately that worked "good" was an Epifani 6x10(Joker was my witness)& I plan on one very shortly.

Sorry to sound like a d**k but these are my findings after 20yrs of playing & countless lost $$$ on equipment.

Now, I wait for the Accugroove 21" to abuse & hopefully replace my 2x18 Eminence loaded cab...

later,
~S~

PS: If you want my bands site, it's www.Evoken.com. You can link to my Mp3's from there...