Schroeder Cabinets ... smart design = very compact ! (regular and lights)

[John D Harris]

So anyone compared a Schroeder 410 with an Eden 410? Just after a tonal difference, as I hear their characteristics are similar.. (Slightly dark, bumped low mids etc).

Cheers.

Unfortunately, I've never played through an Eden 410.

I wouldn't call the Schroeder 410 dark (though you could make it sound that way with some EQing).
It has a somewhat aggressive edge to the upper mid-bass & lower midrange, maybe the Eden is similar in that respect, but I'd be guessing.
Treble would be where there would be no comparison -- the Schroeder's high end is very smooth and musical, definitely not what I've heard about the Eden's treble.

The D410XST probably goes lower, flatter than the Schroeders, but probably does not have the potential to get as loud.

The Schroeders also have that unique sound projection thing because of the angled-baffled speakers.

 

[Larry Kaye]

I can compare an Eden 210 XLT with a Schroeder 1210 if you want. Let me know either way...may be a waste of time if the comparison isn't close enough for ya.

LKaye

 

[Dan1099]

I'd be interested, larry.

 

[embellisher]

Does the tone change much when tipped on it's side like that?

Yes. That was the only time I played it that way. You lose some lows, and the mids are more pronounced. It was a one time experiment.

 

[Larry Kaye]

Eden 210 XLT....heavy, I felt it lacked midrange and punchiness. It moved a lotta air for a 210 but it didn't really go that deep. It was mushy sounding. I know comparing hz and spl numbers are 't always an accurate, apples to apples kinda deal. All I know is that the tone I got with the Eden could NEVER be used as a stand alone cabinet. What I used it for was strictly as a second or third cabinet (I had an 8 ohm SWR Goliath Jr and the Eden at the same time and a GK 2001 RB head that had 1000 watts bridged @ 4 ohms). when I played a totally dry indoor or outdoor gig. Any hint of echo or bass rumble indoors, and you couldn't even hear the Eden right next to it. It also weighed a ton for a 210 and easily farted out at volumes not that high. I know not of what mid "burp" these cabinets are supposed to have. The tweeter fuse blew out several times. I have nothing good to say about this cab except as a fairly secure step to use to get up and down off stage.

The Schroeder 1210, plain and simple, is the best stand alone cabinet I've ever owned, hands down. Reasonable weight, great tone, volume, bottom, punchiness, and clarity, nice non-abusive highs, not a wallet or back breaker. Can be turned on it's side if the room or stage calls for it without "killing" your sound. I've used it a half dozen times on it's side and 8 or 9 times now in it's horizontal/traditional position. Gives you a little more versatility and flexibility.

I've been a proponent and active participant in the less is more philosophy for quite some time now. I went from the Eden/SWR combo to EA 110's (three of 'em). Then to EA 208's (two of 'em). Then a brief stint with "normal", bigger cabs...Epifani 310 and an Epifani 212 which at the time was the best single cabinet solution I've ever heard.

Then the trunk and backseat of my car was getting torn up, not because the cabinets were extremely heavy...71 to 75 pounds I believe, but because I was not able to physically handle that much weight combined with the awkwardness of both of these cabinets....so, goodbye they went.. I went to LDS's 2x8 solutions. Got two of 'em. Priced great, sounded decent but I kept blowing out the tweeter fuse + the cabs lacked the punchiness.

So I decided to try a completely different approach. I wanted a single cabinet that could cover my gigs for stage volume and as much for venue volume as practical, got rid of my 2x8's, got rid of my 35 pound, 1200 sunn head, bought a single Schroeder prototype cab 1210 from Jorg and an Acoustic Image Focus 1 600 watt, 4 pound head, I did keep my 31 band eq in the mix, my power conditioner, and my rack and roll 4 space rack on wheels, and now I have a 55 pound total rig that wasn't cheap, but was worth every penny to me.

Lkaye

 

[popinfresh]

Cool, thanks.

Yeah, i'm just interested mainly on tonal differences, but that does help. I just they have some common characteristics (410's that is) and just interested to see if anyone had compared them.

 

[basss]

I received my 1212 today and was able to use it on a gig tonight. The gig was a moderately loud 5 piece pop band in an acoustically bright room. I've had trouble in the past getting tight but not boomy low end in this room. With the 1212 I was able to get a nice big growly sound without bowling the rest of the band over. I used my AI Focus SA without a preamp. Usually in a rock/pop type of situation I use a Sansamp ADI to beef up the low mids but the Schroeder had enough 'nads without it. With with the pre in the mix I'm sure it'll sound mad phat.

Jorg was very cool to deal with. He answered all my emails within minutes and was willing to work with me on installing a couple extra handles so I can carry the cab vertically.

The jack/tweeter knob plate on the back has been recessed so that the knob does not stick out past the back of the cab. I remember somebody posting about this earlier.

The cab is a bit heavier than I expected. Mine weighs in at close to 60 lbs. I did have the extra handles installed and this is probably part of the extra weight but I was expecting closer to 50lbs. The cab is still very portable especially with the extra handles. So far I'm very impressed.

 

[Basso Gruvitas]

All,
Forgive me if you've discussed this but I don't have time to go through 1899 posts.

Has anyone matched the Schroeder with a Thunderfunk? Does anyone OWN these 2 animals? If so, how do you like it?

I own a 1210 and am very happy with it, mating it with an SWR SM-500. I hear so much about the TFunk so I may pull the trigger on that.

Anyone?

 

[SnoMan]

Smash talks about using his 1212 with a Tfunk early in the thread.

I'm fairly certain some of his schroeder mp3's feature his T-Funk.

 

[John D Harris]

All,
Forgive me if you've discussed this but I don't have time to go through 1899 posts.

Has anyone matched the Schroeder with a Thunderfunk? Does anyone OWN these 2 animals? If so, how do you like it?

I own a 1210 and am very happy with it, mating it with an SWR SM-500. I hear so much about the TFunk so I may pull the trigger on that.

Anyone?

Jerry uses one last I heard.

Here's the result of a search on Thunderfunk for his ID.

 

[Basso Gruvitas]

Thanks SMASH and Lo! Some good feedback. It just seems like these 2 designs were meant for each other. Of course, I haven't heard the Accugroove/Thunderfunk marriage either.

This could be exciting!

 

[Larry Kaye]

Accugroove of equivalent volume/TFUNK. I'll bet you're talkin' $1800-2000 vs $1400...and I don't know if the volume is really equivalent or the cutthrough ability is as high

 

[Basso Gruvitas]

Boobinga,
Thanks for the PM. I accidently deleted it but wanted to give you a shout.

Sorry Larry, your post make sense not didn't it.

 

[Larry Kaye]

I you say you can't understand me, eh? I was just making a semi snide remark that an Accugroove with equivalent volume as a Schroeder with the cut through a Schroeder has, first of all may not exist or if it does will cost you almost the same as two Schroder medium cabs. So now take your two medium cabs and compare it to one Accugroove, and, if value for the volume and tone is important to you, you have no choice but to serious consider Jorg's stuff. If you love the sound of another maker's cabinet, whether it's priced more or less may not be as important, or whether it sounds as "loud".

Again, preaching to you'all for the 25th time...I don't feel you can beat the combination of volume, size, price, tone, punchiness, nice highs, and serious hear yourself on stage cut through in a single cabinet. I have not found a match in 40 years of playing. Doesn't mean someone won't come along tomorrow or that I've tried lieterally every cabinet maker's stuff, (which I have by the way ). It's still just my old ears opinion but there hasn't been anyone that's heard my new rig that isn't totally flipped out at what they're hearing and then seeing what's generating it.

LKaye

 

[slombovia]

Is Jorg paying you, Larry? Because he should be!

 

[jerry]

I use a Thunderfunk when I usually use just one Schroeder, usually the 1212.....they sound awesome together! Ive been thinking of getting one of Jorgs mini 12 airheads for the Thunderfunk too......seems like they would be great together

 

[Larry Kaye]

I'm not a paid or other endorcer. Jorg said if I sent him a picture he'd put me on the site....but the prosecutor didn't promise to lower my impersonating a real bass player sentence by saying nice things about the Schroeder I have.

I just can't begin to tell you how I'm just loving the rig I've put together...finally. I saw the receipt for my Mike Lull M5V. I've actually kept it 10 months already!!! Cripe, that's some sorta modern record for me. I just find it hard to believe that such a small cabinet can get the job done so well. Then when people see the AI Focus on top of this little cabinet, they literally are shi__ing in their pants. At least the ones who care about tone or not funding the back and hernia surgeons. I wish Jorg would finance me too!!!

If my regular business ever takes off, I'd love nothing more than to sell Schroeder cabinets here in Cleveland and NE Ohio. There's a big market here for something better or different than the traditional Mesa's, Ampegs, Edens, GK's, and SWR's who haven't anything too drastically different or better lately in cab design.


Lkaye

 

[Blueszilla]

I've been out of the local jam scene for several months due to other obligations, but last night I was asked to do a local blues jam and, having a free night, said yes. I took my 1210/iAMP800 rig and received nothing but compliments all night. The regular 'bassist' is really a piano player who owns a bass, so in his mind he's a bass player too. His rig is a mackie pa head biamped to two guitar cabs, a 4x10 for lows and a 2x12 for the high end. He plays with both amps maxed.

Safe to say the 1210/iAMP sounds MUCH better. The drummer is a guy from a popular local blues band (first time that I've met him) and he couldn't say enough about the sound of my rig and my playing. Normally I'm starved for accolades, but by the end of the night he began to get annoying. Anyway, the other guest bassists (total of 4) were knocked out by the way the rig sounded.

This gave me an opportunity to listen to this rig from all vantage points in the club. I noticed that even though the bass didn't appear to be overly loud, it filled the room wherever you were. Good, solid, tasty bass, wherever I stood, even just outside a side exit door, with the door almost closed.

I like the amp, but I'm not necessarily sold on its power rating, I had to crank it pretty good to keep up. I admit there were always at least 2 gp's on stage, and at one point there were 5 ( kind of a mess really!).

Jorg will be famous in the real world one day and I'll be able to say I got one of the first cab's out the door. I'm seriously considering a mini 12.

 

[Larry Kaye]

Why would this "host" bass player think that a 410 and 212 guitar cab rig with a PA head be "adequate" for any gig as a bass rig. The fact that it's a jam, at least in my book, is no excuse to bring equipment that isn't your best. Now maybe this IS his best. Now that my rig is quite portable, I won't go to a jam session without bringing my own stuff any more. I want the house player's rig to sound like crappola. I'm there to get me and my playing exposure to the public in addition to playing in 3 bands a total of 8 nights a month. I want to play with other musicians, but I'm just not comfortable using other people's amps mainly with the tone.

When I'm the house player, which I've been a half dozen times or so over the last 3 months, I always bring my best rig, not my yorkville block 80. I bring the Schroeder or other cabinet and head, prior to the purchase of the Schro and AI, that I use on my gigs. I might be a little picky about letting people use my main axe, but I've done that too.

I want to hear my stuff. I want to get out into the room and hear how others technique and styles affect the sound of my stuff. This is after playing out over 2000 gigs, and 300 venuews in my part time career. I'm always curious. I always want to sound as "good as I can." I'm no virtuoso, but I've heard many a great bassist sound like ****. I'd rather be decent and sound great.

With the Schroeder line, mini to superbig...there's no excuse for a "serious" gigging bassist to not have a great sounding cabinet.

 

[John D Harris]

Why would this "host" bass player think that a 410 and 212 guitar cab rig with a PA head be "adequate" for any gig as a bass rig. The fact that it's a jam, at least in my book, is no excuse to bring equipment that isn't your best. Now maybe this IS his best. Now that my rig is quite portable, I won't go to a jam session without bringing my own stuff any more. I want the house player's rig to sound like crappola. I'm there to get me and my playing exposure to the public in addition to playing in 3 bands a total of 8 nights a month. I want to play with other musicians, but I'm just not comfortable using other people's amps mainly with the tone.

When I'm the house player, which I've been a half dozen times or so over the last 3 months, I always bring my best rig, not my yorkville block 80. I bring the Schroeder or other cabinet and head, prior to the purchase of the Schro and AI, that I use on my gigs. I might be a little picky about letting people use my main axe, but I've done that too.

I want to hear my stuff. I want to get out into the room and hear how others technique and styles affect the sound of my stuff. This is after playing out over 2000 gigs, and 300 venuews in my part time career. I'm always curious. I always want to sound as "good as I can." I'm no virtuoso, but I've heard many a great bassist sound like ****. I'd rather be decent and sound great.

With the Schroeder line, mini to superbig...there's no excuse for a "serious" gigging bassist to not have a great sounding cabinet.

AMEN!