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So what do YOU call this scale?
- Thread starter fretlessman71
- Start date
Furthermore, many songs float between minor and major keys in various parts of the progression, so "flat 3" is a way to describe a note 3 semitones above the root, regardless of the key or chord in question. It saves time and thwarts those who actively seek to misunderstand.
Your wording here makes me think you are conflating chord changes with key changes. If that’s the case it may help to revisit diatonic harmony.
as far as the question goes, I’d just call it a blues scale. The BeBop scale has 2 types of 7s but that’s not really what’s going on in these tunes. These are just color tones for maximum dissonance. That’s why I’d go with just “a blues scale”
So you really just want to know what to call that scale? It's a blues scale. The b5 isn't the only Blue Note. It's just the one people think about most. The b9, b5 and natural 7 are all blue notes when used in a minor pentatonic.
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Not to get off track here too much, but the Bebop scale is an eight note scale, an octonic scale.
I think you've gotten the correct answer to your question, which is that the major 7 is simply a passing note added to the blues scale. I've never heard of any name for that "scale", even though most of us use it. I've read many theory books, and haven't seen that series of notes defined as a specific scale in any of them. I think of the major 7 as a convenient passing note so the root or minor 7th can land on a strong beat.
I just get weary of the "who cares what you call it, just play" responses, of which yours was NOT one.
The first guy to tell you not to worry about it, @Esteban Garcia is a next level player. Dude is a beast but I guess it's okay to want to know what it is. But I tend to be a guy who generally takes the advice of people who I know are way better than I am.
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I'ts closely related to the Bebop scale, which is usually a traditional scale with a chromatic passing note, usually like a nat and flat 7, e.g. C B Bb A G F E D C. The nat 7/b natural acts as a passing tone in a Mixoldyian mode so you can end on the downbeat on the root note if you were playing eight notes, since there 9 notes.
But that's not all he said. He also echoed my response, that it is used as a passing tone. You would rarely hear it played in any way that implies it as central to what's going on. Therefore, it is actually the *correct* answer to also say that it shouldn't be over-analyzed beyond the foregoing, because that's the correct answer.
This is my take, there is no one Blues Scale. It’s not a theoretical construct, it’s just an ad hoc modification to the minor pentatonic scale. I also consider adding the 2, for an 8-note scale, a legitimate variation of a blues scale.
Exactly this! Context is critical, and given the context, Iron Man, we know we aren’t applying a bebop or jazz or baroque lens to examine this. Music theory isn’t the mystical secret knowledge many make it out to be, it’s simply a way to try and find a common, simple, and accurate description of why stuff sounds good. Looking at it through a heavy metal lens, knowing harmonic complexity isn’t really characteristic of that style in that era, calling it a Blues Scale, is entirely appropriate. It’s the easiest and simplest explanation, therefore it’s the one we should use. Without analyzing the particular Melodies in question, Having two types of 7s in there is likely just a filler so they land on a money note on an important beat. Therefore just a passing tone. If it were being played in a different context, something with a lot of the upper extensions in all the chords, then there may be a reason to call it something else, but I can’t honestly think of any situation to call it anything different, in any context. It gets close to some of the more exotic scales like Hungarian major or Arabic scale territory but not quite close enough. Blues scale it is.
My opinion on passing tones not being part of a scale: depending on the chord in a diatonic progression, some notes in the major scale may be passing tones, or even avoid notes. I don’t think that makes them not part of the scale. Just my opinion there.
When I see 4, b5, 5 - I think "Blues Scale." When I see b7, 7, 8, - "Bebop Dominant." If you overlay those two scales together, you got both thirds, both fifths, and both sevenths - a chromatic scale minus 2 notes. Not the funnest scale to use in a theoretical way, but an awful lot of music does these chromatic runs up to both the fifth and the octave - so, it's kind of a thing that works.
When I learned music theory as a keyboard player, this was taught to me as the blues scale.
Minor flat 5 diminished scale?
Or maybe something half diminished?
In one of my college classes our joke answer when faced with these sorts of questions was always “the mysterious augminished scale”. I feel like it’d work here.
It's just a passing tone or other variation like neighbor tone. Call it a fully demolished 7th scale
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