Source Audio Sorcerers Society (S.A.S.S) Part 3

[GMC]

Do you folks run any pedals before the SA pedals? Say dirt or what not? Do the SA pedals play well with others?

In the past I have, I used to run a Zfex Mastotron before my SA Aftershock. But since the Ultrawave launched...it kicked all the other dirt off my board except my SA Aftershock. Considering I used to have 12 dirt pedals on my board, previously. I currently run a pair of Eventide H9's and a EHX Hog2 on my board and the SA gear integrates really well. The Spectrum or C4 sit before or on top of dirt really well depending if you are using an Octave or a Filter...in fact the filters are the best around imho.

 

[bassbrad]

@GMC as much as I agree & totally love the C4 filters combined with the Ultrawave ~ I am finding a second life for my once shelved filter pedals with the Ultrawave and TRex Quint Machine. It's like rediscovering all those wicked pseudo synth sounds from back in the day. PLus I just can't seem to let go of those old boxes.

 

[Rick Penrose]

@GMC as much as I agree & totally love the C4 filters combined with the Ultrawave ~ I am finding a second life for my once shelved filter pedals with the Ultrawave and TRex Quint Machine. It's like rediscovering all those wicked pseudo synth sounds from back in the day. PLus I just can't seem to let go of those old boxes.

I bought a spectrum. Love the pedal but just scratching the surface. I am looking to pickup a second SA pedal (c4 or Ultrawave not sure which). I know that there is a lot of overlap between the spectrum and the c4(sigh); however, I did not go with the c4 originally because I am not really into the buzzy synth tones shown in most of the c4 demos online. I am more into warm synth sounds I.e strings, mellotron, etc. does the c4 cover this territory? Should I go with the c4 or the ultrawave?

Would love to hear everyone’s thoughts

 

[bassbrad]

I bought a spectrum. Love the pedal but just scratching the surface. I am looking to pickup a second SA pedal (c4 or Ultrawave not sure which). I know that there is a lot of overlap between the spectrum and the c4(sigh); however, I did not go with the c4 originally because I am not really into the buzzy synth tones shown in most of the c4 demos online. I am more into warm synth sounds I.e strings, mellotron, etc. does the c4 cover this territory? Should I go with the c4 or the ultrawave?

Would love to hear everyone’s thoughts

That is a tough question but I shall try. The C4 is capable of warmer sounds than the buzzy sounds you refer to but nothing like what could be mistaken for a mellotron or strings*. Using the sine wave, monophonic or polyphonic pitch or dry inputs, the envelopes, harmonizer and other effects can result in a wide range of very pleasant textures that are nearly impossible to create with any other pedal on the market. The only exception might be the Panda MIDI Future Impact.

The Ultrawave is a toolbox of sounds with a panorama of distortion sounds and textures and ways to control and modify those sounds and enhance your bass with a preamp, compressor and EQ. Paired with the Spectrum you will have a powerful tool for creating synth sounds and would not be missing the C4 much sound wise.

*EHX Synth9 and Mel9 may be more what you are looking for when it comes to strings and Mellotron sounds. I have both of these in my collection too and use them regularly. The Mel9 has all the familiar sounds of the Mellotron including the graininess and loop sounds and track well with accurate articulation, I use all the sounds one time or another. The Synth9 is a bit different as it has a bit more specialized sounds that are difficult to get otherwise I find myself using the Arp Strings the most but do occasionally use some of the other sounds.

 

[GMC]

I bought a spectrum. Love the pedal but just scratching the surface. I am looking to pickup a second SA pedal (c4 or Ultrawave not sure which). I know that there is a lot of overlap between the spectrum and the c4(sigh); however, I did not go with the c4 originally because I am not really into the buzzy synth tones shown in most of the c4 demos online. I am more into warm synth sounds I.e strings, mellotron, etc. does the c4 cover this territory? Should I go with the c4 or the ultrawave?

Would love to hear everyone’s thoughts

If you already have a Spectrum then I would advise an Ultrawave as your next option. The C4 is great, but it's really very similar to your Spectrum. The ultrawave opens the door to a lot of weird and wacky synth distortions, however it also contains a really good compressor, some great tremolo options. The distortion models are great too, I can finally nail the gated transistor fuzz sounds (Titan, Mastotron etc). You can teeze out some great overdrive tones too, but these need a careful dial in. If I could retro work the muff and overdrive settings I have on my Aftershock, I could just have the one dirt pedal. However, I really like the simplicity of the Aftershock and the patches I have on it.

The C4 is capable of very smooth sounds, it all depends on how it's been set up in the Neuro app. I tend to put some modulation after my C4 and then a touch of either delay or reverb to soften, smear or give the sound some movement. I do this for all my synth sounds, not just the ones I get from my C4.

I'm actually thinking of getting a Spectrum next month to supplement my C4. Letting the Spectrum handle the octave and filter sounds and using my C4 purely for synth sounds.

 

[Rick Penrose]

If you already have a Spectrum then I would advise an Ultrawave as your next option. The C4 is great, but it's really very similar to your Spectrum. The ultrawave opens the door to a lot of weird and wacky synth distortions, however it also contains a really good compressor, some great tremolo options. The distortion models are great too, I can finally nail the gated transistor fuzz sounds (Titan, Mastotron etc). You can teeze out some great overdrive tones too, but these need a careful dial in. If I could retro work the muff and overdrive settings I have on my Aftershock, I could just have the one dirt pedal. However, I really like the simplicity of the Aftershock and the patches I have on it.

The C4 is capable of very smooth sounds, it all depends on how it's been set up in the Neuro app. I tend to put some modulation after my C4 and then a touch of either delay or reverb to soften, smear or give the sound some movement. I do this for all my synth sounds, not just the ones I get from my C4.

I'm actually thinking of getting a Spectrum next month to supplement my C4. Letting the Spectrum handle the octave and filter sounds and using my C4 purely for synth sounds.

GMC, thanks very much for your detailed response! great input

 

[Rick Penrose]

That is a tough question but I shall try. The C4 is capable of warmer sounds than the buzzy sounds you refer to but nothing like what could be mistaken for a mellotron or strings*. Using the sine wave, monophonic or polyphonic pitch or dry inputs, the envelopes, harmonizer and other effects can result in a wide range of very pleasant textures that are nearly impossible to create with any other pedal on the market. The only exception might be the Panda MIDI Future Impact.

The Ultrawave is a toolbox of sounds with a panorama of distortion sounds and textures and ways to control and modify those sounds and enhance your bass with a preamp, compressor and EQ. Paired with the Spectrum you will have a powerful tool for creating synth sounds and would not be missing the C4 much sound wise.

*EHX Synth9 and Mel9 may be more what you are looking for when it comes to strings and Mellotron sounds. I have both of these in my collection too and use them regularly. The Mel9 has all the familiar sounds of the Mellotron including the graininess and loop sounds and track well with accurate articulation, I use all the sounds one time or another. The Synth9 is a bit different as it has a bit more specialized sounds that are difficult to get otherwise I find myself using the Arp Strings the most but do occasionally use some of the other sounds.

Thank you Bassbrad! A lot to think about. Love the Source Audio stuff but still trying to learn which pedal does what! You feedback really helps. thanks

 

[sunbeast]

I bought a spectrum. Love the pedal but just scratching the surface. I am looking to pickup a second SA pedal (c4 or Ultrawave not sure which). I know that there is a lot of overlap between the spectrum and the c4(sigh); however, I did not go with the c4 originally because I am not really into the buzzy synth tones shown in most of the c4 demos online. I am more into warm synth sounds I.e strings, mellotron, etc. does the c4 cover this territory? Should I go with the c4 or the ultrawave?

Would love to hear everyone’s thoughts

The “buzziness” of the C4 is totally dependent on settings- the C4 is mostly based around “subtractive synthesis”, which means you start with wave-shapes that have a lot of harmonic information (where that “buzz” comes from) then carve them out using the filters. If you use a 4-pole (or even 6-pole) low-pass filter and set it so that it peaks below the high-end then you will never hear anything resembling “buzz”- this is the typical Moog-style fat synth sound in a nutshell (using whatever synth wave shapes suit the sound you are looking for).

A Mellotron is a completely different animal- it is actually playing taped samples of other instruments (one tape per key!), so very different sounds than a subtractive analog synth which is starting from basic tone oscillators. Some string synth type sounds could definitely be dialed in, as some of the early string synths did utilize subtractive-synthesis elements- but it might take some creative tinkering (I’m sure some users have made some “string” presets already that you could use as starting points). The C4 would definitely not do any of these sounds as easily/conveniently as the EHX 9-series pedals- particularly if you are looking for polyphonic tracking (which are all just using your bass to trigger and manipulate pre-recorded samples), though the C4 is capable of far more than any of those EHX pedals for mono-synth sounds since you are building everything from scratch.

 

[Rick Penrose]

The “buzziness” of the C4 is totally dependent on settings- the C4 is mostly based around “subtractive synthesis”, which means you start with wave-shapes that have a lot of harmonic information (where that “buzz” comes from) then carve them out using the filters. If you use a 4-pole (or even 6-pole) low-pass filter and set it so that it peaks below the high-end then you will never hear anything resembling “buzz”- this is the typical Moog-style fat synth sound in a nutshell (using whatever synth wave shapes suit the sound you are looking for).

A Mellotron is a completely different animal- it is actually playing taped samples of other instruments (one tape per key!), so very different sounds than a subtractive analog synth which is starting from basic tone oscillators. Some string synth type sounds could definitely be dialed in, as some of the early string synths did utilize subtractive-synthesis elements- but it might take some creative tinkering (I’m sure some users have made some “string” presets already that you could use as starting points). The C4 would definitely not do any of these sounds as easily/conveniently as the EHX 9-series pedals- particularly if you are looking for polyphonic tracking (which are all just using your bass to trigger and manipulate pre-recorded samples), though the C4 is capable of far more than any of those EHX pedals for mono-synth sounds since you are building everything from scratch.

thanks Sunbeast!

 

[bassbrad]

@Rick Penrose you are welcome ~ this is such an exciting time for us bass playing synthesists and electronic music fans. As @GMC and @sunbeast point out the sonic possibilities of the C4 are it's greatest value, imho far beyond it's simple utilitarian value which is well beyond the purchase price. For me I'm happy to pay the creative minds @ EHX for the hard work creating those sounds so I can focus on creating my own.

A huge thanks to all the manufacturers making it so much fun like @source audio!

 

[sunbeast]

@Rick Penrose you are welcome ~ this is such an exciting time for us bass playing synthesists and electronic music fans. As @GMC and @sunbeast point out the sonic possibilities of the C4 are it's greatest value, imho far beyond it's simple utilitarian value which is well beyond the purchase price. For me I'm happy to pay the creative minds @ EHX for the hard work creating those sounds so I can focus on creating my own.

A huge thanks to all the manufacturers making it so much fun like @source audio!

I definitely wasn’t trying to slag on EHX for their 9 pedals- I think they are above and beyond much anything else out there at what they do (especially the decent polyphonic aspect), it’s just a very different thing than pedals like the C4! I would love a Mel-9, particularly with guitar

 

[bassbrad]

I definitely wasn’t trying to slag on EHX for their 9 pedals- I think they are above and beyond much anything else out there at what they do (especially the decent polyphonic aspect), it’s just a very different thing than pedals like the C4! I would love a Mel-9, particularly with guitar

I did not think you were at all. I love my Mel9, its so fun to see folks looking for where those sounds come from.

 

[GMC]

Funnily enough, I’ve also got an EHX pedal on my board, the Hog2. It’s fantastic at what it does and I like it a lot…it’s just a bit big.

 

[Rick Penrose]

@Rick Penrose you are welcome ~ this is such an exciting time for us bass playing synthesists and electronic music fans. As @GMC and @sunbeast point out the sonic possibilities of the C4 are it's greatest value, imho far beyond it's simple utilitarian value which is well beyond the purchase price. For me I'm happy to pay the creative minds @ EHX for the hard work creating those sounds so I can focus on creating my own.
Thumbs up! It is amazing to see bass extend into uncharted territory.
A huge thanks to all the manufacturers making it so much fun like @source audio!

 

[Johno Dunn]

I searched and here are the cables I got (actually from Amazon): CY 2pcs GPS Mini USB 5P 90 Degree Up Down Angled Male to Mini USB 5Pin Female Extension Cable https://www.amazon.com/dp/B015PRGS0...abc_ND454FEQFHX5X5Z12Q76?_encoding=UTF8&psc=1
You need one “up-angle” and one “down-angle” because the Spectrum and DMC device plugs are oriented opposite from each other.

You’ll also need a Mini-B 5-pin to Mini-B 5-pin USB to go between the two adapters (I use this one, you can choose the length you need: 3ft CablesOnline USB 2.0 Mini-B 5-Pin to Mini-B 5-Pin Male/Male Cable, USB2-5503 30955274713 | eBay ). I use a Pedaltrain board and this combo takes up about as much room as a right-angle pancake-style 1/4” patch cable vs the straight DMC ghost cable which takes up similar space on both ends ads straight 1/4” patch cable! You can also get right or left-angle USB cables in case you have a solid pedalboard which should still save space (just have to ensure you aren’t blocking other connections on each end with the cable you choose)

I got these cables, but I must be doing something wrong, as my Spectrum and my Micro Pro don’t appear to be communicating.

 

[sunbeast]

I got these cables, but I must be doing something wrong, as my Spectrum and my Micro Pro don’t appear to be communicating.

I assume you’ve done the setup procedure in the DMC unit? Including the setting that makes the USB output a “Host” connection? I think he my have a video where he runs through all the steps for setting up his controllers with either the Spectrum or C4 ( here it is, should be the same for the Spectrum as the C4:
it isn’t as simple as just choosing the pedal in the device list for these two units. Have you had it working with other cables yet?

Assuming they are setup correctly, it is possible you got a bum cable in there somewhere (the ones I was sent all worked fine, but certainly possible they sent a bad one- you can read Amazon reviews for most of these cables and unfortunately the occasional bad brand new cable is a reality). Make sure both ends and the center cable are all fully seated! If you have other devices that use these ends you can test all the cables piece by piece to make sure they all work.

 

[Johno Dunn]

I assume you’ve done the setup procedure in the DMC unit? Including the setting that makes the USB output a “Host” connection? I think he my have a video where he runs through all the steps for setting up his controllers with either the Spectrum or C4 ( here it is, should be the same for the Spectrum as the C4:
it isn’t as simple as just choosing the pedal in the device list for these two units. Have you had it working with other cables yet?

Assuming they are setup correctly, it is possible you got a bum cable in there somewhere (the ones I was sent all worked fine, but certainly possible they sent a bad one- you can read Amazon reviews for most of these cables and unfortunately the occasional bad brand new cable is a reality). Make sure both ends and the center cable are all fully seated! If you have other devices that use these ends you can test all the cables piece by piece to make sure they all work.

Thanks for the reply. I’ll go through the DMC again and make sure I have everything set properly.

 

[PhinDog]

Hello,
Question on power. Can I run my spectrum and/or aftershock at 12v or 18v? Any benefit? Or should I keep them at 9v?

Don’t want to fry the pedals but wondering if it gains headroom like other analog dirt and filters.
Thanks!

 

[Derek Williams]

Hello,
Question on power. Can I run my spectrum and/or aftershock at 12v or 18v? Any benefit? Or should I keep them at 9v?

Don’t want to fry the pedals but wondering if it gains headroom like other analog dirt and filters.
Thanks!

No, digital pedals should never be run above 9V, you will fry it. There are no analog diodes in these pedals so you wouldn’t get any more headroom even if it worked.

 

[PhinDog]

No, digital pedals should never be run above 9V, you will fry it. There are no analog diodes in these pedals so you wouldn’t get any more headroom even if it worked.

Perfect, thanks!