Stoner/Doom Bassists Thread, Part 90: Maxed Out

[scabpicker]

Very useful infos!
I guess you can record pretty much everything with 57s. Anyways the "beginners guide" I found recommends the AKG D112 for low stuff such as bass and kickdrum, while says 57s are great for snares, toms and guitar...
If you still had to buy all the mics, would you go for 57s or these AKGs (for bass and kick)?
I had made a list in case we want to record with the Glyn Johns method

2*AKG PERCEPTION 170 (overheads)
2* Shure SM57 (one for the snares, one for the guiitar amp)
2* AKG D112 (one for the bass cab and one for the kickdrum)

Is that a good setup?

Hehehe, my personal mic collection is only two SM57s, a bullet mic, a couple of mics that have been gifted me that I don't know the names of, and the mics in my Tascam handheld recorder. But I've run sound a few times (hired gun with other's equipment), helped out in a couple of different studios for awhile, done a stupid amount of home recording, and have recorded a few records in the studio as the musician. So, I've had more time to watch folks screw with the EQ, ask questions, and listen to orders than really browse mics. However, I've spent enough time in the booth talking to the guy twiddling the knobs that knowing what you're doing with them is more important than the particular tools at hand. There's enough times that the response to "What mic are you using there?" is "Ehhh, it's an XXXX. It's not really the best for that, but we have it, and long as I do A, B, and maybe C to it, it sounds pretty nice." A is usually compression B is EQ, and C is whatever they seem to be liking that week.

So, I can't really choose mics for you. If that all makes any sense. I've seen an SM57 used for just about everything at some point. It's not what anyone would choose for a kick drum mic if they had a better kick drum mic available. So, yeah, if you are buying a mic specifically for that, buy any kick drum specific mic that you can find with a good rep and is cheaper than an SM57.

I don't have too much advice for an overhead setup. You're going over my personal experience, there. I'd probably just take the line out from my Tascam's stereo handheld mics and call it a day.

 

[Sixtysix]

Can anybody recommend me a good pair of custom fit earplugs? Gone through my third pair of Earasers in the last 2 years now, the little center plug keeps coming out.

I ended up going to the audiologist. A bit more expensive than earasers or hearos, but they fit perfectly as they make a mold of you ear canal. Way more comfortable than the Etymotic ER20xs that I have. Took a few weeks for them to come in. You can also get different filters for them. I think these may be the ones I have: https://www.microsonic-inc.com/pulse/

 

[oZZma]

Hehehe, my personal mic collection is only two SM57s, a bullet mic, a couple of mics that have been gifted me that I don't know the names of, and the mics in my Tascam handheld recorder. But I've run sound a few times (hired gun with other's equipment), helped out in a couple of different studios for awhile, done a stupid amount of home recording, and have recorded a few records in the studio as the musician. So, I've had more time to watch folks screw with the EQ, ask questions, and listen to orders than really browse mics. However, I've spent enough time in the booth talking to the guy twiddling the knobs that knowing what you're doing with them is more important than the particular tools at hand. There's enough times that the response to "What mic are you using there?" is "Ehhh, it's an XXXX. It's not really the best for that, but we have it, and long as I do A, B, and maybe C to it, it sounds pretty nice." A is usually compression B is EQ, and C is whatever they seem to be liking that week.

So, I can't really choose mics for you. If that all makes any sense. I've seen an SM57 used for just about everything at some point. It's not what anyone would choose for a kick drum mic if they had a better kick drum mic available. So, yeah, if you are buying a mic specifically for that, buy any kick drum specific mic that you can find with a good rep and is cheaper than an SM57.

I don't have too much advice for an overhead setup. You're going over my personal experience, there. I'd probably just take the line out from my Tascam's stereo handheld mics and call it a day.

Thanks!
57s are cheaper than those AKGs, so if they were "equally good" for that purpose I'd buy all 57s. I guess I'll have to check the specs

 

[scabpicker]

Thanks!
57s are cheaper than AKGs, so if they were "equally good" for that purpose I'd buy all 57s. I guess I'll have to check the specs

Hehehe, to be clear: I did not say equally good. It's much easier to get a good sound out of a mic that's made for the purpose. I'd be browsing the classifieds and sales for a good kick drum mic and searching Sound-on-Sound and Gearslutz for recommendations for cheap kick drum mics before I decided I'd just go with a SM57 if I knew I was wanting to mic a drum set. I have an acoustic kit, but I play it very rarely and record it even less. It lives in the same house as a very nervous cat who will live under the bed for the rest of the day if I even play one song. So, my kick drum mic budget went into virtual drums.

Does Italy have pawn shops or used music stores? I dunno, if I was buying a full mic set on a budget, I would be reading up and browsing there.

Heh, and I do a search on Gearslutz for favorite cheap bass drum mics, and folks are recommending a SM57, everything else they recommend seems to be more expensive. What do I know? Hell, it's an SM57. Buy it. Use it for everything, but it won't be the easiest path in all cases. Get it close to stuff (within 2" or so, it just goes up after that) for better bass response. I'd still buy it used, because if you find out you have more SM57s than you know what to do with, you can probably sell it for around the same price. Unless it's visibly abused (and sometimes even then), it'll probably work for a long time. They're no Electro-Voice 635A* - I watched my employer hammer a nail back into a monitor with one of those, then mic a guitar cab with it and was told "If the singer drops the mic on the stage, give him one of these to use next time, they can't break it." - but they are pretty durable as microphones go.

*And hey, for live rock guitar, it's a great mic. It made whatever tone they were using seem to cut through when it came to leads. And now that I look up the specs, it looks about as flat as a 57, if having a lot more high end and less mid. Heh, I get at least one person at Gearslutz that says they use them on the kick drum a lot. So, use whatever's cheap and has a flat-ish response across the range of the instrument you're mic'ing and eq out what it picks up that you don't like.

 

[rutrho]

My 57 and 58's came about the same way, I got the 57 used and my buddy gifted me the 58's as the mesuem he works at was upgrading and they had a ton laying around I guess. Maybe if i keep doing this i'll pick up a proper kick mic... Hopefully I can get it a bit more dialed in for our next practice session.
Downside is they keep wanting to get me to sing which is pretty terrifying in its own right, and, well, I'm not any good at it. But who knows, we'll see. I've started working on some backing stuff for a couple tracks and thats tough enough as it is... :|


On another topic, staying sober is hard as hell but it can be worth it. I'm 2.5 years into it and while my mental health is still a flaming dumpster fire, its at least more manageable and I'm generally more stable. It sucks but its worth it. Coffee is pretty much the only vice these days, its been keeping me sane at work lately so thats a good thing at least.

 

[callofcthulhu]

Very useful infos!
I guess you can record pretty much everything with 57s. Anyways the "beginners guide" I found recommends the AKG D112 for low stuff such as bass and kickdrum, while says 57s are great for snares, toms and guitar...
If you still had to buy all the mics, would you go for 57s or these AKGs (for bass and kick)?
I had made a list in case we want to record with the Glyn Johns method

2*AKG PERCEPTION 170 (overheads)
2* Shure SM57 (one for the snares, one for the guiitar amp)
2* AKG D112 (one for the bass cab and one for the kickdrum)

Is that a good setup?

Don’t even waste your time with the D112 on a kick drum, get the Beta 52 and enjoy not having to EQ the track to hell to get it to sit right in a dense mix.

I’m also not personally a fan of it on bass cabs, but I’m more of a snarling growling midrange kind of guy, if you’re more about the thump and the gurgle it might suit you well.

I went a year without touching alcohol, 2018 to 2019.

It gave me a real sense of perspective, but honestly it didn’t really stop my life from being the clustershag that it naturally is.

 

[oZZma]

Hehehe, to be clear: I did not say equally good. It's much easier to get a good sound out of a mic that's made for the purpose. I'd be browsing the classifieds and sales for a good kick drum mic and searching Sound-on-Sound and Gearslutz for recommendations for cheap kick drum mics* before I decided I'd just go with a SM57 if I knew I was wanting to mic a drum set. I have an acoustic kit, but I play it very rarely and record it even less. It lives in the same house as a very nervous cat who will live under the bed for the rest of the day if I even play one song. So, my kick drum mic budget went into virtual drums.

Does Italy have pawn shops or used music stores? I dunno, if I was buying a full mic set on a budget, I would be reading up and browsing there.

Pawn shops are not a thing in Italy (not that I am aware of, of least), but there is a great classifieds site for used gear, I usually buy there.

Heh, and I do a search on Gearslutz for favorite cheap bass drum mics, and folks are recommending a SM57, everything else they recommend seems to be more expensive. What do I know? Hell, it's an SM57. Buy it. Use it for everything, but it won't be the easiest path in all cases. Get it close to stuff (within 2" or so, it just goes up after that) for better bass response. I'd still buy it used, because if you find out you have more SM57s than you know what to do with, you can probably sell it for around the same price. Unless it's visibly abused (and sometimes even then), it'll probably work for a long time. They're no Electro-Voice 635A* - I watched my employer hammer a nail back into a monitor with one of those, then mic a guitar cab with it and was told "If the singer drops the mic on the stage, give him one of these to use next time, they can't break it." - but they are pretty durable as microphones go.

*And hey, for live rock guitar, it's a great mic. It made whatever tone they were using seem to cut through when it came to leads. And now that I look up the specs, it looks about as flat as a 57, if having a lot more high end and less mid. Heh, I get at least one person at Gearslutz that says they use them on the kick drum a lot. So, use whatever's cheap and has a flat-ish response across the range of the instrument you're mic'ing and eq out what it picks up that you don't like.

Thanks a lot for the great advices and infos
(and I'll check Gearsluts as well, thanks!!)

 

[rutrho]

On a totally different note, I'm kinda curious if I could get some of yalls thoughts on this track:

I just made a fairly quick scratch track for the bassline on this (not my recording of the drums/guitar...) and curious on how its sitting with everything tone wise, and all that crap. I have a clean version too, but my bandmates like this version more, ha. I haven't eq'd anything or played with it at all so it def has a long way it can go.

 

[oZZma]

Don’t even waste your time with the D112 on a kick drum, get the Beta 52 and enjoy not having to EQ the track to hell to get it to sit right in a dense mix.

I’m also not personally a fan of it on bass cabs, but I’m more of a snarling growling midrange kind of guy, if you’re more about the thump and the gurgle it might suit you well.

I went a year without touching alcohol, 2018 to 2019.

It gave me a real sense of perspective, but honestly it didn’t really stop my life from being the clustershag that it naturally is.

Sure they are better, but they are way more expensive as well... We'll have to stick to "entry level decent stuff", buying PRO level mics is not worth it for our level of skill
Thanks for all the suggestions anyways!

 

[scabpicker]

On a totally different note, I'm kinda curious if I could get some of yalls thoughts on this track:

I just made a fairly quick scratch track for the bassline on this (not my recording of the drums/guitar...) and curious on how its sitting with everything tone wise, and all that crap. I have a clean version too, but my bandmates like this version more, ha. I haven't eq'd anything or played with it at all so it def has a long way it can go.

I don't hear anything wrong with it. It sits well. Good tone, I can't imagine wanting to use a cleaner one on that track.

 

[lucas303]

Sure they are better, but they are way more expensive as well... We'll have to stick to "entry level decent stuff", buying PRO level mics is not worth it for our level of skill
Thanks for all the suggestions anyways!

For overheads, take a look at some of the cheaper Sennheiser and Audio-Technica mics designed for that purpose. Both of those companies make great stuff, and they seem to do a good job of letting their high end tech trickle down to the cheaper stuff.

 

[Kriegs]

On a totally different note, I'm kinda curious if I could get some of yalls thoughts on this track:
I just made a fairly quick scratch track for the bassline on this (not my recording of the drums/guitar...) and curious on how its sitting with everything tone wise, and all that crap. I have a clean version too, but my bandmates like this version more, ha. I haven't eq'd anything or played with it at all so it def has a long way it can go.

Sounds really good and I can hear the bass as clear as day and it sits well amid everything else I think you might be doing what I tend to do sometimes... overthinking

 

[benzoid77]

Can anybody recommend me a good pair of custom fit earplugs? Gone through my third pair of Earasers in the last 2 years now, the little center plug keeps coming out.

I've used Etymotic High-Fidelity ER20XS Earplugs (~$13) and they are my go-to recommendation for people exposed to loud/heavy practice sessions or concerts.

My band practices every Friday night and wearing the ER20XS every week became less comfortable after a while, so I finally went to custom-fit Etymotic Musician Earplugs. Expensive (~$190) but they have been one of the best investments for music I've made. They are easy to put on, fit perfectly, and have swappable filters for different levels of attenuation. I've been using the Medium filters but am convinced I need the Heavy filters after seeing Sleep at the Warfield. Yowza.

 

[rutrho]

I don't hear anything wrong with it. It sits well. Good tone, I can't imagine wanting to use a cleaner one on that track.

Thanks, a clean tone actually works pretty well on some of this stuff as my bass is pretty growly on its own, plus the muwaaaaaaaah bs has a bit more chonk to it. I tend to play this one clean with the band because of that.
The vocals for this song are actually pretty harsh plus the super crunchy guitar tone lets a clean bass sort of provide a heavy but present counter point and at least to me adds some interesting sonic depth. They like the crunchy bass tho, so I'm not complaining too much. hah.

Sounds really good and I can hear the bass as clear as day and it sits well amid everything else I think you might be doing what I tend to do sometimes... overthinking

Thanks! I just recorded it through DI so it doesn't have the presence or some of the tones that'd come out of my amp when its cranked. We're trying to get our vocalist to get some rough mixes of his stuff in still, but we might just wait for some studio time or do some recordings in our practice space to just get _something_ down...

I've used Etymotic High-Fidelity ER20XS Earplugs (~$13) and they are my go-to recommendation for people exposed to loud/heavy practice sessions or concerts.

My band practices every Friday night and wearing the ER20XS every week became less comfortable after a while, so I finally went to custom-fit Etymotic Musician Earplugs. Expensive (~$190) but they have been one of the best investments for music I've made. They are easy to put on, fit perfectly, and have swappable filters for different levels of attenuation. I've been using the Medium filters but am convinced I need the Heavy filters after seeing Sleep at the Warfield. Yowza.

Yahhh, I bet. I've been to a few shows like that, I still haven't managed to see sleep/hof/om but the loudest fricken show I've been to was ZZ Top back in the 90's (with my parents, LOL). Holy. Crap. I had foam earplugs and it was still way way loud. For earplugs I've used Earaesers for a few years now and I like them a lot, but I want to do custom IEM's for a while now.

 

[br1qbat]

On a totally different note, I'm kinda curious if I could get some of yalls thoughts on this track:

Sounds like it sits in there just fine IMO.

I too am thinking about better plugs, I use cheapo construction site style foam ones and they are fine for practice, as the bass is there but its really hard vocal-wise as the plugs cut the frequencies my vocals live in

 

[lucas303]

I've used Etymotic High-Fidelity ER20XS Earplugs (~$13) and they are my go-to recommendation for people exposed to loud/heavy practice sessions or concerts.

My band practices every Friday night and wearing the ER20XS every week became less comfortable after a while, so I finally went to custom-fit Etymotic Musician Earplugs. Expensive (~$190) but they have been one of the best investments for music I've made. They are easy to put on, fit perfectly, and have swappable filters for different levels of attenuation. I've been using the Medium filters but am convinced I need the Heavy filters after seeing Sleep at the Warfield. Yowza.

I have the cheap Etymotics and recently got the custom fitted ones. Unfortunately I need to take the custom ones back to be fixed or something, because the way the filter part sits it digs into my earlobe. Super annoying. So, in the meantime I'm wearing the cheap ones. I'm pretty sure they both use the same filter.

I'd say try the cheaper Etymotics and if they feel fine, stick with those. I might feel different if I had a better initial experience with the customs, so take what I say with a grain of salt.

 

[oZZma]

For overheads, take a look at some of the cheaper Sennheiser and Audio-Technica mics designed for that purpose. Both of those companies make great stuff, and they seem to do a good job of letting their high end tech trickle down to the cheaper stuff.

Thanks!! I'll check these ones as well.

 

[lucas303]

On a totally different note, I'm kinda curious if I could get some of yalls thoughts on this track:

I just made a fairly quick scratch track for the bassline on this (not my recording of the drums/guitar...) and curious on how its sitting with everything tone wise, and all that crap. I have a clean version too, but my bandmates like this version more, ha. I haven't eq'd anything or played with it at all so it def has a long way it can go.

I'm only able to listen on my crappy office speakers at the moment, but it seems good! I like the clean-ish tone on the bass...it really ties the room together.

 

[benzoid77]

Yahhh, I bet. I've been to a few shows like that, I still haven't managed to see sleep/hof/om but the loudest fricken show I've been to was ZZ Top back in the 90's (with my parents, LOL). Holy. Crap. I had foam earplugs and it was still way way loud. For earplugs I've used Earaesers for a few years now and I like them a lot, but I want to do custom IEM's for a while now.

Foam is better then nothing! We place a jar of foam earplugs on/near stage at our shows and encourage people to use them. Merch table is also a perfect place (far right on pic).

 

[thombo]

Oh, hey there Stoner/Doomers! My life took a nosedive in October that led to another TB hiatus. Long story short, divorce is imminent, I'm moving away from a toxic personality in my life, and I'll be in a really good place come May. For now, I can confidently say that I am okay.

Funeral Mask is going strong! We have been tracking tunes at my guitarist's house. He has Logic and recently buckled down and become proficient really quickly! With how massive the guitars sound, we are considering adding another guitarist. Here's a rough mix w/ no vocals.



For earplugs, have you tried the mid-priced non-customs? I was thinking about making the jump from foamies to customs, but it was $$$. I like the Heros Hifi (~$20) and the Dubs (~$50). Both work really well. They don't cut as many DBs as foam, but I think they are quite comfy and sound much more even.

Gross Pro-Tip: I get a better seal if I wet the earplug first, usually w/ saliva since it is readily available. It's like administering a wet-Willie to oneself.

In gear news, I picked up a old Yamaha EM-80 tube mixer w/ a spring reverb. In a few interviews, Tim Lefebvre said he uses to record including Bowie's Black Star album. It sounds great, it's small, and it is light... I'm digging it through Mesa 15's as poor man's B15/around the house amp. It has 4 inputs, so it is also really handy for multiple instruments.