This is interesting... Sire MM Bass???

[GreyBeard]

I'll wait to see how "The Bass Lobster" likes it. I'd be interested in the 5 string model.

 

[Maxi Funkl]

3+1 headstock too? There's some lawyers suiting up...

LOL Nothing to sue different head stock and no one owns tuner placement.

 

[StayLow]

Maybe fantastic instruments for the money, but whenever one of these iconic instrument designs is cloned as obvious as it gets - and then you see a completely different headstock that no gifted designer would ever have combined with the rest of it…
The rest of it: they copied a MM and parts of the very first serious MM clone from Lakland.

It’s terrible eyesore, including the markings in back of headstock, and a shame given their guitars look great tip to bottom.

Given the 3+1 tuner config and that Ernie Ball has already established licensed knock-offs, it’ll be interesting to watch.

 

[IotaNet]

LOL Nothing to sue different head stock and no one owns tuner placement.

Actually, EBMM does have trademark rights to the 3+1 headstock.

Question - Trademark of tuners setup?

 

[Maxi Funkl]

Actually, EBMM does have trademark rights to the 3+1 headstock.

Question - Trademark of tuners setup?

A blog thread from 2010 hmmmm not saying it's wrong but it'll need to be vetted before I accept that as fact. An if it is Indeed factually registered TM I wouldn't assume Sire didn't take care of this up front.

 

[IotaNet]

A blog thread from 2010 hmmmm not saying it's wrong but it'll need to be vetted before I accept that as fact.

Vet all you want. That poster is Sterling Ball — he goes by the name “Big Poppa” on the EBMM forum.

I don’t know the status of the trademark today, but EBMM absolutely owned it in the past.

 

[Maxi Funkl]

Vet all you want. That poster is Sterling Ball — he goes by the name “Big Poppa” on the EBMM forum.

I don’t know the status of the trademark today, but EBMM absolutely owned it in the past.

An so is assumptions that Sire didn't address this up front. But I have no dog in the fight I own both brands and will be getting Z7 5 in Natural and 5 HH Stingray Special in the new Brulee color ASAP.

 

[CoughSyrup]

Actually, EBMM does have trademark rights to the 3+1 headstock.

Question - Trademark of tuners setup?

I would like to know how this would play out in court. EBMM has the resources and incentives to protect its trademark and chase off small builders proactively, but if Fender or Gibson wanted to make an issue of it, I think a competent patent attorney could make the case that the 3+1 layout is not merely aesthetic, but functional as well. I don't think Sire has those resources, nor are they so invested in the layout to the point they'd take on EBMM even if they did.

 

[IotaNet]

An so is assumptions that Sire didn't address this up front. But I have no dog in the fight I own both brands and will be getting Z7 5 in Natural and 5 HH Stingray Special in the new Brulee color ASAP.

I don’t have a dog in the fight either … and will be buying one of the Sires.

One would think that Sire addressed this (or thought they had no legal exposure) up front. As soon as I saw the Z3 / Z7 spy photos, I’ve been lurking on the EBMM forums to see what’s being said about them. That used to be a very active forum and the EBMM fanbois were pretty aggro.

FYI, the trademark discussion has been had here on TB as well: https://www.talkbass.com/threads/3-1-tuner-layout-protected.334879/

 

[OldShark]

I'll wait to see how "The Bass Lobster" likes it. I'd be interested in the 5 string model.

AFAIK, LowEndLobster has paused doing videos for several months... But I would certainly like to get to know his opinion, too.

 

[tremor100]

I would like to know how this would play out in court. EBMM has the resources and incentives to protect its trademark and chase off small builders proactively, but if Fender or Gibson wanted to make an issue of it, I think a competent patent attorney could make the case that the 3+1 layout is not merely aesthetic, but functional as well. I don't think Sire has those resources, nor are they so invested in the layout to the point they'd take on EBMM even if they did.

Jeff Kiesel in a recent QA stream straight up said they tried releasing a guitar with 4+2 and 3+1 on basses and they literally got a cease and desist from EBMM lol... its definately a thing and the headstock in general is one of the few things that trademark is held to in terms of branding... they are 100% getting sued lol, whether they are sucessful in the suit or not is yet to be seen.

Personally i don't really get it, you go so far as to copy the control plate, headstock layout (even though its contentious and would be easier for them to just reuse their 4 in line Pbass neck template), even the teardrop pickgaurd and type of bridge... but then for some reason you lop off part of the bottom horn that IMO looks really odd like part of it melted... meh.

 

[Iridescentone]

If they ever do a HH fiver I might have to do a Burgundy one.

 

[CoughSyrup]

Jeff Kiesel in a recent QA stream straight up said they tried releasing a guitar with 4+2 and 3+1 on basses and they literally got a cease and desist from EBMM lol... its definately a thing and the headstock in general is one of the few things that trademark is held to in terms of branding... they are 100% getting sued lol, whether they are sucessful in the suit or not is yet to be seen.

Personally i don't really get it, you go so far as to copy the control plate, headstock layout (even though its contentious and would be easier for them to just reuse their 4 in line Pbass neck template), even the teardrop pickgaurd and type of bridge... but then for some reason you lop off part of the bottom horn that IMO looks really odd like part of it melted... meh.

Jeff Kiesel probably didn't think the 4+2 and 3+1 arrangements were so crucial to his design that it would be worth the time and expense of litigation. That doesn't mean he doesn't have a chance of winning.

 

[Les Fret]

Looks like an amputated Stingray. I don’t like the looks of the lower horn. I think that will be awkward and imbalanced playing when sitting down also?

I am curious if the sound comes close to a real Stingray though.

 

[definenredefine]

3+1 headstock too? There's some lawyers suiting up...

I was gonna say lawsuits incoming...

 

[OldShark]

When the new Sire models 2024 were leaked in December, there was initially also a MM style guitar model with a 4+2 headstock called I7 — that disappeared later. Would be interesting whether that might have happened for legal matters?

 

[Marc DLarosa]

Once again... I'll check back in a year when all of the Squier/Epiphone fans chime in.

I mean... C'mon... Just play bass. Get your money's worth, and... SMILE.

And... check THIS out... IF they do get shipped with a 3+1, and then get "recalled".... You now have a "collectors item" bass. Good luck to Y'all!!! ESPECIALLY if it sounds/feels GREAT!!!


Peace,
Marc

 

[Baker69]

Looks like an amputated Stingray. I don’t like the looks of the lower horn. I think that will be awkward and imbalanced playing when sitting down also?

I am curious if the sound comes close to a real Stingray though.

I don’t like the shortened lower horn either.

It’s unusual for Sire but it seems like these are offered as Right Handed only? All of their other basses are also available in Left Hand (at no extra cost).

 

[TrustRod]

I thought the trademark was the phrase 3+1, not the actual tuner layout.

But the internet has never steered me wrong before...

 

[BassAgent]

Am I the only one that looks at the Sire and thinks "hmm something went wrong there with a Sterling Ray and a CNC machine"? That lower horn is just...wrong. I'll snatch a second hand Sterling for that price. It feels as weird as that Les Paul guitar that Stagg made a few years back:
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