• TalkBass has been independent since 1998. Add your voice.
    Create a free account to reply to discussions, view embedded media, and browse with fewer display ads.
    Join free Log in
    Want zero display ads or expanded classifieds tools? Compare plans.

Band volume rant. We are our own worst enemy.

#101
I was in a venue a while ago. Band started. Really great technically but way too loud. Before they started, the whole bar was people talking to each other. Not long after they started, an absolute ton of people walked out. And I once played a punk pop gig in Madrid - actually our album launch - when we lost most of our audience in a medium sized venue because the drummer absolutely refused to adjust how he played. In soundcheck, when we said something about it, he said, 'This is how I hit.' Vocalist and main man: 'All our audience are going to be standing at the back of the room if you do that and we have to turn up so much to accommodate.' Drummer: 'This is how I hit.' Result: We played to a sporadic audience with most of them plastered to the back wall and some of them having even left altogether to maybe just listen upstairs.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Mr_Moo
#102
People give us crap because we don’t use amps or real drums, etc. We are all DI/IEM. We only have to be loud enough to cover the drummers clicking on his drum pads. People tell us all the time how good we sound. Not necessary how well we play (we hear that, too) but the mix and the volume. With no stage amps and acoustic drums to do battle with FOH and monitors, we can do any gig, any volume.

Would our drummer like to play real drums? Sure. Guitar player use a real amp? Sure. But we all understand compromise for the good of the band, the mix and gigs.
 
  • Like
Reactions: mstillman, Mr_Moo, JRA and 7 others
#103
JMacBass65 said:
In my opinion, it really does start with the drummer. Even a good, controlled drummer can only play so soft. I think most bar bands now should use electronic drums. Problem solved. I know my main band has done plenty of one nighters, where we don't get asked back, and it's our volume. My drummer (and guitar player too) just say "I like the way it feels and sounds, plus, its what we do".
Click to expand...

THIS! Drums have a volume floor. They can only be so quiet. e-drums are the answer but "real" drummers don't like to play them even though they give the audience a better experience.

And the root of the problem is that musicians (quoting from above) "...like the way it feels and sounds". We're too caught up in our own fun to realize we're peeing in our own pool.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Mr_Moo, Ronzo, JRA and 3 others
#106
SteveC said:
People give us crap because we don’t use amps or real drums, etc. We are all DI/IEM. We only have to be loud enough to cover the drummers clicking on his drum pads. People tell us all the time how good we sound. Not necessary how well we play (we hear that, too) but the mix and the volume. With no stage amps and acoustic drums to do battle with FOH and monitors, we can do any gig, any volume.

Would our drummer like to play real drums? Sure. Guitar player use a real amp? Sure. But we all understand compromise for the good of the band, the mix and gigs.
Click to expand...
Nice! Sounds like your objective is to entertain rather than ego-driven musical masturbation!
 
  • Like
Reactions: Low Down Brown
#107
The guys I play with now have the volume under better control than anyone I've ever played with in the past (I now know that I was part of the problem).We're only a 3 piece, so fewer musicians to fight for a spot in the mix against. The drummer uses an acoustic snare and high hats with an electric kit. He is considering adding an acoustic kick, but he can actually play at appropriate volumes. The guitar player uses a 1x12 combo. We all elevate or angle our cabs back towards us so we can hear ourselves instead of blasting our calves not hearing your own amp clearly while drowning out everyone else. We practice in a small space which makes us turn down, so it's not a shock playing lower volumes. In my experience, it's more fun this way. We're still loud, but not excessively so.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Mr_Moo
#108
zZippy said:
I once heard someone say "if it's too loud you're too old..
Click to expand...

My usual response to that line was, "if it's too quiet, grow up." I've seen way too many acts where turning up the volume substitutes for technique. It's fake excitement.

When I play a gig that requires me to amp at all, I either go straight to the house (if they have it) and let them control it, or take my Rumble...which is a 15w 1x10, and never gets turned above 3. My playing partner plugs his Martin into a Roland Cube if there's no house PA. We each carry an SM58.

My approach to bass is not to try to punch a hole through your chest; it's to play the right note in the right place in support of the guitarist. We never get asked to turn down, we just get asked to come back.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Mr_Moo, JRA, n1as and 1 other person
#109
I've considered learning the program Superior Drummer III. Seriously. I've been a bass player for so long, I know exactly what drum sounds go where and when. The only thing I lack is
the muscle memory and fluidness to play drums. I figure I could capture the velocity exactly how I want it during programming, and the only thing I'd have to do is raise/lower the level without
losing feel or dynamics. I almost pulled the plug this holiday season. I think about it everyday. I figure if I programmed enough songs on drums, I could be the entire rhythm section!
I also think by doing this, I could play in an acoustic band and we'd even have drums. Acoustic acts are getting all the work around here, in part because of the (usually) lower volume level I suppose, and the fact that the places around here to play are small and very small clubs/restaurants.
 
#111
Chango Malo said:
so what would you recommend a drummer do for a small venue where volume is an issue?
Click to expand...

Lighter sticks, lighter touch.

I recently saw Jaimoe Johanson (original Allman Brothers drummer) in a club that held less than 100 people. I think it's safe to say he is a competent rock drummer. Somehow he managed to control his volume - in quiet sections he and the other members on stage could talk in a normal tone of voice while he was playing, as could the audience. I think it's also safe to say the his music is rock.

Talent is a wonderful thing.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Mr_Moo, Fretless1! and larryatravis
#112
Gravedigger Dav said:
A good drummer can control his volume.
Click to expand...

I agree. The problem is, some kicka$$ songs require a driving, velocity-driven drum part.
For instance, how would you play Zeppelin or AC-DC with no real attack/velocity?
I've heard a few drum shields. The reflections sound terrible unless there's acoustical foam lining the inside, essentially putting the drummer in a closet.
WAIT! THAT'S IT! Make a portable closet for the drummer!
 
#113
Band I recently joined has a gig coming up in February and I already made a point to have a discussion about volume. Adjust to the room, and each other. Everyone is on board, which is encouraging.
 
#116
lbbc said:
We've been successfully playing without a drummer for 5 years...but some venues don't consider you a band, and won't pay decently, without one. I'm auditioning a drummer tomorrow night who has a HUGE kit at home but only plays out on his electronic kit... because he says massive volume kills the song. If he's decent, we may become a 4 piece occasionally.
Click to expand...
If he has groove you have hit paydirt.
 
  • Like
Reactions: lbbc
#117
larryatravis said:
Here's our experience. YMMV...
We rented a drum shield (4 2'x5' panels) from L&M in Canada for 13 bucks for the weekend. Since we were already renting PA gear, adding this to the list was trivial.
We miked the kick to send to FOH, but we didn't need any reinforcement on stage, as the drums were still easily audible to us. For recording purposes, at a minimum, an overhead mic would be needed, but for the hall we were playing, the drums with just a kick mic worked fine. It is a regular sized community hall that holds ~250 people with a full stage.
View attachment 3284182
Click to expand...
if your drummer had a proper skillset you wouldn't need the screen.
 
  • Like
Reactions: JRA, Shanebo and larryatravis
#118
43ManSquamish said:
Ha! Nope, there are a lot of venues here, and the Variety is the smallest venue dedicated to music. It serves food and drink but music is the main draw. Below that are the bar-venues, where you could show up to get a drink and/or see a show. The Tabernacle, which seems tiny and has three floors, holds over twice that of the Variety.

My point was that Wilson was playing at a venue that, at best, held 1100 people and his sound was like he was playing a very large hall. His volume would work for the Fox, State Farm Arena, or Infinite Energy Arena - all close to or over 5,000 - but definitely did not there.

I've heard some loud bands at the Variety - Blue Oyster Cult and They Might Be Giants come to mind - but Wilson blew them all away, sound-wise.
Click to expand...
1100 cap is a large enough hall for most of us. It's not like stage volume can do it justice.
 

Latest posts

Top Bottom
Back