Venting - LS can't handle playing in a bar that serves shots.

[Carl Hillman]

So, one of the bands I'm in is made of up older guys, two of which are in the health care industry (so are all about taking care of their bodies) and the other three of us are retired. I'm the youngest, at 56. Needless to say, we've all experienced enough of life that I thought we all would be mature enough to know that when we are gigging, we are working, and keeping your alcohol consumption at a manageable level is required. We have played at other venues where this has never been a noticeable issue.

Apparently I was mistaken.

We had a gig last Saturday at a small bar, which can comfortably seat about 80 people. I had previously booked a gig with my other band that went well, so I booked a gig for this band, expecting things to be even better, since the musicianship in this one is of a higher calibre.

LS has a table of family members at the gig. First set went off well. A little bit of weirdness where the LS called some audibles to the set list, but, if his voice can't handle a song that night, then that's cool, nothing we haven't done several times in the past. But, the way he was acting seemed a bit strange...

Second set is getting a bit loose. Unbeknownst to me at the time, LS's family table is starting into the shots. In hindsight, he has probably partaken before the start of the second set. He's rambling into the mic, getting in my face when I'm trying to focus on my playing, missing his queues, etc... I am getting a bit frustrated, but oh well, things are still basically OK. After the second set, the bar owner gave us the max bonus for the night, since we essentially sold out the place. Everybody's happy.

Second break sees the shots come fast and furious. One of LS's family members is INSISTING on EVERYONE at their table having shots.

LS obliges.

Third set is a bit of a trainwreck. LS is stumbling around on stage, slurring his words, making incoherent statements into the mic, totally f'ing up his lines and missing his queues all over the place. He now thinks that he's the star of the show and everyone in the room is there solely to see him, and we are just supporting his wanking. To top it off, his drunk wife yells out that she wants to hear the song that he didn't want to sing in the first set, so of course now he wants to do it. We shut that down quick, thankfully. All of this has the LG and I (just one guitar and me on bass, plus drummer and keys) trying to compensate, sometimes more successfully than others. I thought I had my frustration in check, but I was gobsmacked by his behaviour. What are we, 19 year olds? I spend the rest of the set just trying to hang on, stay focused and get through it. We hit midnight, our time commitment for playing, and I was off the stage as soon I could. Managed to hold my tongue that night, since telling a drunk guy that he's drunk rarely ends well.

So far, this situation is a one off. Up until now we have just played venues where only beer / wine were served. Seems that LS needs to stay away from venues that serve hard liquor. It may be the charitable thing to give him another chance, but I really didn't like having to compensate for his unprofessionalism. In my books, if you can't tow your own weight, then I'm not going to carry you... Will be making a general statement at some point about the fact that we need to treat gigs like work, and not cross the line with alcohol consumption.

Not sure how to word it so that LS doesn't get his back up. Will word it so that it's in keeping with my signature here, but also want to make sure the message gets through...

How would you all handle it? Or, how have you handled similar situations in the past?

grr... senior citizens acting like teenagers... WTAF?!?

These days, everybody's got a video recorder in their pocket. You should have recorded the egregious performance and played it back for him later, just to let him see how terrible he was when drunk.

If he's not an alcoholic, and has an ounce of pride in what he's doing, that probably would have been enough to ensure no hijinks in the future.

 

[nomaj]

Did the club owner make money that night with all the liquor flowing? If so, he probably loves your band, drunk singer or not.

Serious question: If you don't want to work with a drinking singer, do you have someone who can take his place?
If so, then you have options, if you don't care to continue on with him in the band. If not... well... people in the audience pay attention to the singer, not the bass player.

 

[JimmyM]

Let it go. If this is the only time it happened, it's not that big a deal.

 

[Wisebass]

Hi lat

LS has a table of family members at the gig

Looks like they thought it was only their family party.

So far, this situation is a one off.

Talk! A gig in a venue is not your family' s private houseparty

where you can be guest and bandmember at the same time!

I was about a full page into this saga before I figured out what “LS” meant, carry on.

LS + LS => LS => LS!!!!!


LS = Lead singer; Lotsa shots; Lost singer; Late singer


greetings


Wise(b)ass

 

[54321BASSOFF]

leave if it's not your gig and there's more to it; work with it if it's worth it; maybe there was another reason he drank a lot that day; cartharsis is not always bad; i saw GG Allin, Dee Dee Ramone, Johnny Thunders and others in the midst of their abuse; rock n' roll is a forum attractive to many living on the edge; Elvis did drugs but also sang beautiful Gospel music; talk to him and with your band; good luck

 

[54321BASSOFF]

Me too! I poured myself a bourbon just now

yep

 

[themickster]

Addicts say that they will stop when confronted but will go on feeding the addiction. His family are part of the problem in pushing the drink on him. The ways to stop it are to play dry bars or drop him. Get him when he is sober and tell him strongly what he did when drunk and how it wrecked the gig. Then chuck him out. I've had to do that with an addict in my life. It made him stop.

 

[lat]

this one is a tough one...I guess what I'm wondering and I've only read the first page so maybe there is an update, but...how does he feel..I mean it's possible that he knows he made a mistake, and feels really bad about it..I can't imagine he feels good about his performance. He HAS to know that it wasn't good and hasn't said anything yet or there has been no communication since the gig, and maybe he will admit and maybe even apologize for his transgression..you said yourself that it hasn't happened before...I think that its possible that all this "prepared to walk" and impending doom talk is a little premature..

I get it that if its a continuing situation that something has to be done because the band will suffer, and I've been there..We all know that when a band member introduces mind altering substances into his body, be it alcohol or drugs etc, your ability to play well is almost always limited and sometimes ruined...

I would think that this is a one off, or at the very least a rare occurrence and probably should be something that you all should let go...no harm no foul..sounds to me that an intervention is not required at this time...

Great balanced response Murph, thanks... So far, he's oblivious... I'm not confident that he will twig on what he did...

Regarding the 'prepared to walk' thing, I'm not 'ready to walk', but am prepared to do so if need be... There are some other dynamics at play as well, that are less serious than this incident... Bottom line, I want to do whatever I can to resolve this so that it doesn't happen again, without generating ill will. Not an easy task, in this instance, I fear.

I'm hoping that bringing up the point that we don't have a band policy around drinking at gigs and that we should establish some ground rules, will shine some light on the issue without putting a spotlight on LS...

 

[lat]

Christ guys, 50 something isn’t THAT old. Anyway......

Based on everything else you (op) has said, this sounds like a one off, not just for him, but for his family. That’s the thing about alcohol, have a few too many, particularly is quick succession, and after that all bets are off because your judgement is out the window. Doing shots is a good way to get there quick.

As an outside observer with a fair bit of experience with drunks (family) I can say alcoholics are going to find a way to get drunk regardless of what is on offer, they aren’t picky. I’d venture to say if he’s a drunk, this would have revealed itself already, even at beer/wine only venues. So the fact that this hasn’t happened before, and only seemed to happen because shots were involved (that’s the only variable I have heard), I’d give him a break. People make mistakes, particularly when alcohol is involved.

I’d be up front and frank about my expectations going forward, but I’d be somewhat casual about how I said it.

Damn right 50 something's not that old! lol...

Your last line is basically my take on it too... don't get personal, just lay out what I feel we should do going forward as a band policy, trying to keep things positive.

 

[lat]

Did the club owner make money that night with all the liquor flowing? If so, he probably loves your band, drunk singer or not.

Serious question: If you don't want to work with a drinking singer, do you have someone who can take his place?
If so, then you have options, if you don't care to continue on with him in the band. If not... well... people in the audience pay attention to the singer, not the bass player.

Oh yeah, the bar owner liked us. We sold out the place and there were two large tables that were drinking like fish. The other table was a bunch of regulars though, so that doesn't factor into this equation.

Well, the fact that he was drinking wouldn't have bothered me if he were able to keep it together. What really ticked me off was that he lost the ability to do his job.

Not cool.

He's a good singer and normally has a fairly good stage presence, which is why I was surprised by what happened. If it came to replacing someone, which I hope doesn't happen, it would probably be me leaving, since I am the junior member of the band. If he doesn't change, then I'll walk. I don't want to put in the kind of effort I do into making the band sound as good as possible, just to have it washed away by a few shots of booze.

 

[cnltb]

So, one of the bands I'm in is made of up older guys, two of which are in the health care industry (so are all about taking care of their bodies) and the other three of us are retired. I'm the youngest, at 56. Needless to say, we've all experienced enough of life that I thought we all would be mature enough to know that when we are gigging, we are working, and keeping your alcohol consumption at a manageable level is required. We have played at other venues where this has never been a noticeable issue.

Apparently I was mistaken.

We had a gig last Saturday at a small bar, which can comfortably seat about 80 people. I had previously booked a gig with my other band that went well, so I booked a gig for this band, expecting things to be even better, since the musicianship in this one is of a higher calibre.

LS has a table of family members at the gig. First set went off well. A little bit of weirdness where the LS called some audibles to the set list, but, if his voice can't handle a song that night, then that's cool, nothing we haven't done several times in the past. But, the way he was acting seemed a bit strange...

Second set is getting a bit loose. Unbeknownst to me at the time, LS's family table is starting into the shots. In hindsight, he has probably partaken before the start of the second set. He's rambling into the mic, getting in my face when I'm trying to focus on my playing, missing his queues, etc... I am getting a bit frustrated, but oh well, things are still basically OK. After the second set, the bar owner gave us the max bonus for the night, since we essentially sold out the place. Everybody's happy.

Second break sees the shots come fast and furious. One of LS's family members is INSISTING on EVERYONE at their table having shots.

LS obliges.

Third set is a bit of a trainwreck. LS is stumbling around on stage, slurring his words, making incoherent statements into the mic, totally f'ing up his lines and missing his queues all over the place. He now thinks that he's the star of the show and everyone in the room is there solely to see him, and we are just supporting his wanking. To top it off, his drunk wife yells out that she wants to hear the song that he didn't want to sing in the first set, so of course now he wants to do it. We shut that down quick, thankfully. All of this has the LG and I (just one guitar and me on bass, plus drummer and keys) trying to compensate, sometimes more successfully than others. I thought I had my frustration in check, but I was gobsmacked by his behaviour. What are we, 19 year olds? I spend the rest of the set just trying to hang on, stay focused and get through it. We hit midnight, our time commitment for playing, and I was off the stage as soon I could. Managed to hold my tongue that night, since telling a drunk guy that he's drunk rarely ends well.

So far, this situation is a one off. Up until now we have just played venues where only beer / wine were served. Seems that LS needs to stay away from venues that serve hard liquor. It may be the charitable thing to give him another chance, but I really didn't like having to compensate for his unprofessionalism. In my books, if you can't tow your own weight, then I'm not going to carry you... Will be making a general statement at some point about the fact that we need to treat gigs like work, and not cross the line with alcohol consumption.

Not sure how to word it so that LS doesn't get his back up. Will word it so that it's in keeping with my signature here, but also want to make sure the message gets through...

How would you all handle it? Or, how have you handled similar situations in the past?

grr... senior citizens acting like teenagers... WTAF?!?

Has this happened before?
Most likely I'd lose that lead singer. I'd do it now.
at that age he should know how to handle himself and not to embarrass the band like that.
Get his back up?!?...Get his act together, more like.

 

[Marley's Ghost]

If it's a one off I would just let it go. However....

 

[lat]

Has this happened before?
Most likely I'd lose that lead singer. I'd do it now.
at that age he should know how to handle himself and not to embarrass the band like that.
Get his back up?!?...Get his act together, more like.

No, this is a one off...
he's in his mid-60s... so.... yeah.
That's me, not wanting to make waves... getting better at it lately though. Life is too short.

 

[cnltb]

No, this is a one off...
he's in his mid-60s... so.... yeah.
That's me, not wanting to make waves... getting better at it lately though. Life is too short.

If you don't make waves it may happen again and for that, life really is too short.
He's in his 60s for god's sake!

Good luck!

 

[JimmyM]

Oh yeah, the bar owner liked us. We sold out the place and there were two large tables that were drinking like fish. The other table was a bunch of regulars though, so that doesn't factor into this equation.

Well, the fact that he was drinking wouldn't have bothered me if he were able to keep it together. What really ticked me off was that he lost the ability to do his job.

Not cool.

He's a good singer and normally has a fairly good stage presence, which is why I was surprised by what happened. If it came to replacing someone, which I hope doesn't happen, it would probably be me leaving, since I am the junior member of the band. If he doesn't change, then I'll walk. I don't want to put in the kind of effort I do into making the band sound as good as possible, just to have it washed away by a few shots of booze.

You are grossly overreacting. The gig was a success, it doesn't happen all the time, he's a good singer (and good singers do not grow on trees, despite the amount of non-singing bassists on here who seem to think they do), and it sounds like everyone was fine with it but you.

 

[lat]

You are grossly overreacting. The gig was a success, it doesn't happen all the time, he's a good singer (and good singers do not grow on trees, despite the amount of non-singing bassists on here who seem to think they do), and it sounds like everyone was fine with it but you.

Only my mom calls me Francis.

You may be right. I may be crazy.
But it just may be ...

that because it was a success monetarily doesn't mean it was a success musically. There are some things that are more important than $164 minus my bar tab.

I haven't broached the subject with my bandmates yet, so don't know if they agree or not. They may very well think that I'm over-reacting, but the looks I was getting from the LG on stage told me otherwise. We'll see.

Of course, having said all that, I have also said previously in this thread that I don't want to walk away from this band if I don't have to. Would much rather resolve this positively...

 

[Bander]

Probably just some polite acknowledgement, since its a first time thing, "You were really toasted the other night. Gotta watch those shots I guess." or, "Not sure if that's our kind of venue. There were a lot of drunks. I'm not sure I wanna work up a tight band for folks who are going to be numb to it by the second set." or other hints.

On the otherside, hopefully its a one-time learning experience. I went to a practice once, stopped and picked up a random six pack of beer. No time for supper. Quality whiskey was present. Beer turned out to be very high gravity, girls were delivering shots (open practice), and this long practice turned into a party. I had to be delivered to my house, I didn't remember anything. Thankfully, I was a happier, quiet drunk, and we all laughed about it, but I was truly embarrassed. I never drank more than one beer per set after that, and to this day. Its just not ever going to happen again, at a practice or a gig, I learned my lesson.

 

[Jazz Ad]

Rock'n'roll became sad. I doubt half of the musicians on your setlist ever were sober on stage.

 

[Brad Johnson]

It's a bar, they make money by selling drinks! I'm pretty sure the owners were perfectly happy selling them shot after shot.

And his family didn't make him drink. Unless weapons or blackmail were involved. He might've been trying to save a puppy.

 

[kdogg]

Let it go. If this is the only time it happened, it's not that big a deal.

Couldn’t agree more with the above. You are all adults. Nothing needs to be said or addressed unless it’s happening on a regular basis. Sheesh, you’ve never made the mistake of having to much to drink?