Was there any good punk rock?

[paco weht]

I’ve been listening to mostly punk and hardcore bands since the mid-80’s. That’s 35+ years of also listening to people constantly question the value of the music I enjoy. Imagine how many times in 35 years that someone has explained to me directly that the music, art and culture is meaningless. Sometimes they pose it as a question before dismissing it: “Does this have any merit? OF COURSE IT DOESN’T”

Right here in this thread, the entire premise seems to be framed around casting doubts about my motivations for going to see bands that I am curious about, or assuming that reminiscing about good times somehow negates the experience. Does anyone try to start conversations with you this way about things that are important to you? Do you think your reaction would change after hearing the same basic junk repeated over and over by people who weren’t even interested in the answer?

Honestly, if you wanted to learn about an under appreciated genre of music, you could frame the query in a way that isn’t loaded with contempt and maybe try to invite some enthusiasm. I realize that isn’t your style, though.

+1

There is styles of music that I don't like. Yet I can't see any reason to start a thread like "This music is BS, right? and people going to those concerts doesn't have a clue, right? Am I right? "

 

[Matt B]

Regardless of if you agree with the perspectives or not, many punk bands offer some of the best storytelling and social commentary of any genre. And you will find many incredible musicians there too. Value is about perspective.

 

[Bass Jones]

Coincidentally, I was reading this essay about the value of classical music earlier today (written by a classical fan.) What's Wrong with Classical Music

There have even been similar discussions about the value of jazz to young people (gasp, the horror!) I guess every genre gets to that age.

I don't think OP set out to troll people (although I could be wrong.) Opinionated discussions can be fun.

 

[Dynacord]

Wow! That's a throwback, Rat Music for Rat People - that was Paul Rat (RIP) DJ, promoter, booker (for The Deaf Club, The On Broadway, Geary Temple and others) manager - Dead Kennedys most notably but a lot of others, too. I shared a loft space with him in San Francisco 1982-84. Crazy times. No money but thanks to him I was able to see a billion shows - probably 4 or 5 a week if not more as I could get into The On Broadway and The Mabuhay Gardens for free - didn't have TV and no internet... (and often would wake up to one band or another asleep in the front room...) plus a lot of the DK shows (which were very political including outside the Democratic Convention at Moscone Center and the Rock Against Reagan shows - and Jello had run for mayor - came in third).

The scene was a lot more diverse than I think many people stereotype it as being. I also think of bands who were not really 'punk' per se but it opened the door for and were playing the same venues, etc. The Call was a good local example.

 

[prowla]

Punk was just another fad with a clothing fashion and some artiness attached.
There were some good bits and it got people going to gigs.

 

[BazzaBass]

I admit that I used to love the Ramones when I was a kid, but I don't really get most of it beyond that.

Just because something caused a big sensation doesn't mean that it had value. And it seems like the people who went to the concerts were always trying to find some new experience to make them happy. And it never really happened if they still talk about the past.

What do you think.

I recently re-discovered punk via Apple Music (who would have thought?). Somehow I had missed Wayne County and the Electric Chairs. Outrageous but gutsy. And so much fun.

 

[bolophonic]

Me, I think this is the very embodiment of punk too. I think my favourite band

My favorite thing about this type of music is that you can go your whole life chasing threads and still stumble upon something great that you missed. I’ve never even heard of this band before.

Fair enough. But it was a comment that often what are seen as important bands in a genre can deny being part of that genre.

I have always dismissed that as deliberately contrarian hair-splitting. It is also one of the reasons I stopped listening to what the bands say once the record stops spinning.

 

[bolophonic]

Wow! That's a throwback, Rat Music for Rat People - that was Paul Rat (RIP) DJ, promoter, booker (for The Deaf Club, The On Broadway, Geary Temple and others) manager - Dead Kennedys most notably but a lot of others, too. I shared a loft space with him in San Francisco 1982-84. Crazy times. No money but thanks to him I was able to see a billion shows - probably 4 or 5 a week if not more as I could get into The On Broadway and The Mabuhay Gardens for free - didn't have TV and no internet... (and often would wake up to one band or another asleep in the front room...) plus a lot of the DK shows (which were very political including outside the Democratic Convention at Moscone Center and the Rock Against Reagan shows - and Jello had run for mayor - came in third).

The scene was a lot more diverse than I think many people stereotype it as being. I also think of bands who were not really 'punk' per se but it opened the door for and were playing the same venues, etc. The Call was a good local example.

I am actually super stoked to learn more context for those Rat Music albums. I was always into the compilation albums as a teen. The early 80’s SF scene has always been a fascination of mine.

 

[Dynacord]

I am actually super stoked to learn more context for those Rat Music albums. I was always into the compilation albums as a teen. The early 80’s SF scene has always been a fascination of mine.

Paul was an odd guy but pivotal to the whole SF scene. He opened a lot of doors for me personally but not someone I would have wanted as an enemy - I remember he had a dispute with a band I won't mention, they all lived in a warehouse and Paul made up about a dozen keys which he then gave to some of the most lowlife types hanging out around the Mab and told them if they ever needed a place to crash, no matter the time, to just let themselves in....
I felt like I knew him well but at the same time, even having lived as roommates for quite some time and having gone to lots of events and meals, etc together, I couldn't even tell something as basic as what his sexual orientation might have been. He was sort of an enigma but that scene would not have been at all the same without him.

 

[zubrycky]

This thread reminds me of this video.

 

[foal30]

@Michedelic

Hey that was a pretty good post back there

Here in Aotearoa Punk was embraced almost into mainstream, it was very exciting. We had Reggae heavily here to

Lots of Kiwis started playing because of Punk and Reggae. I’m not saying it was great music but it’s great that people are playing their own music. If that makes sense

I reckon that’s one of Punk’s best things.

And as before some of my favorite bands are clearly influenced by Punk Rock.

 

[zubrycky]

Marky Ramone was Dust's drummer way before he joined the Ramones (and he played on Richard Hell's Blank Generation too).





Great drumming, IMHO.

 

[zubrycky]

Klaus Flouride is no slouch.

He's one of my main influences.

 

[zubrycky]

Good point. But I think there are better ways to deal with these issues than pure rage. And it never really makes things any better in the end.

That is really the one thing that I would love to get across to people.

I get your point but, in the case of punk rock, it's only music and artistic expression. It's way different than literally beating the brat with a baseball bat.

Anger is an energy.

 

[Jeff Sarsippius]

I think most “Punk Rock” musicians didn’t even consider themselves part of said genre…Johnny Rotten said he hated the nomenclature; he thought they were playing Rock.

The anti-establishment attitude is in any genre, and I think that in itself is what as we know “Punk” was meant to symbolize. If we look at the groups that wore the genre name on their sleeves, of course there are great bands (in no order of timeline nor greatness): Dead Kennedys, Green Day, Rancid, Minor Threat, Black Flag, Charged GBH, The Clash, The Damned, Bad Brains, Hüsker Dü, The Offspring…to name a VERY FEW.

 

[factory presets]

Here in Aotearoa Punk was embraced almost into mainstream, it was very exciting. We had Reggae heavily here to

Lots of Kiwis started playing because of Punk and Reggae. I’m not saying it was great music but it’s great that people are playing their own music. If that makes sense

I reckon that’s one of Punk’s best things.

And as before some of my favorite bands are clearly influenced by Punk Rock.

Ramones. Logan Campbell Centre. My goodness.

 

[foal30]

Ramones. Logan Campbell Centre. My goodness.

What bands were you in?

 

[retslock]

As I’ve previously said here, there is no point in criticising style. All you have is an opinion and you know how common they are. There is no Grand Wazoo who will validate yours. Not all music has to be art or even tries to be. Music can be so many things, comment, confessional, experimental and so much more. It can also be just plain meaningless fun.
Merit can be attributed to competence and execution or not, but style is no man’s land when it comes to judgement. You like or you don’t. Move on.

 

[bolophonic]

As I’ve previously said here, there is no point in criticising style. All you have is an opinion and you know how common they are. There is no Grand Wazoo who will validate yours. Not all music has to be art or even tries to be. Music can be so many things, comment, confessional, experimental and so much more. It can also be just plain meaningless fun.
Merit can be attributed to competence and execution or not, but style is no man’s land when it comes to judgement. You like or you don’t. Move on.

BOOM!

 

[bolophonic]