The argument for (or) against mixing cabs - example: 115 & 410

[StayLow]

Jaco used two 361 rigs most of the time And Billy, I believe, uses separate amps for each type of cab, mitigating a lot of potential problems.

Which sort-of proves my point. There are so many variables in the real world that nothing measured in theory or solo'd in acoustically ideal chambers makes much absolute difference ... but diligent practice you can hear every time in any mix.

It's good to know some gear theory. No sense cooking weak amps with 2 ohm loads for example, but most of this stuff is really just snobbery amd gear-flipping rationalization. Pretty much what the whole site is about - time theft while at the day job.

I've seldom if ever mixed cabs, but if it's good enough for Flea it's good enough for you or me.

Sheehan and Jaco would be inspirational legends if all they ever had was SX and Behringer.

 

[Gravedigger Dav]

True, but not at the rate it's been changing over the last 20 years. When I was a kid, 100 degree days in my area of Florida in summer were rare. Today they're commonplace. And for two winters in a row, my city didn't have a single freezing day, and we always get a few. I don't say this as a political statement, either. To me it's got zip to do with politics. I will agree with you that it's hard to prove 100%, but I'd rather err on the side of caution.

2 winters or even 20 years in 4 1/2 billion years is hardly a representative sample. In the mid 1970s they were predicting another ice age. What did we puny little humans do to put us at the brink on an ice age and how did we turn it around?

 

[CL400Peavey]

Flat lander logic at its best. Probably some celestial sphere belief as well.

 

[lomo]

I dunno who "they" were in the 1970s, but I suspect "they" were not the crushing, overwhelming majority of the scientific community. If you want information, I recommend the NASA web site, or the journal Climate or the US Nat Academy of Science.

 

[ThisBass]

cause and effect with climate warming delays with around 2-3 decades. Logic conclusions by uninformed folks should be taken with lots of care.
Of course the "effect" of climate warming for the next 2-3 decades is known but not published by mass media to the mean populace, for good reason.

 

[BogeyBass]

one more time.

every speaker has a different phase response at different frequencies.

when you run unmatched speakers full range with no crossover.

the unmatched phase response will cause peaks or valleys in the signal.

all of which will cause large amounts of amplifier power to be wasted. or drivers with less sensitivity to not be heard or blown. making them as useless as arguing with people that never listen or when people are wrong continue to argue invalid facts.

which waste a lot of time energy and money

 

[Korladis]

I'm fairly new here at TB and run across so many commentary and advice against running a 1x15 & a 4x10 cabinet together.. it's as if you're playing on a Ouija board with a baptist pastor or something that it's ridiculous.. I've played bass since 1988 and at a semi-pro level since at least 2001 with over 600 shows to date.. I've mixed cabs of 2x15 and 2x10 together, 4x10 and 1x15 together etc... all with good results.

Pro's play the same... here below are a few examples but maybe you guys know something some of us don't... please try to explain the argument for (or) against mixing cabs. Thanks -

Flea of RHCP uses three Gallien-Krueger 2001RB amps, one controls the other two as slaves. The amps run into three Gallien-Krueger 410 cabinets and three 115 cabs, all running. There are two additional 2001RB amps in the rack, one is used when Klinghoffer plays bass, and the other is simply a backup.


View attachment 795803 View attachment 795804

Just before heading out on this 2011 Mars Volta tour, Alderete switched his amp setup from his old standby SVT-VR heads and cabs to the newer PF-500 heads, which power PF-115 1x15 and PF-210 2x10 cabinets.

View attachment 795807

info courtesy of : Invalid Link Removed

Nobody cares who endorses the combination.

 

[Korladis]

So explain how a FOH system that has 18s, 15s, 10s, and horns make any sound at all.
Old wives tales. I ran 1x15 and 2x10 for many years. It was a great sounding rig.

Crossovers. That's how.

 

[Korladis]

That's how I'm thinking as well - I'm not a sound engineer, I just know that my rigs over the years have usually been the mixed bunch and have never blown out, farted or any of the things that some of the TB community are so against.. maybe I've been lucky? but I'm inclined to think that it is an old wives tale.

No kidding.

 

[/\/\3phist0]

According to aerodynamic science, a bumble bee can't fly.

Bumblebees Can't Fly

 

[Korladis]

I can read all of the threads.. but what this tells me is that science and the opinion of some TB'ers is that when Pro's like Flea runs 3 15" cabs and 4 4x10" cabs at every show, he is blowing up his cabs and sounding like a turd - or maybe the laws of acoustic science cease to exist when he's on stage.. idk - I posted an article and pictures to try to prove what is being done in a real world situation

No, it's that the 15"s aren't really contributing that much to the sound, and that he could probably sound even better with matching cabs. Doesn't mean he is necessarily blowing up drivers. Also most of his sound is through the PA.

 

[Korladis]

It was a great idea. I tried each cab separately first. Then I tried both, It added a lot to the quality of the sound, so I bought both.

Because it was louder. Our brains tend to interpret louder as "better" and "fuller."

 

[Korladis]

You guys, I gotcha I really do, all I'm saying is I see the a lot of biasing against mixing cabs of different sized drivers and I get it.. a 410 cab moves 40" of air as opposed to a 215 cab moving 30" of air, one will sound louder over the other, will be felt to hit harder than the other.. I get it.. the 15's produce lower frequencies usually than say 10's do, but then again good cabinet design contributes as well...

For my experience and it's been a long while for me.. I've never been told by a Soundman or a fan on the floor that the bass sounded horrible, I have never blew out a speaker or head, I must have had the best of luck in this regard.

When I did a search on this I found the one article I posted that was just one out of 400,000 google pops up.. I know bass guys run through a house system or live sound rig..

The bolded reveals that no, you don't get it.

 

[Korladis]

Any decent amp will have some kind of balance control that allows you to compensate a difference in power rating.

I've never seen any such thing.

 

[Korladis]

So, I have a 410... Is my future path paved with choices of 410s only?

No. You can also ditch it and use 215 cabs.

 

[DukeLeJeune]

my "ideal" cab looks like the following

410 due to "distinct" speaker coupling
SPL 1watt/1 meter: 103 dB
f3 45Hz...

Every now and then I come across something that makes me dust off the old slip-stick (slide-rule) and do some interpolating.

Fifteen cubic feet internal volume seems to be what's required to deliver 103 dB efficiency along with -3 dB at 45 Hz.

I need to find a more optimistic slip-stick.

 

[tfer]

I've never seen any such thing.

Hartke LH1000.

 

[tfer]

No kidding.

Maybe he's not, but I'm fairly certain that Ampeg and Hartke have access to a couple of them, and both support mixing driver sizes.

I'll take their word over those of amateur scientists on a message board.

 

[/\/\3phist0]

Maybe he's not, but I'm fairly certain that Ampeg and Hartke have access to a couple of them, and both support mixing driver sizes.

I'll take their word over those of amateur scientists on a message board.

you mean Loud and Samson?

 

[tfer]

you mean Loud and Samson?

Sure, because both subsidiaries are so hands off...

I mean, if there's anybody who doesn't give a s**t about his product, it's Larry Hartke.

(Sarcasm off)